Real Estate Crash thread

[MontuckyFried]

Ok, so can anyone explain how the heck this is a legal practice? http://www.trulia.com/blog/carl_medf...ly_low_list_pr

I've dealt with this stupid lowball issue several times now in the last few months. There was a duplex I wanted. The price was reasonable (about 10k below the others), but had tenants and was absolutely trashed. However, I loved the location and was willing to fix it up to get that location. I offered what I thought was a fair offer (about 10k below list) on BOTH units they had for sale. We put in an offer and it took almost a month to hear back from the seller's agent. Although it had been on the market for like a year, all of a sudden there were magically like 5 offers on it? Yeah, right. Next thing you know, we're told we've been outbid, and to re-offer. We upped our price to asking, and really didn't want to spend more than that since the place was a total craphole. We weren't about to go way above realistic comps in the area. We were supposedly outbid again, and were instructed to submit our "last best offer." Instead we chose to walk away.

Now fast forward a few months, and my wife and I find what appears to be the perfect house for us. Has the right square footage and features that we've been wanting. Has a seemingly great price. Still not exactly cheap, but comparatively so. Realtor.com and trulia show the price as being "reduced!" Great, right? Nope. Made an appt to go look at it, and my realtor calls me back saying the seller's agent said it supposedly all of a sudden has an official offer on it (after being on the market for like 500+ days) that happened this week, and that they really won't be selling it for their list price, but will rather be demanding no less than almost 100k MORE than what they have it listed at. I was told that it was pretty much a bogus listing price, and was only there to stir up a frenzy and a bidding war. Once again, a seller's agent lists an artificially low price. Oh yeah, and the seller's agent is the same scumbag we were dealing with before! Same agent is apparently notorious in the area for doing this. She's listed another condo in my current complex at like 75k (around 30-50k less than market).

How is this allowed? Can I make an official complaint to a realtors association? Seller's agents like that are really screwing things up for the buyer's agents, and quite frankly screwing with local markets. My realtor has been quite frustrated dealing with these clowns.

Here's how it goes all too often:
Buyer: "I love X house, and got approved for a mortgage for the asking price! Yippee!"
Buyer's agent: "Fantastic. We'll submit an offer today!"
Seller's agent (3-5 weeks later): "Oh, JK! We actually want like 100k more than what we said the price was on every website and in the local listings. You're pathetic offer is of no significance to my client. Put in your highest best offer or piss off."
Buyer: "WTF just happened?"

[4matic]

Ok, so can anyone explain how the heck this is a legal practice?

Why would it be illegal? RE has always been a whore's game but that's just giving whore's a bad name. Move on to the next one. Somebody will take your money.

[Benny Profane]

So, really, just walk. What the fuck do you think all of this propaganda is all about about housing coming back, and "it's a seller's market" all of a sudden is about? You're dealing with total scumbags, and that's what you get. But, if you play their game, you're as much at fault as they are. Because, you know, they used your offers against some other poor fool.

There's nothing illegal about what they're doing, and, trust me, if you complain to some realtor's association, you're going to give some people a big fucking laugh.

[MashedPotatoes]

that article is from 2009 and Benny's right, just walk away.

I'm in Silicon Valley and it's a crazy seller's market right now with such low inventory. Buyers have it very rough here at the moment. I'm in the middle of selling and trading up so it's been a very interesting couple of weeks.

Looking out the front door, I would say the crash is over but everything's local I guess.

[schuss]

Wait, you mean an industry of salespeople with minimal licensing requirements is practicing lowball/bait and switch tactics? I'm shocked, I tell you, shocked.

[Hugh Conway]

Looking out the front door, I would say the crash is over but everything's local I guess.

Uhhhhhh - there's still a shit-ton of people underwater in "silicon valley"

[AdironRider]

Thats been par for the course for decades.

I like to flip it and turn it into "what do you mean that underpriced house has multiple offers" like you stumbled upon the listing of the century on the public MLS....

Seriously, this is no way someones fault. Use your head and either walk away, or pay it, but you are seriously pissed because some lowball property is giving you the run around.

Its like people never heard the ol "if its to good to be true" mantra.

[Benny Profane]

http://mhanson.com/archives/1147




"Where Escape Velocity Resides

In single family housing specifically, the 20+ MILLION mortgage’d homeowners without the equity to sell (pay a Realtor 5% and put 10% to 20% down on a new house) and rebuy (good credit and stable employment) is a perfect example of how much de-leveraging still must occur. This group in a negative and ‘effective’ negative equity position throughout history has always been the sectors largest cohort of demand and supply. Now they are all dead to the market; they are zombies. They must be replaced in order for sales volume and prices to increase. In times of massive stimulus other cohorts show up to fill in some of the hole — private and insti investors for example — but they don’t have the numbers, capital, or staying power to sustainably replace the 10s of millions of zombie homeowners that 6, 16, and 60 years ago were the sectors drivers."

