Better Schools Won’t Fix America

[redacted user]

Or state-level introduction of rational drug laws that combat the drug war. The thing is that smaller size increases the impact of a vote, which drives engagement. The current setup where the Federal Govt is seen as a cure-all is really destructive to engagement, accountability, etc. Hyperbolizing the Arpaios of the world isn't exactly a refutation of those dynamics.

[ill-advised strategy]

High taxes, reroute military spending into big ambitious public infrastructure projects that pay well and raise the labor market at large; education, healthcare, housing, and transit treated as public investments that must function well to ensure the health and wellbeing of society instead of bitterly throwing change at beggars.

If we went for that approach we might start to pull out of this in a couple of generations. It’s probably impossible, fox news is the greatest tactical move the super rich could have devised to maintain their position.

[Buster Highmen]

Or state-level introduction of rational drug laws that combat the drug war. The thing is that smaller size increases the impact of a vote, which drives engagement. The current setup where the Federal Govt is seen as a cure-all is really destructive to engagement, accountability, etc. Hyperbolizing the Arpaios of the world isn't exactly a refutation of those dynamics.

Look at what states are doing to abortion laws. I don't see those legal purveyors doing anything progressive with drug laws. Sometimes, the Federal government can lead and can hold these forms of regression to account.

[schuss]

Taleb is not as smart as he thinks he is, this being an example. Oversight goes up as you ascend the ladder in gov, so there's more accountability, not less.

Anyhow, education is part of the problem, as is wage gaps, automation etc etc.

My take is we can sit around and bitch about it or believe in a better tomorrow and work for or support those who also believe in that. We're going to get some things wrong, but as long as there's the acceptance of that, we're fine.

I'd also argue we aren't getting dumber, it's just more obvious with how connected things are.

[redacted user]

Delegating to the oversight god as an exercise in ignoring the effect of power on decision making.

edit: There's a bit of dissonance among the liberal-minded herd where the individual must simultaneously be respected yet not compelled to do anything as the benevolent state will cure all - if only the right person were to be elected. Buster notes the problematic nature of state rights while living in a liberal state (thus validating the efficacy of the state model!).

[Meadow Skipper]

I feel, KQ is right and Avarice is killing this country. Corporations, Wall Street, your representatives in government are all greedy fuckers that are selling the majority out. There are ways to address these issues, but as long as Big Business is writing our laws, it isn't going to happen.

QFT. It isn’t so much that capitalism is a terrible system, or socialism for that matter. It’s Capitalists and Socialists that fuck things up. People will find a way to play any system to their own personal or ideological advantage. Throw religion and libertarianism in there too. Greedy/power-hungry people suck, and there are a lot of them.

[jackstraw]

While it's true that schools won't fix our ridiculous wage scale and other structural inequalities, this guy overlooks the fact that our education system is part of the foundation of social problems in the US. The difference in quality of education between poor and rich communities is massive. Schools are more segregated than 50 years ago. Tests are demonstrably biased, yet that billion dollar industry remains a dominant force. Textbooks written by white supremacists are common (thanks, Texas). Going to "College," for many, is more like a massive ponzi scheme than a pathway toward the American dream.

Yes, there are educators everywhere doing wonderful work. Despite this, we shouldn't be surprise that schools fail to reduce inequality because our education system is designed to maintain that inequality, just as our political system has morphed into something designed to defend corporate profits over individual rights, long term stability. This connect connects to a bigger problem with the article: Who the fuck is this guy?

He's a venture capitalist. He invested in Amazon early and made a lot of money. Now he's an expert on schools and social welfare? I appreciate the message he's trying to put out there, but he has a voice here because he's rich, not because he's an expert. It's not his fault, but it's also fucked up. Expertise doesn't count for much these days.

Yes.

Guys like this guy and Gates think that they can fix education by putting everyone into a square box, creating bullshit metrics, and selling software to test and quantify all this bullshit. Then these bs test results decide who gets what funding. So, of course, the teachers have to teach to the test. This includes all children across the spectrum. Makes sense, eh?

Gates should stick to fucking the world over with his computer software that becomes outdated and no longer supported...for the good of all of course.

