The Black Crows thread

[Stuntmonkey]

Joey/resident nerds: What are my options for a slightly more chargier Captis? Corvus? I'm thinking a little metal would go a LONG way in this ski, and probably some length for me (I'm on the 186 @ 225/6'2). I find myself jumping back to the Captis on a fuck around groomers/soft snow/whatevers there kind of day. Insanely fun to pop around on.....just could be better? Maybe I'm dreaming of something thats not there considering the jump is 17mm from captis to corvus.

[sk8rat6587]

Joey/resident nerds: What are my options for a slightly more chargier Captis? Corvus? I'm thinking a little metal would go a LONG way in this ski, and probably some length for me (I'm on the 186 @ 225/6'2). I find myself jumping back to the Captis on a fuck around groomers/soft snow/whatevers there kind of day. Insanely fun to pop around on.....just could be better? Maybe I'm dreaming of something thats not there considering the jump is 17mm from captis to corvus.

Those seem like much more different skis than just metal and width.

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[Stuntmonkey]

Those seem like much more different skis than just metal and width.

Yeah, I'm thinking of the camox, not the corvus.

[XXX-er]

https://www.wildsnow.com/33365/looki...d-black-crows/

a timely black crow artical from wildsnow

[SoVT Joey]

I prefer the Atris over the captis or camox. They claim the Atris is just a wider captis but the layup is definitely more stout. I rotate between a Corvus and Atris depending on snow and level of d bag I want to crank it up to. Atris is a lot of fun and can be driven especially on soft snow, Corvus likes to nuke.

if you wanted something with metal down in the 90-100 the serpo and Justis are there, both directional but I found the serpo too turny and the justis has so much rocker it doesn’t ski well unless on edge and being piloted.

the camox is solid, my dad skis that as a DD, but if I owned a captis I’d jump right over to an Atris and you’ll be happy. Especially on the 189/new 190.

[Stuntmonkey]

I have the 20/21 189.7 Atris mounted on the line and this has been the first year I haven’t pulled it out. I found it hard to release the tails and not as fun as expected.

I’ve been meaning to detune the tails a bit and was considering putting some pivots on; I’ve heard it’s more centered if you mount 1-1.5cm in front of the line. I’ve never mounted outside recommended so I haven’t got a reference.


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[SoVT Joey]

I have the 20/21 189.7 Atris mounted on the line and this has been the first year I haven’t pulled it out. I found it hard to release the tails and not as fun as expected.

I’ve been meaning to detune the tails a bit and was considering putting some pivots on; I’ve heard it’s more centered if you mount 1-1.5cm in front of the line. I’ve never mounted outside recommended so I haven’t got a reference.


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I would venture towards user error over ski error, pivots aren’t going to make it release any more or less, ( and pivots are hands down terrible but TGR cult following). The mount point could but that’s a stretch and unnecessary to punch more holes for no reason. Try backing your base bevel off, I have a 1.5 base bevel on my Atris and it will release very easily. It’s still not a surfy experience on the ski though, nor is that what the ski is made for.

I guess mounting forward by 1-1.5cm could be helpful and maybe the Atris is too much length coupled with that width. I ski the 184 and I wouldn’t go up to a 189 because it would limit where I would want to put this ski. The longest ski (the TGR way) isn’t always the answer, In fact it usually never is.



I have messed with all of my skis heavily in the tune department and I have found myself very very happy:

Nocta 190 2 Side 2 base
Corvus 188 3 side 1.5 base
Atris 184 2 side 1.5 base
Justis 189 3 side 1 base
Corvus FB 183 3 side 1.5 base
Corvus FB 188 3 side 2 base
Solis 180 3 side 1 base
Ferox 181 2 side 2 base
Mentis 178 3 side .75 base

[Stuntmonkey]

Hahaha thanks for that, I appreciate the help. I’ll bring it along this coming weekend to Louise and see if the change in bevel helps.