[Sirshredalot]

http://mhanson.com/archives/1147




"Where Escape Velocity Resides

In single family housing specifically, the 20+ MILLION mortgage’d homeowners without the equity to sell (pay a Realtor 5% and put 10% to 20% down on a new house) and rebuy (good credit and stable employment) is a perfect example of how much de-leveraging still must occur. This group in a negative and ‘effective’ negative equity position throughout history has always been the sectors largest cohort of demand and supply. Now they are all dead to the market; they are zombies. They must be replaced in order for sales volume and prices to increase. In times of massive stimulus other cohorts show up to fill in some of the hole — private and insti investors for example — but they don’t have the numbers, capital, or staying power to sustainably replace the 10s of millions of zombie homeowners that 6, 16, and 60 years ago were the sectors drivers."

Benny -

You can take a short position on residential real estate in a number of different ways. Do you have your money where your mouth is?

[MashedPotatoes]

Uhhhhhh - there's still a shit-ton of people underwater in "silicon valley"

True but they are less underwater every day as prices continue to climb here. It's a unique market, I'm interested to see where things are a year from now.

[Benny Profane]

Benny -

You can take a short position on residential real estate in a number of different ways. Do you have your money where your mouth is?

Dude, please, it's a roof over your head. Not a bet on black.

edit: and, of course, don't fight the Fed.

[MontuckyFried]

Its like people never heard the ol "if its to good to be true" mantra.

I understand that principle, and thus haven't even bothered inquiring on other certain properties, but seems that on a short sale or foreclosure, PLUS being on the market for a year or two, AND being a total dump, that being 5-10% under comparable listings wouldn't seem out of the question, right? That's why I checked into these places in the first place. Seemed like good prices, but not too good to be true prices.

But in short, yes...I'm walking away...again. I'm not in the mood to artificially drive the price up for some other poor sucker. My realtor just e-mailed me the comps of what's been selling in that neighborhood, and their new "cheap" asking price is actually right in line with what homes have been realistically going for over the last few months. They're smoking crack if they want 100k more. I hope all the supposed buyers back out. That actually happened on one of the two units in the duplex I mentioned earlier. One of the sides has closed since, but the other is back on the market. Everyone backed out or something fell through. The agent (and seller?) got greedy and missed out on getting both sold at the same time in one easy transaction to me. Screw 'em.

[Hugh Conway]

Benny -

You can take a short position on residential real estate in a number of different ways. Do you have your money where your mouth is?

There's a difference between thinking somethings going to go to shit and being able to successfully execute a profitable strategy for making money on something going to shit.

I mean, we'll take Silicon Valley, which has an unemployment rate between 6.5-7.5% and plenty of underemployed. There won't be another tech bubble (at least not of the 2000 kind that made lots of people really rich overnight - the VC industry has seen to that), so where's the growth going to come from to deleverage all the underwaterpeople (a decent number of whom are 10-15 from retirement, if not sooner if forced by another downturn). "less underwater" is a funny concept with a $1million home that's now worth $700k (up from $600k!) and 25 years left on a 30 year fixed.

I say that because I don't see a strong economic case for productivity growth in the current Silicon Valley or anywhere else in the US really absent some Southern Manufacturing towns stealing business from the North. Absent that, little real wage growth, so it's just bubble juju building homes and who the fuck wants to live in Dublin or Livenomore or any of the other shitholes that got built up?

[powder11]

So, really, just walk. What the fuck do you think all of this propaganda is all about about housing coming back, and "it's a seller's market" all of a sudden is about? You're dealing with total scumbags, and that's what you get. But, if you play their game, you're as much at fault as they are. Because, you know, they used your offers against some other poor fool.

There's nothing illegal about what they're doing, and, trust me, if you complain to some realtor's association, you're going to give some people a big fucking laugh.

Kind of like buying a car, eh Benny? You want to simply buy a car, but the car salesman hasn't done his job properly if he doesn't dick you around on price for a solid month or so. Same with RE. All they're really looking for is the sucker of the day who won't cunt up a deal.

[Benny Profane]

Kind of like buying a car, eh Benny? You want to simply buy a car, but the car salesman hasn't done his job properly if he doesn't dick you around on price for a solid month or so. Same with RE. All they're really looking for is the sucker of the day who won't cunt up a deal.

Oh, for sure. But this is much worse, because there is so much emotion involved, and they're fucking with at least two people, and playing entire families against each other. That's possibly the one big reason I still rent. I'm not married, and don't have that nester next to me insisting on that roof for her decoration thing.