[MontuckyFried]

While I agree with the author's base premise for the article, I disagree with his end-game. Now unfortunately for America, our society and government is wholly unwilling to do some of the simple things we could do right away that other countries do that would DRAMATICALLY reduce school expenditures while instilling some good values in kids. One of my favorite examples is Japan. Overall they use ONE model for school buildings. Costs to build new schools are a FRACTION of what costs are here. Here in America, seems that every new gilded school has a fancy renowned architect, has nothing but the best tech, beautiful finishings, and after years upon years of review, committee approvals, so on and so forth, the work just goes to some administrator's buddy (good ol' boy system) who's a builder. Then you have an elementary school that costs millions. Another thing the Japanese (and most Asian countries) also don't bother with is janitors! (more reduced costs) That's right. The KIDS do all the cleaning. No matter how little. Makes little Billy-san think twice before being mischievous. Think we're willing to do any of this stuff? I am 100%. Most people aren't, though. Wife taught briefly in both Nepal and Korea as well as being a US public school teacher for ages. I've visited and learned a ton about Japanese schools before. It's fascinating to see the contrasts. We could learn a LOT from our friends across the Pacific.

It reminds me of healthcare. Another contentious topic. We always say "Well look how THOSE countries offer affordable healthcare!" Well, same story. IF we were willing to approach things just like they do on a base level, then we could totally do it and even the playing field as the author of this article wants in regard to education. But again, our society is unwilling to do things how they do. Until we're willing, I'm not sure I think we can do too much about it. Bummer, but it's the present reality.

[sb]

Better people will fix MERICA.

[Timberridge]

^^^Perhaps we can invite the Japanese, Germans and whoever else you people believe do things so much better than we do to come over and fix it for us? They own our bonds so they should have a vested interest in fixing everything.

[old goat]

The answers are very simple--living minimum wage, affordable public college education, nationwide K-12 education funding (not tied to property tax base), universally available subsidized pre-school and after school programs, vocational education for the non-academically-inclined, adequate pay for teachers, universal affordable health care, adequate mass transit. How to pay for it all?--steeply progressive income tax, eliminate the capital gains preference, a wealth tax on global assets of citizens. Achieving all this is simply a matter of the 90% opening their eyes, getting off their asses and voting for the right candidates They need to stop swallowing the bullshit that what matters are guns, abortion, and homosexuality--the crap that has people voting for the favored candidates of the wealthy and big corporations. The 90% should be able to outvote the 10%, no? If they don't they deserve what they get.

[FLS]

The answers are very simple--living minimum wage, affordable public college education, nationwide K-12 education funding (not tied to property tax base), universally available subsidized pre-school and after school programs, vocational education for the non-academically-inclined, adequate pay for teachers, universal affordable health care, adequate mass transit. How to pay for it all?--steeply progressive income tax, eliminate the capital gains preference, a wealth tax on global assets of citizens. Achieving all this is simply a matter of the 90% opening their eyes, getting off their asses and voting for the right candidates They need to stop swallowing the bullshit that what matters are guns, abortion, and homosexuality--the crap that has people voting for the favored candidates of the wealthy and big corporations. The 90% should be able to outvote the 10%, no? If they don't they deserve what they get.

Now you've done it.

[liv2ski]

The answers are very simple--living minimum wage, affordable public college education, nationwide K-12 education funding (not tied to property tax base), universally available subsidized pre-school and after school programs, vocational education for the non-academically-inclined, adequate pay for teachers, universal affordable health care, adequate mass transit. How to pay for it all?--steeply progressive income tax, eliminate the capital gains preference, a wealth tax on global assets of citizens. Achieving all this is simply a matter of the 90% opening their eyes, getting off their asses and voting for the right candidates They need to stop swallowing the bullshit that what matters are guns, abortion, and homosexuality--the crap that has people voting for the favored candidates of the wealthy and big corporations. The 90% should be able to outvote the 10%, no? If they don't they deserve what they get.

Quoted for truth. I honestly hate the term "living minimum wage", as in my mind everyone deserves better than that, but I guess it would be a step in the right direction rather than where we are at. And while I am wishing, much better "Public Health" services for the mentally ill and "Housing First" for all that want a better life.

