Seattle Smoking Ban

[Art Shirk]

Anyone else think this is ridiculous? I can understand helping out bartenders and wait staff with second hand smoke issues, but the whole "remain 25 feet from doorways and windows" is irrational. Any other lawyers out there believe that this is nowhere near the least restrictive means of carrying out this legitimate purpose?

I smoked the hell out of my lungs at the Nightlite Wednesday night and made the bartender pull that smoke from my cold cancerous hands at 12:01 am. I then proceeded to the Paragon and smoked another just for good measure and controversy.

sorry: NSR, my uber-jongness precludes me from knowing how to edit the thread title.

[Nate Dogg]

Please elaborate on the whole remain 25 feet from doorways and windows...are you saying that the smoking ban in Seattle is a 24/7 and those who choose to smoke outside are not allowed to smoke within that proximity of an establishments doors/windows?

If that is the case, I for one can see the reasoning behind it. There is a 24/7 smoking ban here in Athens at UGA, so those who choose to smoke do so outside the bars and restaurants. Unfortunately for me, I was a bouncer and worked the door at one of the bars in town, and spent my nights in a cloud of second-hand smoke because all the smokers would literally surround me...not fun. Regardless though, smoking bans are killing the business in bars, and I for one don't mind smoking in bars even though I'm a non-smoker. I expect bars and pool halls to be smokey. After all, I'm not exactly doing my body a favor when I go to the bar.

[LAN]

I don't think the ban itself is ridiculous. The 25 ft rule? Pretty random.

[element1]

Welcome to the new west, sin marlboro man. As an ashamed smoker (cough cough) I can totally understand banning smoking in most places, but I think banning it in bars is a little rediculous. Leave it up to to the owner and clientel, surely in big western cities there is room for both.

dude, where's our chicks?

[nutcase]

I think its ridiculous -and I shuold mention that its the entire state of Washington not just Seattle that has this now. I am a non smoker and i definately dislike smoke- but I like the fact that there can be "nice" bars that don't allow smoking and seedier bars that allow it. Allowing smoking just seems to set a good atmosphere for a bar. Gives it a down to Earth feel maybe. But anyways- ITS A FREE COUNTY - or so i thought....

[Arty50]

When California first implemented its smoking ban, I was against it. I really didn't feel that the government had a right to get involved in this kind of business. Now, I'm completely for it. Especially when seeing the contrasts from living in a border town. When you go to a bar in Nevada, you come home absolutely reeking of smoke. When you got to a bar in CA, the worst you smell is the alcohol some drunk moron spilt on you. There's really no comparison. If your clothes reek that bad after being in a bar for a couple of hours, then just imagine the hit your lungs are taking.

You wanna smoke? Do it outside. Keep that shit away from me. I shouldn't have to pay the price for your filthy habit. Whether that price is fucked up lungs or a dry cleaning bill.

[LAN]

You wanna smoke? Do it outside. Keep that shit away from me. I shouldn't have to pay the price for your filthy habit. Whether that price is fucked up lungs or a dry cleaning bill.

Wanna be my roommate?

[Nate Dogg]

You wanna smoke? Do it outside. Keep that shit away from me. I shouldn't have to pay the price for your filthy habit. Whether that price is fucked up lungs or a dry cleaning bill.

Very good points made Arty...I guess I've just come to expect it in bars & pool halls. I will say that at most other places I absolutely can't stand it. There is a strictly enforced no smoking ban in my car, I will tell you that. I allowed a friend to smoke in it once with the window cracked on a 4hr ride to the hill....it took over a month to get rid of that nasty odor

[garwhal]

I say kudos. Where I go to school, people crowd in the fucking doorway of the courtyard and start up a puff fest. I am all for their right to smoke, hell, I even grab a cig periodically when I am having no luck with the ladies after about 10 beers, but their little party makes all the smoke gather under the overarching doorway. 25 feet away, that shit would sail up into space. But these little smoke fucks are scared to death of the sun, afraid they might get healthy, and insist on crowding in the doorway.

At a bar, maybe diff. But I say get a little ways away. I am just pissed at smokers right now. They just annoy me when they are crowded in that fucking archway, thats all.

as for the least restrictive means for a legitimate purpose--what the f is that? Since when do smokers get a heightened standard of review? If I recall correctly, and I may not, since I only took a law class in high school, that shit should be rational basis review. Sounds rational to me--get the fuck out of the doorway, assholes.

-Lawdog

[kush1]

All i have to say is i cant wait to move to tahoe to go to bars and not have to shower before i go to bed..............if im to drunk to shower my sheets smell like smoke for about 2-3 days............. i ussuallyy just try to not sleep here like tonight...........im out

edit: i used to wake up smelling like smoke in my 5th floor dorm room becuase people smoked out front...........and that sucked ass

[bigtrubs]

You wanna smoke? Do it outside. Keep that shit away from me. I shouldn't have to pay the price for your filthy habit. Whether that price is fucked up lungs or a dry cleaning bill.

I totally agree. I don't even bother to go out to the bar with friends when I go home to AB (where smoking inside is permitted) cause I can't handle that rank smell as I've been away from it living in BC for 4 years now. I especially hate walking outside behind someone that smokes cause you totally catch every single puff of smoke they exhale RIGHT in the face.

[Art Shirk]

I say kudos. Where I go to school, people crowd in the fucking doorway of the courtyard and start up a puff fest. I am all for their right to smoke, hell, I even grab a cig periodically when I am having no luck with the ladies after about 10 beers, but their little party makes all the smoke gather under the overarching doorway. 25 feet away, that shit would sail up into space. But these little smoke fucks are scared to death of the sun, afraid they might get healthy, and insist on crowding in the doorway.