[cramer]

cramer's house just went down on zillow

haha maybe in your market. up 4K more this month. I was just replying that im not suprised. I'm in an area where all the inventory is gone, they are building new houses now. Lucky me i guess.

[4matic]

The former owner now tenant of my BoA short sale purchase is moving out after 7 months. I let him out of the lease and gave him the oven to make his wife happy. Yeah, I'm a nice guy. There is no damage deposit because I had no way to do an inventory. I'll get my first look this weekend!

Anyway.. Time to fix the place up which is the interesting part. I hired a Chinese contractor who barely speaks english and NONE of his crew do. But, I've seen his work and he has never failed an inspection. I do have a translator which helps:



I'm hoping to keep the work under $15k which includes paint, minor landscaping, some concrete. I'll post some photos of the work and crew.

[up an down]

The former owner now tenant of my BoA short sale purchase is moving out after 7 months. I let him out of the lease and gave him the oven to make his wife happy. Yeah, I'm a nice guy. There is no damage deposit because I had no way to do an inventory. I'll get my first look this weekend!

Anyway.. Time to fix the place up which is the interesting part. I hired a Chinese contractor who barely speaks english and NONE of his crew do. But, I've seen his work and he has never failed an inspection. I do have a translator which helps:



I'm hoping to keep the work under $15k which includes paint, minor landscaping, some concrete. I'll post some photos of the work and crew.

i think you need to have your translator make a plea to Ullr and post photos. we've all seen painted walls and concrete

[Tips^Up]

Things are getting crazy around Eagle County. A month ago, I bid $177,000 (over 5% above) on 105 year old house listed for $168,000. Closed today for $186,400 cash.

Next one under $300k on the market listed for $249,900. I bid $250, someone else bid about $20k more. There's no supply at all in this price range (ie- shit people can afford post-bust) but it appears we've got a good ol' fashioned irrational market on our hands! If you own a $100k old house in Eagle now, list it for $150, sell it for $170!

[4matic]

Got my work estimate for the rental repairs well under budget. Furnace and ducting took two days. They work fast.

装修内容与报价（第一期室内装修部分）：
• 卫生间的装修：
• 修理浴缸的漏水；
• 清理窗户，如外窗板有烂侧更换；
• 重新处理墙面；
• 浴缸周边的防水胶重新处理；
• 价格：人工费： $800.00;
• 新装暖气系统的装修工程：
• 新装暖气机在天花板上；
• 每个卧室和卫生间各新装1个出风口；
• 考虑到厨房和客厅面积较大且门窗较多保温较差侧新装3个出风口；
• 价格：包工包料：$2,800.00;
• 封掉地上的暖气出风口的装修工程：
• 封掉地上的暖气出风口；
• 尽量寻找相同的地板进行修补；
• 表面上色处理，尽量与旧地板相似；
• 价格：$500.00;
• 更换三扇外门的装修工程：
• 更换前总门、侧门及后门，
• 前门为仿木纹的合成材料的门，其他二扇是用铁皮的防盗门；
• 后门的地上的部分地板要换及油 漆；
• 侧门的边框有烂也要换；
• 价格：$1,000.00;
• 室内整体油漆的装修工程：
• 清理墙面；
• 修补墙缝；
• 上底油；
• 上面油，厨房客厅1种颜色、过道卫生间1种颜色、三个卧室1种颜色，所有天花板不油漆；
• 价格：人工费：$1,200.00;
• 室外整体油漆的装修工程：
• 用高压水枪清洗所有墙面；
• 修补墙缝；
• 上底油；
• 上面油；（包括后院的小仓库）
• 价格：人工费：$1,500.00;
• 朝马路的2扇窗加装花式窗边：包工包料：$400.00;
• 其他的装修工程：
• 修洗碗机：免人工费；
• 换调光开关；免人工费；
• 清理窗户：免人工费；如修理窗要花很多工的话再另行协商；
九、家修复浴缸的工程：人工费：$800.00;
装修工程的总价：$9,000.00;
装修的工程期限：10个工作日

[liv2ski]

How the fuck did you post that^^^^^

[powder11]

Oh, for sure. But this is much worse, because there is so much emotion involved, and they're fucking with at least two people, and playing entire families against each other. That's possibly the one big reason I still rent. I'm not married, and don't have that nester next to me insisting on that roof for her decoration thing.

I think you're just cheap as fuck. Not that there's anything wrong with that!

[Benny Profane]

Not really. I've been spending a lot lately. New car, new skis, new boots, new bike, trip to Europe. Worries me a little. But, not on a dwelling.

[iceman]

• 价格：包工包料：$2,800.00;

Dude you are getting jobbed, 价格：包工包料 shouldn't be more than 2 grand.

[Hugh Conway]

the colon is the is happy ending, worth at least $800