The Black Crows thread

[Skiwald]

1st day on last year’s Atris 184 today. Day after a dump chop bumps and groomers. They were really fun. Super playful, easy to maneuver, a hoot in the bumps and carves much better than the previous version. Definitely not as stable or damp as the enforcer free 104 but effortless in tight spaces. Pretty stoked on them.


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[jmars]

I think I saw your post somewhere else like Facebook or something, and I didn’t chime in, but if it was the same post, I would get a serpo and size up from your enforcer. It skis short and soft but is a good idea for a replacement. An orb might be a good call but finding a 179 is hard, 184 is impossible.

Thanks for the reply all. Wasn’t me on FB but I did buy the 186. I grew to dislike the enforcer the more time I got on it, ended feeling planky and I hated the tip shape in anything but softer chopped up snow. Always felt dead to me.

I’m hopeful the more traditional shape of the Serpo plays nice for all aspects of the terrain. I’m ok with a bit softer - grabbed a Nordica Doberman this season for the stiff rally days.

Thanks!

[SoVT Joey]

Thanks for the reply all. Wasn’t me on FB but I did buy the 186. I grew to dislike the enforcer the more time I got on it, ended feeling planky and I hated the tip shape in anything but softer chopped up snow. Always felt dead to me.

I’m hopeful the more traditional shape of the Serpo plays nice for all aspects of the terrain. I’m ok with a bit softer - grabbed a Nordica Doberman this season for the stiff rally days.

Thanks!

my buddy bought my old serpo and walks around with a half chub at the end of the day with how much fun it is, he has said that he would of gotten a 186 instead as well if he had bought new but for the crowded weekend cruising they are still great. They do handle everything well. Plus he has long skis for when it’s necessary. I wish I had bought the 186, I’d still own them.

[Samski360]

Just finally got on my 173 Solis today and thought I’d post my thoughts, as feeble as they are, for posterity.

Goddamn that is a good ski. Conditions were bad to terrible. 2in of fresh on top of coral reef, windboard, and some hardback groomer to get back to the car. The Solis handled the conditions better than any touring ski I have used. I found them super intuitive and way more approachable than the BC copy made them seem. Easy to initiate turns and the tails never got hung up or locked in when the snow got grabby and shitty. I think they’ll be a solid daily driver for firm and variable conditions and and absolute blast in steep couloirs and alpine lines. I’m now tempted to sell my Camox FBs as I don’t know how often I would grab the Camox over the Solis.

I could see skiing the 180cm with a beef boot and really liking them but the 173 was a perfect pairing with my Scarpa F1 XTs and Trab Gara Titans. (I’m 5’9/ 180lbs)

With all the good deals on those skis, wanted to get that review out there if anyone is on the fence.

[Pins and Skins]

Samski, I've been waxing lyrical on the ski in the dedicated Solis thread. FWIW, I have the 173 for touring and the 180 for inbounds (I'm 5'8 / 150). I think for shorter guys, the 180 is quite underrated for resort use. The reasons you stated for their backcountry effectiveness are the same for the frontside, I think.

STP still has a killer deal for the 173s (https://www.sierra.com/black-crows-s...black-crows%2F) Just 1 left though.

[Samski360]

Side note/question on the Solis skin attachment: I got the precut skins for the Solis and they come with a metal hook that fits in the chevron shaped hole on the tip. Am I doing it wrong, or is it just nearly impossible to rip skins with skis on with that attachment style? Every time I try, the hook gets twisted and won’t exit the chevron hole without persuasion. Likely going to swap out for standard Pomoca tip attachments unless there’s a technique that I’m missing.


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[Karl_H]

I only toured with them for two days, but I could never cleanly rip the precut skins, in one pull, without taking my skis off first.

I was able to eventually get the hooks out of the chevron, but I had to reset my hand closer to the hook. Don’t twist.

It doesn’t seem like there is really any reliable way to get the hook to come out, when pulling from the tail. Some combination of modding the chevron or skins might make it work.

[GravityDT]

Anyone have any recent time on a Draco? Been holding off on pulling the trigger on a soft snow setup. I mean it's gotta snow here sometime soon right?? Anyway these would be replacing a 184cm Backland 117 I just sold that was my soft snow setup the last few seasons. Eyeing the 189 Draco or do I go full bore pow with Nocta? Some touring, some sidecountry and some resort use....one of the things I enjoyed with the Backlands is how they held their own on groomers at the end of the day.... Prob getting some ATK FR 15s mounted and I have both Fischer TransAlp Pro's and a pr of the new Shift 130's for boots if it matters. 5'10 185lbs

[iriponsnow]

Just sold my DD Corvus 188 on the cheap to a mag who got his skis stollen. Now I can mount my nib 183s.

[bw_wp_hedonism]

Anyone have any recent time on a Draco? Been holding off on pulling the trigger on a soft snow setup. I mean it's gotta snow here sometime soon right?? Anyway these would be replacing a 184cm Backland 117 I just sold that was my soft snow setup the last few seasons. Eyeing the 189 Draco or do I go full bore pow with Nocta? Some touring, some sidecountry and some resort use....one of the things I enjoyed with the Backlands is how they held their own on groomers at the end of the day.... Prob getting some ATK FR 15s mounted and I have both Fischer TransAlp Pro's and a pr of the new Shift 130's for boots if it matters. 5'10 185lbs

Can’t speak to the Draco, but I like my Noctas. They’re manageable on groomers if not iced. On ice, terrifying.

[halliday]

^^Noctas kick ass.

[SoVT Joey]

I agree the nocta is the best choice. That Draco is confusing. It is pretty much like the ferox from the stats. And I didn’t find the ferox that much fun. The nocta is better in untracked and tracked up. Ice they both suck on. Groomers with good soft snow they are a blast if you can lay them over.