I won’t lie, I’ve always been told/subscribed/shamed into the longest ski being a bigger than average guy. Specially through here!!!

[mghatts]

Any reviews on the Navis (not the Freebird)? I have an opportunity at a pair but can't find a whole lot of info on them.

[bry]

I had a pair for a couple seasons mounted with shifts. I thought they were good slack skis at 2000 g/ski but didn't have enough beef for the resort, though somewhat better/acceptable when on edge. Traditional shape, good skis...you just feel everything.

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[waxoff]

Got a couple of days on the 183 Justis the past weekend.

Fuck those soft (and wide) grippy tips in cut up variable frontside conditions.

Sweet low edge angle skidded short turns, as sweet as sweet can be. But when transitioning to higher edge angles and carved turns one better hold on cause of said tips, Damn do they bend, and jerk up the ride.

Everything from underfoot and rearward felt dang on. Sweet tail flex. On current gen Griffons + RX130.

So it's either: [A] Detune the crap of a substantial portion of the tip rocker section, maybe not quite to the camber contact point, but at least halfway from widest point of tip to camber contact point. Or [B] Flip 'em. Currently undecided. Wish I could stiffen those tips substantially. Is ski viagra a thing?

Skied them back to back with 108 Wrens (184 cm, 2018, +Wardens) which behaved super sweet in the same conditions. Not as tight carves obviously. The softish flex of that vintage allows for some decent bending though, and they're calm, so calm.

So, it's time to (try to) mitigate the above negative experience. Those tips are something else (yes, I still find them unnecessary soft) This is what I mean.



- Rocker transitions to tip upturn at blue ink mark.
- Sidecut extends uninterrupted to red ink mark.
- Widest point of tip at green ink mark.

My point is, when ski is put on high edge, the portion between blue and green ink, most certainly between blue and red ink, will grab the surface, bend the tips abruptly, and fuck up the ride.

I will give these tips a file treatment similar to what I gave the Q-Lab's tails. I.e. remove edge material (ca 0.5 mm) from green ink to halfway in between red and blue ink. Further more by completely round off what's left of the edges all the way down to blue ink, gradually reduce rounding/detune, initially to top of tape. The we'll see.

If I was to redesign these tips (are you reading this Regnier?), I would start the sidecut-to-taper transition roughly at the blue ink mark, and also move the widest point down to a point a smidgen below the red ink mark. Yes the tips would be 3-5 mm narrower at their widest point.

I still believe the tips could be stiffer on this type of ski, as a 100 mm uf ski are no floaters anyway. And in 3D snow, allowing the tips to bend towards the snow surface will only produce pseudo floatation if you ask me. Better to have dependable submarining tips, they will float just fine if you know how.

[kid-kapow]

So, it's time to (try to) mitigate the above negative experience.

thanks for sharing - that is a quality post!

[SoVT Joey]

Waxoff- that’s awesome!! I don’t find the tips on my 189 overly soft but the GD ski wants to turn like a SL ski once I roll them up on high angle, like when you find the soft tip, I don’t find it that enjoyable to suddenly transition from 25m turns to suddenly 15m. I normally would of gotten a 183 in the Justis until I saw those rocker profiles and I jumped to a 189. Still didn’t make them my go to skis.

they are fun for the day after a storm when the mtn is packed full of joeys and it’s chop city. Otherwise they stay home, which is a bummer… my most unused ski by far and had such potential on paper.

[kid-kapow]

I have found myself very very happy:

Nocta 190 2 Side 2 base
Corvus 188 3 side 1.5 base
Atris 184 2 side 1.5 base
Justis 189 3 side 1 base
Corvus FB 183 3 side 1.5 base
Corvus FB 188 3 side 2 base
Solis 180 3 side 1 base
Ferox 181 2 side 2 base
Mentis 178 3 side .75 base

sorry - meant to quote this too, very insightful too Could not disagree more on your take on pivots though...

