PARK CITY (and all) SKI PATROLLERS DESERVE MORE.

[Going Coastal]

Vail's C Suite gets over 15m in compensation per year combined. Maybe they can do some control work and patient care to keep things running.

[brutah]

Recently, I ate at a restaurant that charged a 4% service fee to the bill. This has become quite common. The service fee was an add-on that would go directly to the chef and kitchen staff. I wonder whether if Vail does not want to give these good folks a wee deserved raise, if the union can negotiate that going forward Vail add on a X% service fee on passes and tickets that goes directly to it's patrollers? Of course, that would cost pass holder's more money, but it is the public who are benefiting from expert patrollers.

Are ski patrollers not already part of the $300 day pass cost? Seems like a slippery slope, next thing there will be a service fee for the grooming and ski lifts


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[utagonian]

I’m not privy to insider negotiating details but to me the patroller union seems weak. They should take a page from the longshoreman guys. Play hardball, take some risks and get paid.

[doebedoe]

Longshoreman and patrol unions are in very different structural positions with much different histories. Can’t expect young, small, union with small resources to enact same strategy as one of the most powerful unions in the US.

[heckacali]

The idea that you can just airlift in patrollers from another resort to cover is laughable.

Yes, they can package a patient and get the sled down ...

But do they know where all the sleds and equipment are?
Do they know the names of trails, or unmarked landmarks to locate the patient? Best routes down considering conditions?
And dozens of other soft skills and knowledge that comes from working the mountain every day...

[m2711c]

traveling nurse on skis...


fact.

[skiJ]

I do not believe corporate labor / business practices is a laughing matter
( there might be value in reviewing how Vail Resorts treated employees in 2020 after the pandemic closed the resorts ).

Good luck to the PCMR ski patrollers --


( skiJ )

[schindlerpiste]

The idea that you can just airlift in patrollers from another resort to cover is laughable.

Yes, they can package a patient and get the sled down ...

But do they know where all the sleds and equipment are?
Do they know the names of trails, or unmarked landmarks to locate the patient? Best routes down considering conditions?
And dozens of other soft skills and knowledge that comes from working the mountain every day...

Not to mention where to sleep in Park City. Not exactly many available cheap employee housing options available in P.C. That alone would be cost prohibitive.

[AdironRider]

Comparing one of the most desirable positions in the ski industry, where at most mountains people literally volunteer to do it, to a dishwasher is not a good faith argument.

[skiJ]

guys -
If you are expecting Vail Resorts to take an economical response to this if the Patrol attempts to 'strike' , ,,, I would be very surprised if they do --

I expect they already have a contingency plan for housing in SLC And transportation to-and-from PC, Daily.

I had it keyed out earlier - much of those 'soft skills and knowledge' other VR patrollers would have ; it would not be PC-specific, but I am aware there is a VR's set of operational procedures that is foundational across the company - CO, UT, MO, MN, OH, etc. ...

it is the idea that a company like Vail Resorts would capitulate to a strike after 'one day' that I find unbelievable ( "laughable", if you prefer - )

Vail Resorts will try to avoid a strike -
But if the PCM ski patrol abandons it's work, I believe you will see a response previously not seen in the ski industry.

nurses' strikes have become familiar -
I am not aware of a hospital that has closed due to a nurses' strike.

I would bet a lot(,) that the courts of this land do not consider a "Temporary Agreement" to be a "contract" ;
in an "at-will" ( Right to work ) State, I expect the company will have the court decisions in their favor.

I am no fan of Vail Resorts, and am unlikely to ever ski at one of their resorts or ski areas again, and
I believe we would be better to encourage the PCM ski patrollers to take a cautious, Deliberate approach ;

to me, there is nothing "laughable" about this situation -
How Many patrollers would it take to provide [ crisis coverage ] for PCMRs (?)
fifty (?) thirty (?) ( twelve (?) )
( remember, the patrollers responsibility during this 'crisis' could be limited to 'packaging' and transport from the slopes to the patient care facility )

VR can 'house' them in SLC, and bus them to Park City , daily.

