The Official Salomon S/Lab SHIFT MNC Thread -AMA

**TahoeJ** · 02-21-2018, 10:04 AM

Originally Posted by margotron

Would it be fair to say you're approaching this from the direction that you want to add slackcountry versatility to inbound setups rather than add inbound versatility to backcountry setups?

That's my POV. With brakes the Shift still weighs 900 grams, nearly a pound heavier than Tectons and a lot more than dynafits. Still, that weight total is impressive for what it does.

**anotherVTskibum** · 02-21-2018, 10:06 AM

Originally Posted by margotron

Would it be fair to say you're approaching this from the direction that you want to add slackcountry versatility to inbound setups rather than add inbound versatility to backcountry setups?

And hopefully cut my quiver by a pair, as well. The all-mountain, primarily inbounds skis could also be a good tool for aggressive b/c skiing where my lighter-weight touring setup gets bounced around in scary ways; right now, I'm trying to solve that with the Tecton-mounted Bighorn 96s and skiing Lhasas with STH14s inbounds, but if I can consolidate those two pairs to one pair of all-mountain skis with Shifts, that would make me rather happy. Last summer, before I bought the Bighorns, I spent a fair number of days bootpacking with the Lhasas on my back because they're a much more reliable ski for couloir chasing than my Huascarans are.

**Judo Chop!** · 02-21-2018, 12:14 PM

Originally Posted by margotron

Would it be fair to say you're approaching this from the direction that you want to add slackcountry versatility to inbound setups rather than add inbound versatility to backcountry setups?

Isn't that the point?
I think these are just supposed to replace the use-case for frame bindings. Just that we all stopped using those early because they sucked.

**margotron** · 02-21-2018, 12:22 PM

Originally Posted by Judo Chop!

Isn't that the point?
I think these are just supposed to replace the use-case for frame bindings. Just that we all stopped using those early because they sucked.

Heh. I am perhaps stupidly considering them as a pair for intro to backcountry that I can use inbounds too.

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**adrenalated** · 02-21-2018, 12:30 PM

Originally Posted by margotron

Heh. I am perhaps stupidly considering them as a pair for intro to backcountry that I can use inbounds too.

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This would be a great use for the Shift, IMO

**Judo Chop!** · 02-21-2018, 12:31 PM

Originally Posted by margotron

Heh. I am perhaps stupidly considering them as a pair for intro to backcountry that I can use inbounds too.

sounds like that would work fine.

personally I plan to swap a few kingpins and alpine binders for Shift. I mostly ski resort-and-slackcountry, or sledski/sled-access-tour. so It's perfect for me, if it performs as promised. Ever since I got a sled, I don't see much point in super long tour days.

**Banh Mi** · 02-21-2018, 01:06 PM

Damnit. I am ready to buy a set of touring binders, and I just wanna get these instead of Tectons, but of course I have to wait until fall.

Looks like tectons it is..

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**margotron** · 02-21-2018, 01:15 PM

Originally Posted by Judo Chop!

sounds like that would work fine.

personally I plan to swap a few kingpins and alpine binders for Shift. I mostly ski resort-and-slackcountry, or sledski/sled-access-tour. so It's perfect for me, if it performs as promised. Ever since I got a sled, I don't see much point in super long tour days.

Elaborate on the sled angle?

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**Name Redacted** · 02-21-2018, 01:19 PM

Originally Posted by Betelgeuse

Damnit. I am ready to buy a set of touring binders, and I just wanna get these instead of Tectons, but of course I have to wait until fall.

Looks like tectons it is..

This is where I'm at. Even if I did buy in fall, it's first gen and I'm not that dumb. I'll wait a few years. Looks like a nice idea though if they hold up to testing on the public.

**jacob_dbu** · 02-21-2018, 01:28 PM

Originally Posted by shredgnar

This is where I'm at. Even if I did buy in fall, it's first gen and I'm not that dumb. I'll wait a few years. Looks like a nice idea though if they hold up to testing on the public.