[shitskier]

I've been skiing some old 184 full rocker mantras. I like them but they're pretty beat, and I want to replace them. The flat/rocker based Corvus looks like a decent substitute. Is that off base?

Also, anyone have advice on length if 184 feels just about right for Mantras?

[SoVT Joey]

I've been skiing some old 184 full rocker mantras. I like them but they're pretty beat, and I want to replace them. The flat/rocker based Corvus looks like a decent substitute. Is that off base?

Also, anyone have advice on length if 184 feels just about right for Mantras?

I would say it’s a good choice. A 183 is probably what I would get. There are a lot of good deals on new to be had. Corbett’s is sub $500. The Fischer Ranger would also be worth a look and there’s one on gear swap new unmounted with attacks for a great price.

[mn_teleswede]

Looking at Serpo- does it suffer from the too soft of a tip that the Justis has or is it a bit stiffer/ less tip grab?

[shitskier]

I would say it’s a good choice. A 183 is probably what I would get. There are a lot of good deals on new to be had. Corbett’s is sub $500. The Fischer Ranger would also be worth a look and there’s one on gear swap new unmounted with attacks for a great price.

Thanks!

[SoVT Joey]

Looking at Serpo- does it suffer from the too soft of a tip that the Justis has or is it a bit stiffer/ less tip grab?

I felt it suffered from soft in general. Great soft snow ski. Very fun and turny, but I’d get a mirus cor before I bought another serpo.

[mn_teleswede]

I felt it suffered from soft in general. Great soft snow ski. Very fun and turny, but I’d get a mirus cor before I bought another serpo.

Gotcha

[waxoff]

I will give these tips a file treatment similar to what I gave the Q-Lab's tails. I.e. remove edge material (ca 0.5 mm) from green ink to halfway in between red and blue ink. Further more by completely round off what's left of the edges all the way down to blue ink, gradually reduce rounding/detune, initially to top of tape. The we'll see.

Ok, they have now been put through the test. So, if you found yer Justises rending a twitchy ride while on high edge, follow my above recipe as a starter.

Given I haven't yet had them in the exact same conditions as when they failed me before, I am confident in saying this helps, a lot! Very promising from now on.

Try it, you'll probably like it!

[mghatts]

I had a pair for a couple seasons mounted with shifts. I thought they were good slack skis at 2000 g/ski but didn't have enough beef for the resort, though somewhat better/acceptable when on edge. Traditional shape, good skis...you just feel everything.

Thanks for the info!

[::: :::]

I have messed with all of my skis heavily in the tune department and I have found myself very very happy:

Nocta 190 2 Side 2 base
Corvus 188 3 side 1.5 base
Atris 184 2 side 1.5 base
Justis 189 3 side 1 base
Corvus FB 183 3 side 1.5 base
Corvus FB 188 3 side 2 base
Solis 180 3 side 1 base
Ferox 181 2 side 2 base
Mentis 178 3 side .75 base

Bravo to you for the sensitivity to have those preferences…it would be lost on me esp at any 10x+ underfoot
I ride 1 & 1 purely for simplicity

[SoVT Joey]

Bravo to you for the sensitivity to have those preferences…it would be lost on me esp at any 10x+ underfoot
I ride 1 & 1 purely for simplicity

I have always skied 2 or 3 side and a .5, .75, or 1 base. That’s how race skis were usually set up depending on discipline. So I know what I like for a sharp side edge and then started giving more base edge dependent on how loose and easy I want the ski to disengage and release in the tails. My Corvus 188 was at 3 and 1 and I couldn’t get it to play nicely, I opened up by another .5 and it’s like a completely new ride. Atris could use another .5 degree sometimes I think but it seems like it’s better for the harder shitty snow we have had in the east… though those and my nocta just landed in Tahoe yesterday, so that snow pack will be completely different.

[Stuntmonkey]

Okay ignore me I’m a moron. 1.5 base and 2 side on the 189.7 Atris and I don’t even understand why it made that much of a difference. Definitely fallen back in love with this ski.


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