At a bar, maybe diff. But I say get a little ways away. I am just pissed at smokers right now. They just annoy me when they are crowded in that fucking archway, thats all.

as for the least restrictive means for a legitimate purpose--what the f is that? Since when do smokers get a heightened standard of review? If I recall correctly, and I may not, since I only took a law class in high school, that shit should be rational basis review. Sounds rational to me--get the fuck out of the doorway, assholes.

-Lawdog

true. smokers are not a suspect class and i would have to assume that it would fall under the rational basis constitutional analysis (i do real estate and IP not con law). however, even under this standard, i think the law falls short. the law may be rationally related to the purpose but it borders on arbitrary. if i recall correctly, you cannot be within 20-25 feet of a doorway or window when smoking (someone can clarify if they know the specifics). a window? makes little sense. why not say that you can only smoke when its a full moon out and you are barking like a dog. hell, you are never 25 feet away from a window or doorway in seattle, thus, no one is allowed to go on a smoke break.

how the hell is this enforceable? i can already foresee my drunken argument with seattle's finest at 2 a.m:

cop: "i am citing you for a smoking infraction."
me: "what?"
cop: "you are smoking within 25 feet of that window."
me: "nope. i am 26 feet away from the window."
cop: "don't get wise with me."
me: "where is my tape measure?"

look out for the class action.

[BakerBoy]

Pretty much completely eliminates any chance of anybody smoking anywhere in downtown Seattle, as you'd have to be in the middle of the street to be 25ft away from doors on either side, and even then...

[element1]

shit, a lawyer. Forget the chicks and everything else I said, you don't know me, my name is George and I'm broke....

[garwhal]

on the 25 foot rule. The window thing is what gets it for me. I think the door thing is rational, becasue people do tend to cluster in the doorways and it just traps the smoke. I say, ten feet away from the door. I also say take em to court common law. This is your big break to be the people's champion.

[Art Shirk]

Welcome to the new west, sin marlboro man. As an ashamed smoker (cough cough) I can totally understand banning smoking in most places, but I think banning it in bars is a little rediculous. Leave it up to to the owner and clientel, surely in big western cities there is room for both.

dude, where's our chicks?

you in seattle element1? i resigned myself to couch surfing, skiporn stoke for tomorrow and PBR. i suppose we could skate by the Ballroom and scrape up some snizz for the ole no pants dance. all we have to do is ask them if we can push in their stool(e).

[bcrider]

smoking cigs is gat.

[element1]

you in seattle element1? i resigned myself to couch surfing, skiporn stoke for tomorrow and PBR. i suppose we could skate by the Ballroom and scrape up some snizz for the ole no pants dance. all we have to do is ask them if we can push in their stool(e).

lol , unfortunatly no.

[element1]

well, the home well ran dry and I'm suddenly sober with no powder awaiting me tomorrow so i guess i'll go round up the vaseline and head for bed.... dreaming of stool(e)s of course... you lot are a fun bunch... hasta manana.

P.S. everythings better with green chile on top. except vodka, but you knew that.

[B-RAD]

right on, its about time more places do this. I agree with the 25 ft rule think too, i always see smokers hanging right outside the door, with the smoke drafting in. Or what about you assholes that take a big drag before you get on the bus, then let it all out so that everyone on the bus has to breath your last puffs. Don't get me started on hippies or any other anti-corprate people smoking cigarets, smoking cigs is the best way to support the big-ass corporations that are mucking the whole shit up.

And stop smoking in the lift lines, i'm there to ski and breath the nice fresh mountain air, not air that tastes like asshole

[RootSkier]

Smoking is retarded. They finally banned it in public places in MT except for bars, which have 4 more years until they have to ban it. Lots of places in Missoula have voluntarily banned it, including the best live music venue.

I went to the bar down here last night and my shit reeks. Nasty. Plus, some of my friends who are in an endless quit/smoke cycle were sucking 'em down last night. It's a lot easier to stay off the nastiness if you are forced out into the below zero street.

[Dirty Hoar]

25ft. away from windows... ya, why not. Why should I have to pay for the extra Windex and paper towels it takes to remove smoke film? By the way, Did you see what happened to me the other day in Denver? High winds and hi-rise window cleaning do not jive.

[Toby]

You wanna smoke? Do it outside. Keep that shit away from me. I shouldn't have to pay the price for your filthy habit. Whether that price is fucked up lungs or a dry cleaning bill.

That's fucking awesome. Well said.

[Obstruction]

You wanna smoke? Do it outside. Keep that shit away from me. I shouldn't have to pay the price for your filthy habit. Whether that price is fucked up lungs or a dry cleaning bill.

Amen and then dispose of your rotten stinky ass butts properly. I don't live in your fucking ashtray!!!

[yogachik]

I thought this thread was a joke - I'm surprised to hear that Seattle has only JUST implimented this ban. I thought every major city had. Los Angeles was first (actually, the guy - a councilman - who spearheaded the campaign, Marvin Braude, died just a couple days ago) and it's been at LEAST a decade. The rest of the state followed soon after. Manhattan did it a couple few years ago. London this year.

It's the kind of change that is inconvenient at first, then it's totally normal. When you travel, you'll find that it's so odd to see people smoking indoors. It's actually kind of fun to go outside to smoke (I'm one of those smoke when I drink smokers) and meet everyone. Sometimes, it's the only time people are open and totally friendly (in LA, anyway). I always come back with stories and new friends...