Fu*king Cyclists

[FLS]

Isnt this supposed to be a winter enthusiast site....What about the snowboarders??

[sb]

[summit]

depends on the town and place but lowering the speed limit in towns absolutely saves lives and makes streets a more pleasant place to walk and live.

35mph is generally found on major streets without major pedestrian traffic with fewer residences. Why do you want to turn traffic arteries into pedestrian thoroughfares?

Dropping the speed limit 43% will also reduce the traffic capacity of the road by 20%, so even in light traffic it takes longer longer to drive, but you will have far more frequent traffic jams. How is that for "pleasant to walk and live?" Also, you are going to shunt traffic onto small residential streets... but to hell with those people right? At least the cars jammed up in front of your SoDoSoPa Loft will be going slower.

Also, fuel economy drops 15-40% when you drive 20mph instead of 35mph.



So we are going to burn more gas, waste more time, have more traffic jams, all in order to make major roads more pleasant for bikes and pedestrians?

Similarly, if bikes are forcing cars to putter along at 5m/h on a rural/mountain road, the cars are literally getting about 5mpg. The cyclists are causing a net increase in greenhouse emissions vs if they were driving a car instead of biking!

[Benny Profane]

This thread just warms my soul. Can't wait to get out and do some miles!

[joetron]

That is just asinine rationalization backed by a massive sense of entitlement.

"Cut speed limits virtually in half so that I can ride my bike! Fuck everyone else's time. It isn't as valuable as my biking."

People for Bikes is not advocating for wholesale reduction in speed limits in all urban or residential areas. I'm sure they'd acknowledge the need and utility of high speed arterial streets and highways. Part of what they are advocating for is safe and complete bicycle infrastructure in urban areas. Sometimes that includes lower speed limits on streets that parallel arterials to create safe cycling routes while also increasing the overall safety and quality of life in those neighborhoods.

Salt Lake City is full of streets that IMO should have lower speed limits. They are narrow, full of driveways and crosswalks and were never intended to carry the traffic loads or speeds that have evolved as the city has sprawled and grown more crowded.

[summit]

Part of what they are advocating for is safe and complete bicycle infrastructure in urban areas. Sometimes that includes lower speed limits on streets that parallel arterials

These streets do not typically have 35mph speed limits.

[muted]

I'm not a lawyer or advocate

We can tell, IMO you have weak logic and questionable points. Entitled bikers with poor logic like you make other bikers, like me, look bad.

As for reducing speed limits, they have done this on some SLC streets. From 35-40 to 20, and added bike lanes that are separated by curbs from traffic. The lanes are pretty much empty, and while I enjoy them a lot while biking, it has to piss off all the drivers who got their commuting streets go from two lanes to one, and a big drop in speed, for a non-existant bike commuting community.

Making a few streets like this in every city (some cities need more than a few) would be beneficial, but "most" streets like this???? It's a laughable concept to please the 1% of commuters, while the drivers pay probably 90% for the construction fees in taxes. That People for Bikes guy is a kook.

[AdironRider]

People for Bikes is not advocating for wholesale reduction in speed limits in all urban or residential areas. I'm sure they'd acknowledge the need and utility of high speed arterial streets and highways. Part of what they are advocating for is safe and complete bicycle infrastructure in urban areas. Sometimes that includes lower speed limits on streets that parallel arterials to create safe cycling routes while also increasing the overall safety and quality of life in those neighborhoods.

Salt Lake City is full of streets that IMO should have lower speed limits. They are narrow, full of driveways and crosswalks and were never intended to carry the traffic loads or speeds that have evolved as the city has sprawled and grown more crowded.

Now I can't take you seriously because SLC has probably the widest streets in the country. Something about pulling U turns with teams of oxen or some prophet told them so, but still, come on man.

[muted]

Now I can't take you seriously because SLC has probably the widest streets in the country. Something about pulling U turns with teams of oxen or some prophet told them so, but still, come on man.

They are like this downtown for sure. Near downtown though the roads are known for being narrow, built in the 50s and beyond, some don't even have sidewalks so we have pedestrians in the street in neighborhoods, like mine. I'm two houses from being in SLC.

[joetron]

Developing areas and infrastructure to optimize automobile usage while neglecting pedestrian, cyclist and other forms of transportation, particularly in urban and suburban area results in teh suck.

[joetron]

Now I can't take you seriously because SLC has probably the widest streets in the country. Something about pulling U turns with teams of oxen or some prophet told them so, but still, come on man.

That's just downtown where the original Plats of Zion dictated streets be wide enough flip a U with a team of oxen. Now we have massive streets with higher speed limits, but we also have a shit load of poorly timed stoplights. Downtown streets can be terrifying to cross, especially at mid-block crosswalks. Pedestrians get smoked on wide streets up and down the Wasatch Front.
South and east of downtown is full of roads that have 35-40mph streets that were once rural/semi rural and are now full of homes, schools and churches.....so many churches.

[BmillsSkier]

Isnt this supposed to be a winter enthusiast site....What about the snowboarders??

They are notoriously slow as shit in the flats/traverses. Keep to the right motherfuckers!

[BmillsSkier]

This thread just warms my soul. Can't wait to get out and do some miles!

I thought it would. With any luck we'll hit 10 pages before the weekend starts.

[strawjack]

I drive and I ride a bike on the road. As a driver I see plenty of asshole drivers (and suspect plenty of them see me that way). I also see plenty of asshole cyclists--mainly riding multiple abreast. As a cyclist I have to say that at least around here the average driver is far more considerate of cyclists than cyclists are of drivers. The law in CA is cyclists are to ride as far to the right as possible--that means single file unless you are both in a bike lane. Don't like the law--get it changed. You assholes who deliberately block traffic are making up your own rules--the very definition of egotism and self absorption. More importantly, by proving to drivers that cyclists are jerks, you are making it more dangerous for me to ride my bike.