[Samski360]

Anyone have any recent time on a Draco? Been holding off on pulling the trigger on a soft snow setup. I mean it's gotta snow here sometime soon right?? Anyway these would be replacing a 184cm Backland 117 I just sold that was my soft snow setup the last few seasons. Eyeing the 189 Draco or do I go full bore pow with Nocta? Some touring, some sidecountry and some resort use....one of the things I enjoyed with the Backlands is how they held their own on groomers at the end of the day.... Prob getting some ATK FR 15s mounted and I have both Fischer TransAlp Pro's and a pr of the new Shift 130's for boots if it matters. 5'10 185lbs

No experience with Draco buy agree with others that for powder, the Nocta is ridiculously fun. I’d say if you want the best powder performance and don’t mind a bit of weight, Nocta over Draco. If you want an all arounder, the Atris is fantastic, nominally heavier than the Draco, and half the price currently (they’re on sale all over the place).

I kind of wish BC would bring back something like the Anima FB. They were noodly but floated amazingly and were super fun with a lighter boot. Most of the non-Freebird BCs are light enough to tour on that if you want a powerful touring ski, there’s not much reason not to just mount a touring binding on a Nocta, Atris, or Corvus.

I am curious for more reviews of the Draco, but like Joey said, it’s confusing.

[mr_pretzel]

I agree the nocta is the best choice. That Draco is confusing. It is pretty much like the ferox from the stats. And I didn’t find the ferox that much fun. The nocta is better in untracked and tracked up. Ice they both suck on. Groomers with good soft snow they are a blast if you can lay them over.

Have you skied the new one yet?

[SoVT Joey]

Have you skied the new one yet?

no. I have no urge to either. The ferox just blew so bad and there really is no difference between the ferox and Draco on paper. The only Freebirds I actually like and think are worth it are the Orb FB and the Corvus FB. The camox FB is decent but just doesn’t light my fire. The anima FB needs to come back. I’d buy an old gen nocta and forget the Draco. Weight penalty is like 50 grams. But you gain a killer inbounds ski too. Quiver kill a lightweight tech and a good alpine clamp. My 2022 is quiver killed for a duke Pt and jester. My new powder hunter is quiver killed for a jester and a kingpin.

[kid-kapow]

I would be surprised if the Draco and the Ferox ski the same, similar specs or no. The constructions are quite different. I think one of the main design criterias was to get something that did not prefer short turns like the ferox, but instead wanted to do big arcs yet could easily be shut down - aka ski like Schirmer, Favret and the rest of the teams rides, while still being somewhat playful / easy to ski and progressive.


I mean, nothing about the depicted flex pattern and shape scream turny to me. 24m turn radius up front, 25 underfoot and 23 in the stiffer tail section. Noses that are no noodles, moderate taper lines. Moderate splay and relatively deep rocker lines together with some heft and a progressive mount point. In all honesty, these kinda seem like the ski I kinda wanted the Atris to be. The pricing is still rediculous imho.

I dunno - they did not feel particularly turny to me when I tried them, but it was hard to get a feel for them due to the incredibly vague ATK RentMes that were mounted on them.

[ski whore]

Why not just get it over with and make an Atris freebird?


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[Skiwald]

Why not just get it over with and make an Atris freebird?


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This.

Then again maybe the draco covers it anyway. Why would anyone hate on a ski you have never tried. Just negative speculation. I tried the ferox and was not a fan but I’d give the draco a shot when my 108 tourer shits the bed. Looking forward to hearing from someone with time on the Draco.


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[alpinevibes]

Why not just get it over with and make an Atris freebird?


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Julien said “never” so I doubt it will happen.

I agree with Kid - they seem to have pulled the Draco in the right direction on the design. It’s mostly subjective, but I can’t recall anyone skiing the Ferox aggressively besides Turdell. Everything so far with the Draco seems to indicate folks are comfortable to ski it similar to the Atris or Anima FB.

[mr_pretzel]

no. I have no urge to either. The ferox just blew so bad and there really is no difference between the ferox and Draco on paper. The only Freebirds I actually like and think are worth it are the Orb FB and the Corvus FB. The camox FB is decent but just doesn’t light my fire. The anima FB needs to come back. I’d buy an old gen nocta and forget the Draco. Weight penalty is like 50 grams. But you gain a killer inbounds ski too. Quiver kill a lightweight tech and a good alpine clamp. My 2022 is quiver killed for a duke Pt and jester. My new powder hunter is quiver killed for a jester and a kingpin.

Sorry I meant the new nocta, have you been on that?

[SoVT Joey]

Sorry I meant the new nocta, have you been on that?

no, Ullr doesn’t seem to be paying attention.

[halliday]

no, Ullr doesn’t seem to be paying attention.

Ullr has his head up his ass lately.

[iriponsnow]

I have ski_the_trees older Nocta for Catch n Release - PM

[halliday]

Check your PM

[Pins and Skins]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=64GRiFlNODk

NS gives an overview of the Draco, starts at 3:35

Anyone have any recent time on a Draco? Been holding off on pulling the trigger on a soft snow setup. I mean it's gotta snow here sometime soon right?? Anyway these would be replacing a 184cm Backland 117 I just sold that was my soft snow setup the last few seasons. Eyeing the 189 Draco or do I go full bore pow with Nocta? Some touring, some sidecountry and some resort use....one of the things I enjoyed with the Backlands is how they held their own on groomers at the end of the day.... Prob getting some ATK FR 15s mounted and I have both Fischer TransAlp Pro's and a pr of the new Shift 130's for boots if it matters. 5'10 185lbs