MSP and TGR going the way of Warren Miller?

[cberg]

I checked out the new MSP flick "The Hit List" in Squaw over the weekend. Fun show and fun night for sure. And some of the athletes were killing it. But all things considered, the movie was pretty week. Formulaic, mediocre music, made for the mainstream. In a word, Warren Millerish. After seeing some of the new snowboard movies - Absinthe's "Futureproof" in particular - I can't help but feel embarrassed for the ski industry. Our so called cool guys can't even make something cool. Anyone agree?

[MOHSHSIHd]

choke on a dick jong

[Obstruction]

choke on a dick jong

second ....

[gincognito]

I actually think this could be a valid question. And responses other than those above could be interesting.

Sick and ashamed and happy (and, when all is said and done, there are far worse things to be compared to than Warren Miller),
d.

[jimmy page]

Are you calling the Scorp's mediocre?

[Mcwop]

choke on a dick jong

Are we bitter about those first days on the board?

[LegoSkier]

I checked out the new MSP flick "The Hit List" in Squaw over the weekend. Fun show and fun night for sure. And some of the athletes were killing it. But all things considered, the movie was pretty week. Formulaic, mediocre music, made for the mainstream. In a word, Warren Millerish. After seeing some of the new snowboard movies - Absinthe's "Futureproof" in particular - I can't help but feel embarrassed for the ski industry. Our so called cool guys can't even make something cool. Anyone agree?

Actually, I kinda agree with some of this. Don't get me wrong, they still kick ass and the show was great fun and full of energy but the movie was the same formula as all the past ski movies and I was thinking during the show that the stuff in this movie really hasn't progressed that much over stuff in High Society or even SM1 and the ending was a little weak. I'm all for lovy dovy skier gets along with boarder segments but it was just anti-climactic, no final big orgasmic finish if you know what I mean.
Edit: I just kept thinking this was no Mind the Addiction (JJ's segment ripping along with Metallica at the end of that is how to end a movie.)

[gincognito]

no final big orgasmic finish if you know what I mean.

"Where's the ka-boom?" - Marvin the Martian.

Sick and ashamed and happy (and can't say much since I haven't seen the new releases - but I do think there's a reason why flicks like Immersion and Sinners garner such strong support),
d.

[Max Gosey]

Let's face it... the soundtrack was far from great. But it was a really good, progressive big-mountain flick, I thought. With good humor (something I haven't found much of in Warren Miller). Abma THREW DOWN. Andy Mahre's segment was sick and really good for a park segment, I thought. I didn't think it that much different from Yearbook other than the lack of soundtrack. Perhaps the concept of location focus makes it seem more Warren Millerish? I didn't mind that though. I thought the movie overall was pretty damn good (though perhaps inspirational of some avy-related deaths this upcoming season... ) I can't WAIT to see Tangerine Dream.

Edit:

Actually, I kinda agree with some of this. Don't get me wrong, they still kick ass and the show was great fun and full of energy but the movie was the same formula as all the past ski movies and I was thinking during the show that the stuff in this movie really hasn't progressed that much over stuff in High Society or even SM1 and the ending was a little weak. I'm all for lovy dovy skier gets along with boarder segments but it was just anti-climactic, no final big orgasmic finish if you know what I mean.
Edit: I just kept thinking this was no Mind the Addiction (JJ's segment ripping along with Metallica at the end of that is how to end a movie.)

Agreed, but I thought the cinematography was much improved. I can definitely say the ending wasn't very strong. But I guess I am more accustomed to looking at how good the best parts of the film are (and how many of those parts exist), not necessarily the film overall. Which may be flawed, but it makes some films more enjoyable in retrospect

[runethechamp]

Abma THREW DOWN.

I thought Abma had the most disappointing segment compared to last year.

[powder11]

I think some of the up and coming film makers have achieved what msp and tgr once represented, but in no means have either sunk to warren miller status.

[Below Zero]

I thought Abma had the most disappointing segment compared to last year.

I agree
123456

Edit: Well said, Plake (see below)

[Plakespear]

Haven't seen this year's crop yet, but I think they have a long way to fall before they reach Warren Miller in the late 80's/early 90's status. Until they start doing segments on gapers falling off lifts, Iowa farmers with ropetows in their yards, and celebrities who aren't known for skiing first and foremost, I wouldn't worry.

Yeah, they both have become somewhat formulaic, but after ten years, it's pretty hard to come up with new stuff. The last few years have provided us with some innovative segments, because the New School revolution gave us something new to shoot and see. But TGR and MSP have yet to show people cruising groomers, and are both documenting athletes dedicating to expanding the boundaries of what is possible in skiing.

[Buster Highmen]

Since when is WM as bad as Liberace? Or Jimmy Swaggart? Or American politics?