Around here the big problem is Donner Pass Rd between the lake and the summit. Increasingly crowded going uphill with people who think they are racing up the Alpe d'Huez, at 2 MPH, literally. No shoulder in parts, double yellow with blind turns for 3 miles. So if I wait behind a cyclist, or cyclists my 10 min drive becomes one and a half hours, without exaggeration. Tough situation--I wish they would put some big parabolic mirrors on the outsides of the corners the way they do on mountain roads in Europe, so you could see when it was safe to pass the cyclists. (Coming down the bikes are often faster than the cars--couple years ago one of them hit a crack in the road and died.)

The funny thing about the video that started this post is that she's not the kind of cyclist most of us are thinking about.

^This.

I don't ride road, I ride dirt.

Unfortunately, road weenies (an affectionate term ) have a bad wrap around here because some are inconsiderate and break the road rules. Blow thru lights, stop signs, etc. They also do not understand how hard it is for some people to pass them safely. Not everyone is 25yrs old with perfect 20/20 vision and reflexes to maneuver around a group of people.

Bikers are on vacation. Many drivers are working and have deadlines and other concerns going on much more important.

When I see a biker on the other side of the road I move way over to give the vehicles trying to pass the biker some room. I make every effort to give the weenies as much room as possible, but I still think a bunch of them are assholes...some I know are assholes because I know them personally.

[GoldMember]

^^ Road toads is our local jargon...

[::: :::]

You'd be wrong
http://app.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx?cite=46.61.427

note the words "where passing is unsafe"
it does not apply everywhere

[snoqpass]

note the words "where passing is unsafe"
it does not apply everywhere

True but most of the time I've been around road bikers they seem to forget in this state when they are on the road they are required to obey the same rules as motorists. When coupled with their poor route choices like 55mph state routes with 12" or less of shoulder when there is alternatives I tend to be less than empathetic with their sport

[FormerKnuckleDragger]

Drive like it's your 12 year old daughter on the bike.

Bike like it's your 16 year old son driving the car.

Also, if your time is so valuable that you can't be bothered to stop at stop signs (cyclists) or wait until it's safe to pass (drivers), then you should have a private helicopter to fly you from place to place. Chill out and take care of each other out there.

[MultiVerse]

Bicycles as a form of travel are literally 1% of trips in the US. So yea, when we talk about entitled cyclists blocking traffic, this is literally the 1% crapping on the 99%. When we are talking about bikers on mountain passes and the like, we are almost certainly talking about people using public roadways for exercise rather than travel.

I'm all for bike lanes and bike paths. I have plenty of friends and family who have been hit on the roads. Riding on roads scares me. I feel safer on dirt.

Your article says that people using public roadways for active travel to work has declined sharply in the United States over the past few decades especially among women, children, and seniors and then links this decline in physical activity to increasing health problems like diabetes and obesity.

With all the anger and fear expressed in this thread is the sense of entitlement that roads should only be used by cars and trucks a big contributor all of this?

[snoqpass]

With all the anger and fear expressed in this thread is the sense of entitlement that roads should only be used by cars and trucks a big contributor to this?

Nope, too many Americans are fat lazy fucks to begin with

[iceman]

People should simply be considerate, it's not that hard. Ride single file and towards the right in areas with narrow roads and poor sightlines. Cars pass when you can see what's coming. It's the assholes on both sides who cause the issues. Don't be an asshole.

With that said, if bikes want to be considered vehicles they need to obey the rules of the road. This includes stopping at stop signs and lights, and pulling off the road if their presence is impeding traffic to the point that it is backing up behind them. And wtf is this about a peloton being considered "one vehicle"? That is ludicrous. If I'm in a line of cars can we be considered one vehicle too? Please?

Obviously cars need to obey the laws as well.

[PNWbrit]

[snoqpass]

http://youtube.com/watch?v=UrgpZ0fUixs

[hutash]

Why should cyclists ever be able to ignore the rules of the road?

I never said they should be able to ignore the rules of the road. Unless you have never exceeded a speed limit, or rolled a stop sign, you are just another self center douche this thread is railing against.

Can't speak for other states but in CA bicycles are subject to all the rights, rules and restrictions that cars are except where naturally applicable, i.e. can't do the speed limit, so Ice's comment is stupid as shit. They are required to ride as far to the right as is safe, so if safe means middle of the road, then they are 100% entitled to the middle of the road.

If bicycles blow a stop sign or light, they can get a ticket. That said, a Dutch friend of mine once commented on how Americans are so mind controlled that they will wait at a red light at 2 AM with no cars insight. No self respect Dutchman would. Same with pedestrian crosswalks...Americans will wait for that stupid will walk figure to appear even if there is no car insight...do that in Europe and you will get trampled.

[Sirshredalot]

People should simply be considerate, it's not that hard. Ride single file and towards the right in areas with narrow roads and poor sightlines. Cars pass when you can see what's coming. It's the assholes on both sides who cause the issues. Don't be an asshole.

With that said, if bikes want to be considered vehicles they need to obey the rules of the road. This includes stopping at stop signs and lights, and pulling off the road if their presence is impeding traffic to the point that it is backing up behind them. And wtf is this about a peloton being considered "one vehicle"? That is ludicrous. If I'm in a line of cars can we be considered one vehicle too? Please?

Obviously cars need to obey the laws as well.

Since when do motorists stop for stop signs and red lights? Or pull over when they're impeding traffic?