Maybe but also a ton of the Salomon pros have been skiing this for a while now. And the Tecton has its own qualms.

I actually think that the Shift is surprisingly simple since it doesn't need to rely on pins for the downhill. Though it is very possible that durability could be an issue.

**TahoeJ** · 02-21-2018, 01:52 PM

Originally Posted by margotron

Heh. I am perhaps stupidly considering them as a pair for intro to backcountry that I can use inbounds too.

Pretty sure that's a huge portion of their target demo. Now people won't be stuck with shitty frame bindings.

**Name Redacted** · 02-21-2018, 02:07 PM

Originally Posted by thejongiest

Maybe but also a ton of the Salomon pros have been skiing this for a while now.

You realize that's how everyone does it right? It's called R&D.

**concretejungle** · 02-21-2018, 02:08 PM

Originally Posted by shredgnar

You realize that's how everyone does it right? It's called R&D.

I'm not arguing but it certainly isn't how everyone does it.

I'm in line for a pair either next year or the year after.

**anotherVTskibum** · 02-21-2018, 02:24 PM

Originally Posted by margotron

Elaborate on the sled angle?

My two cents, Judo Chop may have a different opinion, but:

If over-snow motorized travel is allowed, a sled allows one to avoid long, asspain slogs on relatively flat approaches (the places where lightweight touring gear is most beneficial). Ride to the bottom of your intended line, boot or skin up, ski back to the sled (in the simplest case), or with two sleds, two people, and sufficiently friendly terrain, shuttle to the top of the run.

Having skinning capability is still strongly recommended both because you often can't get the sled right to the top of the line and because it's a real good idea to have an alternate exit plan when the sled decides not to work (or your buddy drives it into a tree).

**Name Redacted** · 02-21-2018, 02:29 PM

Originally Posted by concretejungle

I'm not arguing but it certainly isn't how everyone does it.

I'm in line for a pair either next year or the year after.

Fair enough, but don't you think most companies have their pros test new tech before releasing it to the market? I'm just not into market testing new tech for them. Sure the pros will have worked out some of the kinks, but shit will break, and first gen users will be the first ones to find out about it.

**Judo Chop!** · 02-21-2018, 02:31 PM

Originally Posted by anotherVTskibum

My two cents, Judo Chop may have a different opinion, but:

If over-snow motorized travel is allowed, a sled allows one to avoid long, asspain slogs on relatively flat approaches (the places where lightweight touring gear is most beneficial). Ride to the bottom of your intended line, boot or skin up, ski back to the sled (in the simplest case), or with two sleds, two people, and sufficiently friendly terrain, shuttle to the top of the run.

Having skinning capability is still strongly recommended both because you often can't get the sled right to the top of the line and because it's a real good idea to have an alternate exit plan when the sled decides not to work (or your buddy drives it into a tree).

yup

plus we have a lifetime worth of sick sled-accessed skiing around here and I've only scratched the surface. I'll probably get a light&fast touring setup again sometime. but not now.
Shift should serve me well for a while. and it should be manageable for the odd full schlog days I'll get. better walking boots make more difference than a few extra 100g on a ski anyways.

I don't think shifts replace light full tech bindings. but I do think they look much better than everything from frame to kingpin/techton for my needs.

**concretejungle** · 02-21-2018, 03:05 PM

Originally Posted by shredgnar

Fair enough, but don't you think most companies have their pros test new tech before releasing it to the market? I'm just not into market testing new tech for them. Sure the pros will have worked out some of the kinks, but shit will break, and first gen users will be the first ones to find out about it.

I agree but my experience was with soft goods and not having a dedicated factory (like why Osprey moved to Vietnam). The good news is Solly probably has more athletes than most companies. Does anyone know if they can make bindings in house or quickly enough to test a bunch?