Vail Resorts can Not afford to allow one department of one resort determine VR's ability to operate.

I am going to try again to step away from this thread.
though Park City is hundreds of miles away, I recognize my comments,,, aren't popular.

Good luck to the PCM patrollers
( Please, choose wisely ) --

With Respect.

skiJ

[One (+) Sentence]

guys -
If you are expecting Vail Resorts to take an economical response to this if the Patrol attempts to 'strike' , ,,, I would be very surprised if they do --

I expect they already have a contingency plan for housing in SLC And transportation to-and-from PC, Daily.

I had it keyed out earlier - much of those 'soft skills and knowledge' other VR patrollers would have ; it would not be PC-specific, but I am aware there is a VR's set of operational procedures that is foundational across the company - CO, UT, MO, MN, OH, etc. ...

it is the idea that a company like Vail Resorts would capitulate to a strike after 'one day' that I find unbelievable ( "laughable", if you prefer - )

Vail Resorts will try to avoid a strike -
But if the PCM ski patrol abandons it's work, I believe you will see a response previously not seen in the ski industry.

nurses' strikes have become familiar -
I am not aware of a hospital that has closed due to a nurses' strike.

I would bet a lot(,) that the courts of this land do not consider a "Temporary Agreement" to be a "contract" ;
in an "at-will" ( Right to work ) State, I expect the company will have the court decisions in their favor.

I am no fan of Vail Resorts, and am unlikely to ever ski at one of their resorts or ski areas again, and
I believe we would be better to encourage the PCM ski patrollers to take a cautious, Deliberate approach ;

to me, there is nothing "laughable" about this situation -
How Many patrollers would it take to provide [ crisis coverage ] for PCMRs (?)
fifty (?) thirty (?) ( twelve (?) )
( remember, the patrollers responsibility during this 'crisis' could be limited to 'packaging' and transport from the slopes to the patient care facility )

VR can 'house' them in SLC, and bus them to Park City , daily.

Vail Resorts can Not afford to allow one department of one resort determine VR's ability to operate.

I am going to try again to step away from this thread.
though Park City is hundreds of miles away, I recognize my comments,,, aren't popular.

Good luck to the PCM patrollers
( Please, choose wisely ) --

With Respect.

skiJ

I can't see too many patrollers from Breck or Crested Butte (or even Wilmot) being willing to break their colleagues picket line and travel to UT over Christmas to be away from their families and work a hill that they do not know.

[Name Redacted]

I can't see too many patrollers from Breck or Crested Butte (or even Wilmot) being willing to break their colleagues picket line and travel to UT over Christmas to be away from their families and work a hill that they do not know.

Away from their families? Patrollers can't afford to have families. Not here, not there.

Are there any mandates on how many patrollers need to be present to open a ski area? Or to open terrain? VR isn't the only ones paying shit for the job. Arapahoe Basin, newly acquired by Alterra, is looking at unionizing as well. No idea of their current pay structure, but I'm sure it ain't much better.

[doebedoe]

Away from their families? Patrollers can't afford to have families. Not here, not there.

Are there any mandates on how many patrollers need to be present to open a ski area? Or to open terrain? VR isn't the only ones paying shit for the job. Arapahoe Basin, newly acquired by Alterra, is looking at unionizing as well. No idea of their current pay structure, but I'm sure it ain't much better.

Many areas have mandates. Forest Service SUP requires a set level of patrol (number of staff, level of training, etc). Every insurance company does the same.

The difference is that PCMR is not on NF land and Vail is self insured.

I don't expect a strike will happen. Nor do I expect Vail has a robust contingency plan if they do...but that's based on just knowing people who work on and manage Vail patrols in CO.

[One (+) Sentence]

Away from their families? Patrollers can't afford to have families. Not here, not there.

