try not to drown, bike, run (sprint tri RR)

**Vinman** · 06-19-2005, 01:49 PM

Today was the first open water event I have done out the the, now 3 tris I have raced. It was sprint distance 600/14/3.1 held at Lake Dunmore/ Branbury State Park, VT.

I learned a very valuable open water lesson today. Forcast called for sun and 70 deg. Turned out to be 60, overcast and windy which led to cold water with chop blowing in from my right (breathing side). I have done this distance and much more in the pool and in open water practice in calm conditions. But I have never had to contend with choppy water. I was a bit nervous about the mass start (about 30-40 in my wave) so I stayed to the outside, which also might have been a mistake as there were no bodies between me and the incoming chop. The first leg of the rectangular course went well, swimming directly into the wind, but as soon as I made the first turn and the chop was coming in from my right side and I could not get a breath without a mouthful of water. I freaked big time. I started gasping for air and wheezing, my arms felt like lead with lead weights attached to them in the cold water. My wetsuit might have been too tight at the collar also or felt that way anyway. I ended up roling onto my back and kicking for much of the 2nd leg as I just could not get out of panic mode. Needless to say I struggled badly until the second turn and the chop was then on my left and could swim to the beach. So a planned 9 minute 600 yds turned into 18+ minutes of panic and struggle. I do have the ability to breathe from my left but I was so paniced that I did not even think of it. I seriously I might drown have had it not been for the wetsuit keeping me floating.

After I gained my feet and got to T1 everything else went as planned with an ~21 mph average over 14 miles on the bike and a decent 5K run for a total time of 1:24:and change. I don't have the exact splits or my place within the field as I left before the final results were up. The are supposed to be up later tonight on the web. Had I not paniced during the swim I could have cut close to 10 minutes off that time and been towards the top of the field and my age group. ON the bright side of being very slow in the swim, I did not get passed by a single person once I left T1, passed probably 50 or more on the bike and 15 or so on the run.

Oh well like I said chalk it up to experience, learning from my mistakes and knowing what to do next time.

**crashnburn'd** · 06-19-2005, 02:08 PM

Congrats on not drowning. You need to add some fat to your body so you float better. I can help with the training for that if you need me to.

**Laps** · 06-20-2005, 08:08 AM

Are you going to do any of the Shelburne sprint tris? I have been thinking about it, but have just stuck to riding and running.

**Vinman** · 06-20-2005, 08:47 AM

I might do one of those later in Aug. It is actually the olympic distance race that I'm looking at. Aug 28.

**Laps** · 06-20-2005, 08:53 AM

I want to do that one as well, but I want to try one of the sprints first. I have done duathalons, but nothing with swimming. How difficult is it to go from pool laps to open water distance?

**bigsugar** · 06-20-2005, 09:01 AM

Right on....I'm planning on doing my first Tri at the end of July, with the swimming leg being in Lake Superior, which means it will be as cold as shit. I just got my wetsuit but I am not used to swimming in it yet. I will definitely keep what you said in mind as far as weather and preparedness.

**Laps** · 06-20-2005, 09:22 AM

What kind of wetsuit? I have one for surfing (3/2) and I am not sure if I will need one, but is there a specialized suit?

**Vinman** · 06-20-2005, 10:09 AM

open water swimming is definitely different. No walls to push off or rest on, but at the same time it lets you get into a groove with your stroke. As far as wetsuits go, triathlon wetsuits are different from surfing wetsuits in how they are built and what type of rubber they are built with. They also fit differently as they are designed for more shoulder movement and swimming and they also fit more snugly than surf wetsuits.

You won't need a wetsuit for all races, and for some races they are not allowed depending on water temp. Wetsuits make swimming easier for a couple reasons. They hold you in a better position in the water (more horizontle, floats your legs and hips more/ less form drag), they are smoother than your own skin (less friction drag) and they hold you higher in the water so less water to swim through.