[SumJongGuy]

The answers are very simple--living minimum wage, affordable public college education, nationwide K-12 education funding (not tied to property tax base), universally available subsidized pre-school and after school programs, vocational education for the non-academically-inclined, adequate pay for teachers, universal affordable health care, adequate mass transit. How to pay for it all?--steeply progressive income tax, eliminate the capital gains preference, a wealth tax on global assets of citizens. Achieving all this is simply a matter of the 90% opening their eyes, getting off their asses and voting for the right candidates They need to stop swallowing the bullshit that what matters are guns, abortion, and homosexuality--the crap that has people voting for the favored candidates of the wealthy and big corporations. The 90% should be able to outvote the 10%, no? If they don't they deserve what they get.

Why do you hate 'Murika you commie bastard??

[SumJongGuy]

^^^Perhaps we can invite the Japanese, Germans and whoever else you people believe do things so much better than we do to come over and fix it for us? They own our bonds so they should have a vested interest in fixing everything.

The irony is that we had a pretty key role in rebuilding their sociopolitical and educational systems after WWII. if only we were still practicing what we preached...

[I've seen black diamonds!]

vocational education for the non-academically-inclined

Great post except for this part. The general failure of vocational education in the US stems from A) it's being used as a method of segregating schools along class and race lines and B) the huge status differential between what is viewed as "academic" and "unacademic." A technical high school can't be merely a dumping ground. You wan't to write code for a living? Be an engineer? A pharmacist? You need vocational training. The only way a "vocational" track can really succeed is if the children of wealthy families have reasons to choose that track over the "academic" one. Otherwise it remains just another way of perpetuating the division of social classes.

[I've seen black diamonds!]

The irony is that we had a pretty key role in rebuilding their sociopolitical and educational systems after WWII. if only we were still practicing what we preached...

The difference we should look at is not so much what happens in schools, but who dictates policy. Different places/ people/ cultures having different approaches to schooling is fine. That's how it should be. It's having politicians drive education policy that is insane.

In Singapore about 75% of the population is ethnic Chinese. Chinese folks, as you probably know, eat quite a bit of pork. About 15% of the population is Muslim and 5% Hindu. Schools don't serve pork or beef. Why? Researchers determined that food was a source of conflict that was damaging school communities. Education policy makers (who were actually trained to be education policy makers) listened. "You all can eat pork at home," they said, "but at school we treat everyone and their beliefs with respect." It was a simple move that was credited with making a significant positive difference.

In the US? Texas politicians determined, at some point, that US History textbooks shouldn't use the word "slave" and they shouldn't mention the KKK either. Of course, publishers don't want to create different books for every State, and Texas is a big one, so quite a few States use books designed with Texas in mind. Even if you assembled a group of the most conservative history professors in the UT system to create textbook guidelines, they wouldn't come close to producing the idiocy conjured up by the politicians. And just imagine if they had made the "radical" move of incorporating multiple viewpoints?

Another example: When Reagan was in office congress commissioned a broad study of the American education system that produced a report known as "A Nation at Risk." It claimed that average SAT test scores had been going down since the mid 1960's. Some folks at the Sandia National Labs were asked to review and summarize the report. They quickly pointed out that the statistical basis of the report was deeply flawed. It was full of bad math. What had changed wasn't so much the scores, but who was taking the test. Within broad racial and socioeconomic groups scores had, in fact, been going up. But more lower-income, minority and bilingual students were taking the test. The Sandia folks were quickly told that if they shared their findings they would all be fired. "A Nation at Risk" remains a highly influential document to this day, even though every respectable statistician knows it is a pile of garbage.

[SumJongGuy]

A statistical analysis of historical SAT scores over time full of bad math?? If that isn't shining light on the impact of the problem I don't know what can..

[ncskier]

There are a bunch of cynics here. That's for sure. Most of the kids I meet today are smart. Really smart and put my dumb ass to shame at the same age. Most if not all have all the information ever known by the human race in their pockets. They can access it for next to nothing every month. It's all right there. You could practically teach yourself to be a plumber with youtube. Years ago that knowledge was protected by evil cabals like "masons" the literal type, not the get drunk away from the wives type. Now you can learn how to lay a brick and not apprentice yourself for your childhood.
As for the middle class, I'd argue it was a blip for a short period of time in America. We helped destroy and bombed the crap out of almost all the industrialized producers in the world. We were literally the only game in town for decades. So America had it good letting most people have manufacturing jobs. Later, we thought everyone could go to college and get middle manager jobs. We found out now with a pile of debt that it's not for everyone.
Years ago an economist said the only path to prosperity is to make it, mine it or grow it. America seemed to want to just push piles of money around since at least the 70's.
I don't know the answers now, but we are for sure at an inflection point. I guess maybe learn to snake a toilet or repair air conditioners. Even the fat wealthy patriarchs are not going to want their toilet backed up or sweat too uncomfortably on their yachts.