?? Paging TFW in 3,2,1...

Everyone has a family, dude. Maybe it's different than your definition, but everyone has one.

[Canada1]

Last time they had a bunch of patrollers from other mountains come in . They seemed to be mostly midwestern bumps owned by vail. It's hard to get mad at people who are nice and seemed to be getting a semi ski vacation that they otherwise never would have gotten. I remember when some dude from my neighborhood was on here talking about how great Vail has been for our housing prices, new lodges, etc....
Vail manages a good mountain, but I'd rather of had the old ownership. They didn't bring in half of south america to work so they could treat them poorly and send them on their way. They really did look out for locals, and I had a number of friends and acquaintances who the mountain management helped through lean times. Vail is beholden to the dollar, and I hope the patrollers get some out of this. The prior ownership cared about locals. Vail looks at us as a hindrance.

[AdironRider]

In terms of Park City that is very much a two way street. Vail gets a lot of deserved hate but Park City locals have never really given them a fair shake in pretty much every aspect. Off the top of my head they would rather burn the place down than get more parking, or hold the town lift hostage as just the latest example, affects of the ski experience for all be damned. I mean I get it, fuck the corporate overlord and all, but at a certain point it just seems petty for millionaires bitching about their billionaire ski area owner like its some moral travesty. And lets be real, in a competition of who sucks more Powdr wins if you ask me, if only out of sheer incompetence. You may not like Vail, but they are at least good at what they do.

At the end of the day, Vail has hundreds if not thousands of patrollers at other mountains that will gladly take an expenses paid vacation to Park City for Christmas vs. triaging some jabroni at Hunter for example. I hope the Park City patrollers get a couple extra bucks but they have basically zero leverage.

[Buzzworthy]

Fuck Vail you apologist asswipe. You really are a douchebag.

[new yabyum]

I'm sure they'll be thrilled to travel over the Holidays.

Fuck Vail you apologist asswipe. You really are a douchebag.

Two thumbs up for Buzz.

[new yabyum]

I'm sure they'll be thrilled to travel over the Holidays.

Fuck Vail you apologist asswipe. You really are a douchebag.

Two thumbs up for Buzz.

[zion zig zag]

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At the end of the day, Vail has hundreds if not thousands of patrollers at other mountains that will gladly take an expenses paid vacation to Park City for Christmas vs. triaging some jabroni at Hunter for example.

Man, that sucks if it’s that easy to find scabs.

[halliday]

Maybe there is wording in The Company hiring agreement that includes the words "in the event of a staffing shortage Vail Resorts can bring in outside help from another operating entity within The Company to fill the labor void". Vail has lawyers. PC patrollers have weak union representation. Let's see what happens. Fingers crossed for the patrollers.

[Name Redacted]

?? Paging TFW in 3,2,1...

Everyone has a family, dude. Maybe it's different than your definition, but everyone has one.

Super serial.

[bamboocoreONLY]

Thing that really blows my mind is that the pay they're getting at PCMR is so much lower than other VR owned ski areas. Wonder why PCMR specifically is getting such pushback from VR.

[old goat]

SkiJ mentioned hospital strikes. I've been through a few. Yeah, the hospital stays open, but they empty it out as much as possible first, cancel elective surgery, close the ER, send people to other hospitals--rounding on my patients in a hospital I didn't know was fun. They bring in registry nurses, who cost the hospital twice as much (surprise, it's not the nurses who get the extra money) to take care of the patients they can't transfer. If Vail brings in patrol from other mountains what happens to staffing at those places? If they're squeaking by on patrol I would assume they would open as little of the mountain as possible. Guests won't be happy.

[Bunion 2020]

Trying to bring in replacements is a really bad idea. One incident and its write the plaintiff a check for more than what VR would have saved by reaching an agreement in the 1st place.

And if the incident involves guest safety it will be a gigantic black eye.