**jacob_dbu** · 02-21-2018, 03:54 PM

Originally Posted by shredgnar

Fair enough, but don't you think most companies have their pros test new tech before releasing it to the market? I'm just not into market testing new tech for them. Sure the pros will have worked out some of the kinks, but shit will break, and first gen users will be the first ones to find out about it.

I'm not sure what industry you work in but you would be surprised by the lack of testing or oversights that occur. Testing is insanely time intensive.

Can you name BD / Fritischi ski pros who use their gear 100+ days a year? I don't know a single one. More than likely they've got their employees out on them. How many employees do they have using this binding? Matt Mansers team at Atomic for ALL boot models is 12 people. Who have full time jobs.

I'm a fair weather content watcher but I can rattle off almost 10 Salomon pros who seem to always be skiing.

**Name Redacted** · 02-21-2018, 03:59 PM

Originally Posted by thejongiest

I'm not sure what industry you work in but you would be surprised by the lack of testing or oversights that occur. Testing is insanely time intensive.

Can you name BD / Fritischi ski pros who use their gear 100+ days a year? I don't know a single one. More than likely they've got their employees out on them. How many employees do they have using this binding? Matt Mansers team at Atomic for ALL boot models is 12 people. Who have full time jobs.

I'm a fair weather content watcher but I can rattle off almost 10 Salomon pros who seem to always be skiing.

I knew a few Burton pros and they spent all winter in NZ testing various boot, binding, board models. If snowboarders can pull it off, skier should be able to. I really don't pay attention to who's pro for who, I'm too old for that shit anymore. I know some guy named Hoji seems to get a lot of press.

**jacob_dbu** · 02-21-2018, 04:32 PM

Originally Posted by shredgnar

I knew a few Burton pros and they spent all winter in NZ testing various boot, binding, board models. If snowboarders can pull it off, skier should be able to. I really don't pay attention to who's pro for who, I'm too old for that shit anymore. I know some guy named Hoji seems to get a lot of press.

Yeah I mean I'm just speculating myself. But I guess time will tell! I'll tell ya I'm getting this binding as soon as it comes out though. It'll help keep the quiver smaller as I travel to the mountains.

**LightRanger** · 02-21-2018, 04:46 PM

Originally Posted by thejongiest

Can you name BD / Fritischi ski pros who use their gear 100+ days a year? I don't know a single one. More than likely they've got their employees out on them. How many employees do they have using this binding? Matt Mansers team at Atomic for ALL boot models is 12 people. Who have full time jobs.

I'm a fair weather content watcher but I can rattle off almost 10 Salomon pros who seem to always be skiing.

You're newish around here, but I assume you've seen the Thin Cover-Salomon tech fitting debacle thread from a few years back? Nobody is immune from potential first generation product issues. Not saying it will happen with the Shift, but peoples' caution around here is based on years of observations of products from a wide range of companies.

**hercule33** · 02-21-2018, 05:03 PM

Originally Posted by thejongiest

I'm not sure what industry you work in but you would be surprised by the lack of testing or oversights that occur. Testing is insanely time intensive.

Can you name BD / Fritischi ski pros who use their gear 100+ days a year? I don't know a single one. More than likely they've got their employees out on them. How many employees do they have using this binding? Matt Mansers team at Atomic for ALL boot models is 12 people. Who have full time jobs.

I'm a fair weather content watcher but I can rattle off almost 10 Salomon pros who seem to always be skiing.

Depends how you define a pro. Many backcountry bindings are tested by guides who ski 100 backcountry days a season in many different conditions and know how a backcountry binding is supposed to perform.

**LightRanger** · 02-21-2018, 05:06 PM

Originally Posted by hercule33

Depends how you define a pro. Many backcountry bindings are tested by guides who ski 100 backcountry days a season in many different conditions and know what a backcountry binding is supposed to perform.

Exhibit A: https://www.proguiding.com/triprepor...i-tecton-test/