[old goat]

Great post except for this part. The general failure of vocational education in the US stems from A) it's being used as a method of segregating schools along class and race lines and B) the huge status differential between what is viewed as "academic" and "unacademic." A technical high school can't be merely a dumping ground. You wan't to write code for a living? Be an engineer? A pharmacist? You need vocational training. The only way a "vocational" track can really succeed is if the children of wealthy families have reasons to choose that track over the "academic" one. Otherwise it remains just another way of perpetuating the division of social classes.

You're right about how vocational training was used in the past in America. I'm thinking about the kind of vocational training that is common in Europe, especially Germany, or the kind of vocational training that was in my HS, Cass Tech in Detroit, that had 22 academic, vocational, and arts programs, or the mechatronics program at Sierra College whose graduates are in high demand as ski lift technicians, or the electrician apprenticeship program my son's HS friend with no college degree is doing. Or the training our college educated plumber got working his way through dental school until he decided he'd rather be a very well educated plumber. There is a huge demand for skilled people in the construction trades and other skilled blue collar jobs--the kinds of jobs that can't easily be outsourced. When you're a billionaire high tech exec and your $5000 Japanese toilet won't flush you'll be shit out of luck if there's no one to fix it.

The point isn't the specific measures that need to be taken as that people need to wake up to where their economic interests lie and vote accordingly. They need to realize that the interests of the great majority of Americans are the same, regardless of race and ethnicity, gender identity, and religion. Values are important, but values issues aren't settled at the ballot box, where they're a smoke screen for the issues that are actually settled there. Workers of the world unite--so I guess that makes me a commie.

Right now the most hopeful thing in politics is the growth of small donation funding.

[SumJongGuy]

I don't know the answers now, but we are for sure at an inflection point. I guess maybe learn to snake a toilet or repair air conditioners. Even the fat wealthy patriarchs are not going to want their toilet backed up or sweat too uncomfortably on their yachts.

If the task can be taught to any reasonably capable human via a YouTube video or 5 then bet your bottom dollar that 50 years from now robots will be doing it and not paid humans. Same goes for just about everything and owning that infrastructure will be the only way to get paid. We have two choices at that fork in the road. Choice A involves super high taxes on those infrastructure owners to provide universal basic income to everyone regardless of other income capabilities the general public may have. Choice B will be a bloodbath on a global scale never before seen in human history.

[ncskier]

If the task can be taught to any reasonably capable human via a YouTube video or 5 then bet your bottom dollar that 50 years from now robots will be doing it and not paid humans. Same goes for just about everything and owning that infrastructure will be the only way to get paid. We have two choices at that fork in the road. Choice A involves super high taxes on those infrastructure owners to provide universal basic income to everyone regardless of other income capabilities the general public may have. Choice B will be a bloodbath on a global scale never before seen in human history.

If you lived in Europe between 1914 and 1945 you've already seen it.

[4matic]

A $20 million bond passed at my local Community College ten years ago. The money was wasted. They got new buildings and facilities that are poorly maintained now. The tenured instructors are working at 60% load and have adjuncts to carry their slack. The school is now $8 million over budget and just now telling instructors they might have to teach more to meet the requirement of their contract.

[SumJongGuy]

If you lived in Europe between 1914 and 1945 you've already seen it.

Worse and global rather than only half of the world..

[I've seen black diamonds!]

vocational training that is common in Europe, especially Germany

That is pretty much exactly what I described, right down to using the word "technical" over "vocational." What I specifically took issue with was your use of the term "non-academically-inclined" which, I think, reflects the perverse way in which we assign status to certain professions. It also reflects the myth that certain groups of people don't value education (we know, for example, that "Black" and "Hispanic" parents believe in the value of a college education for their children more than "White" parents despite common rhetoric that asserts the opposite). In California in particular vocational schools were a dumping ground for allegedly non-academically-inclined Spanish speaking (and looking) students after the Mendez v. Westminster ruling outlawed separate schools for Mexican-American students.

Part of the reason the German model works is that status differential between with the "academic" and "technical" tracks is negligible. This certainly hasn't been the case in the US, even in instances in which vocational education has been done relatively well.