[slippy]

The way I see it, the bigger companies have become formulatic, like WM is. This is not really a insulting description for a lot of skiers. Skiers are not like snowboarders. Sure, movies like these would not sell as well if they were snowboard movies. But these companies are making movies for skiers. Most skiers don't mind formulas too much, so it works well for MSP or TGR. It's a hard industry to make money in, so there is nothing wrong with putting out movies that sell well. it's good business. The footage is great, the camerawork is great, so who minds the repetiveness?

There are a few skiers who don't like the formulatic approach. To each his own. For them there are movies like Teddy Bear Crisis, Omen Productions, etc.

Honestly, I am disappointed skiers don't have more of a creative lust as snowboard consumers do. But that's only from a business standpoint. (I'm treading on thin water here, as I don't believe we are better than anyone.) Skiers may complain about TGR or MSP, but I guarantee they will go to the premieres every year. And maybe buy their movie. And most importantly, a bunch have no real problems with how they make movies. They are just giving skiers what they want, which bottom line is awesome skiing.

[crashnburn'd]

Warren Miller is as big of an icon as anyone in the ski industry, period.

[powder11]

Warren Miller is as big of an icon as anyone in the ski industry, period.

and walmart is the #1 retailer. whats your point?

[Free Range Lobster]

blah blah blah blah blah

So what you mean to say is they're actually making money now JONG?

[crashnburn'd]

and walmart is the #1 retailer. whats your point?

My point is Warren Miller is much cooler than you, me, and just about everyone else on this board.

[slippy]

I'm pretty sure you guys are jonging someone you respect in the ski film industry. But i'm just guessing.

[cberg]

What I'm asking is why, in the ski industry, is creativity and progression not rewarded? This seems like a problem. The athletes are killing it. They are creative and progressive, no doubt. I'd just like to be able to say the same thing about the film makers. Skiers should really watch some snowboard movies and see what these guys are coming up. Afterlame (Robot Food) and Futureproof (Absinthe) are so far beyond anything that the industry has produced since Kris Ostness stepped out. Thank God he's back.

[crashnburn'd]

Be an asshole first, ask questions later. That's the general rule, right?

[powder11]

My point is Warren Miller is much cooler than you, me, and just about everyone else on this board.

I used to get bored watching Warren Miller as a kid when my ski club played his swag real to real. If you think corny is cool, good on ya. Greg Stump is the godfather in my opinion.

[SkiingBear]

To answer the specific question: yes, TGR and MSP are moving in the direction of Warren Miller movies.

First off, no, I have not seen the latest crop of movies yet. Part of my reasoning for that is I'm not really that interested in seeing what's basically the same shit as last year packaged as new. Okay, so they're technically skiing on snow that fell last year, as opposed to the snow that fell the year before...is that really different?

I don't know that calling the movies "Warren Millerish" is truly fair. I will defend Warren Miller movies till I die. Ski movies would possibly not exist, and almost certainly not to the extent that they do, without the movies he has made through the years. He started doing this roughly 50 years ago, and to some degree, his audience has not changed. My father remembers when Warren actually toured with the movie and narrated on stage while the movie was playing, and yes, my father still enjoys Warren Miller movies (seems to me that it's more or less people in that age bracket that love WM movies the most.

Back to the topic at hand, I don't think truly great (mainstream) ski movies have been made since Greg Stump left the game. His movies, to a greater extent, had plots (albeit porn-quality plots, but plots nonetheless). I'm tired of watching a movie that goes something like this:

Abma: scenes of Abma skiing
Sage: scenes of Sage skiing
McConkey: scenes of McConkey skiing

Stump had a vision, he understood the soul of skiing and, IMHO, he matched the music to the scene better than anyone since. I always got the impression that he saw skiing as a journey, the process of getting to that prize run. There was more to it than just the single virgin line.

I long for the movies of Schmidt and Plake trying to "one up" each other on the same line (or so Stump led us to believe). Maybe I need to dig deeper and find the smaller production companies to find them (TGR and MSP definitely aren't making them).

Disclaimer: Don't get me wrong, I love watching skiing as much as the anyone else on here. I'm simply bored with the format that's being presented to me when I know there's more that could be done.

[Jim S]

Nothing wrong with Warren Miller IMHO. Sometimes I'd like to hear less monologue but his films are fine with me.

HIT LIST
Saw it at Squaw too. It's a decent film but nothing earth shattering. I think it will be harder to push the envelope to keep the wow factor going.The sound track was OK but that is so subjective.

IMHO Mike Wilson had the best segment. It was park-oriented but me and my older son agreed that it was jaw dropping. Ingrid Backstrom had a an avalanche scene. JT Holmes and Hugo Harrison had their usual "holy shit" big ski lines.

I watched it while sitting next to Shane McConkey. It was neat to sit next to him and then look up and there he is on the screen. ....Lots of Squaw footage makes feel even more blessed to ski that mountain whenever I want and it made the movie a bit more special if you ski where it was filmed.