**Laps** · 06-20-2005, 10:57 AM

I figured my wetsuit must be cut differently, and probably thicker than most tri wetsuits. Where did you get your suit? Not sure I need one, but I am going to try and train outdoors, (too cheap to pay for a gym membership during the summer)

**Vinman** · 06-20-2005, 12:32 PM

Originally Posted by Laps

Where did you get your suit?

www.tribonzai.com

Check the wetsuit closeout section for some good deals on wetsuits. I bought the 2002 ironman stealth sleeveless.

Sleeveless is easier to get the right fit without trying it on, but is slower in the water and just a little colder as not everything is covered up and more water gets in.

Check the instint sleeveless for $100. If the sizing is right you really can't go wrong.

**Laps** · 06-20-2005, 12:41 PM

Do I really need a wetsuit, or should I just tough it out in walnut smugglers no matter what?
Thanks for the link. Do you think tri shorts are worth the investment, or do you just go with bike shorts for the run and bike?

**Cornholio** · 06-20-2005, 01:46 PM

Originally Posted by Laps

Do you think tri shorts are worth the investment, or do you just go with bike shorts for the run and bike?

Tri shorts are the *most padded* you should wear. Full-on bike shorts are chafe prone and slow for the run. Get 'em wet and go run for a bit if you're curious. You'll see most pros just going speedos for the whole thing. Lots of folks wear bike shorts, though, so maybe they work better than I think.

Do I really need a wetsuit, or should I just tough it out in walnut smugglers no matter what?

The wetsuit is somewhat faster, no question, but only has a net gain in swims over 1000m, in my opinion. Even the fastest T1 with a wetsuit will be 30-40 seconds longer, and most likely somewhat longer than that. The worse you are at swimming, the more important the suit becomes, though.

**Cornholio** · 06-20-2005, 01:52 PM

And, Vinnie-man-- Congrats on your tri!

One thing that works in waves is to use people as wave breakers. Next time it's shitty like that, set up alongside someone and just a little back, like when you're in an echelon on the bike. When you're swimming it to it, just get right behind someone and save yourself some effort. You know you're in the right spot if you hit his feet every handful of strokes. If he gives you a breaststroke kick, you're probably too close.

**SkiOrDie** · 06-20-2005, 05:52 PM

This info is pretty old, from a pretty old guy, but when I used to swim open cold water I always did it with a "Farmer John" wetsuit. This has no shoulder or arm covers of any kind. I found that my arms and shoulders, which were doing almost all the work, didn't get cold anyway and that bending the wetsuit material (no matter how soft or how it was cut) always took a lot more energy than having no wet suit at all. Give a Farmer John (Looks like a tank top) a try, and get it snug on your chest and legs.

Second, the tip to let someone else lead is EXACTLY right - why break trail when you don't have to???? The goal should be to get to the beach second and kick the first place guy on the bike ride, cuz he's tired from breaking trail for you all the way around on the swim.

Congrats on doing a tri!!! Very Very Very COOL!

**Vinman** · 06-20-2005, 07:51 PM

The results are up I was 41st overall and 8th in my age group. SO not as bad as I feared but 10 mintues faster would have put me in the top 20.

Splits
Swim 18:25
Bike 42:59 transition 1 included
Run 23:09 transition 2 included

Total 1:24:33

Overall time for the race were pretty slow due to the choppy water and the wind on the bike course. Fastest swim was a 9:08 which for that distance is pretty slow considering the rest of the splits for the winners.

**SkiingBear** · 06-20-2005, 08:18 PM

Congrats on the tri...always feels good to complete one. I'm hoping to get in a few more myself this summer.

Drafting on the swim is important no matter what the conditions (rough/choppy or calm/smooth). Most people don't realize that you can draft in the water just like drafting on a bike. If you watch competitive swimming (i.e. olympics), pay attention to which side of the lanes people swim on. You'll see them pick a side based on who's closing in on them.

There are a couple of 1/2 Iron-Man events later this year in VT and NH. Check those out if you really want to see people punishing themselves (not sure if there's a full Iron-Man option too).

**Plakespear** · 06-20-2005, 08:23 PM

Originally Posted by Laps

Do I really need a wetsuit, or should I just tough it out in walnut smugglers no matter what?

Although I don't do Tri's (I only run for Bobby Van

), I surf. And Since I surf in NY and NJ, a wetsuit is essential if you want to surf more than 3 months out of the year.

Water temps below 63 degrees are fucking COLD. Most people use wetsuits until the water temps hit 67 degrees or so. In 55 Degree water, which many bodies are still hovering at this time of year, especially in places near skking, NOT using a wetsuit migh cost you time from shivering.

SkiingBear- there's a full on Ironman in Lake Placid. That's the big one for the Northeast.

**SkiingBear** · 06-20-2005, 09:39 PM

I found the dates of the two I was thinking of:

TimberMan Half Iron Triathlon
8/21
Gilford, NH

Half Vermont Journey
8/28
Salisbury, VT

Both are Half-Ironman (Tin-Man) distance.
1.2-mi swim, 56-mi bike, 13.1-mi run

Here's the date for the full Ironman in Lake Placid:

Ironman USA Lake Placid
7/24
Lake Placid, NY

**Laps** · 06-21-2005, 05:52 AM

Yeah, I don't think I would brave any semi-public outing in a speedo, not really my thing. I checked out that website, and my suit (sleeveless) is on the way.
These are the tris at Shelburne beach, if you are interested, Vin.
http://www.racevermont.com/schedule.htm

**Vinman** · 06-21-2005, 07:24 AM

Water temps at lastnights tri club swim practice were effing cold. Prolly around 65. We've had a lot of rain and overcast skies since last weeks practice and it was definitely cold.

As for other Race I'm doing this year, I'm thinking of Doing an international distance race in Fairlee in 3 weeks on 7/10 or the olympic distance at Lake Dunmore on the same day (Vermont State Tri). After that Maybe either another sprint or Oly distance later in July or Aug. After that I'll be done for the season.

If things work out I'll be going over to Lake Placid to watch.

Its crazy but I'm thinking of doing an Ironman next summer. I guess I'll see how these ID and oly distance races go before I commit. You have to sign up about a year in advance for most IM races these days.

**SkiingBear** · 06-21-2005, 07:42 AM

It's funny the temps that people call cold. Here in Utah, people freak out about water temps if it's below 74 degrees. My first tri, the water was around 72 degrees, so I didn't wear a wetsuit. People looked at me like I was out of my mind.

I think I remember someone on my high school swim team telling me that 67 degrees was the optimum temperature for swimming. He was a state qualifier every year that I knew him, so I really have no reason to doubt him, but I've never researched it myself.

Vinman, if you're interested in a Half-Ironman, I think my brother and I are headed down to St Croix for their race next spring. Maybe we could put together a maggot contingent to race?

**Vinman** · 06-21-2005, 07:50 AM

Originally Posted by SkiingBear

Vinman, if you're interested in a Half-Ironman, I think my brother and I are headed down to St Croix for their race next spring. Maybe we could put together a maggot contingent to race?

I could prolly talk the wife into St. Croix

But it would have to time out perfectly with my vacation from work so not sure that is possible. Plus in the spring I am less than fit for tri type activities. But if I want to do an IM I guess I'll have to train in the winter this year.

**Laps** · 06-21-2005, 07:55 AM

Winter training is definitely doable, anyone who runs the VCM has to start training in January. It is also good to have something to do during the winter when it is dark at 4:30 I lived in Stowe two years ago, trained at the swimming hole (weeknights, only one weekend, BIG mistake) They have everything you would need Vin.

**Vinman** · 06-21-2005, 08:08 AM

The only thing about training in winter is, well training in winter. Most of my "extra" time goes to skiing and I'm less than motivated for getting on the treadmill or bike trainer.

Work has all of the necessary tools for me to train, pool, treadmill etc but I hate working out indoors. I guees I'll cross that bridge when I get there.