Trucks.

[Telemarketeer]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chicken_tax

Holy shit I thought that was a joke.

[TAFKALVS]

As the owner of a 2017 superduty with 6.7 diesel I can honestly say it get's the same if not better mileage then the 2003 2.7 4wd tacoma I just picked up. I average 19mpg unloaded in the super duty and 15 around town with stop and go. The tacoma does a steady 16 or so mixed. The Super Duty is 8300lbs the taco is listed at 3300lbs. Miracle of modern engineering if you ask me.

Is yours stock or is it tuned/deleted? I bet it could do even better based on my 6.4...

[jackattack]

As the owner of a 2017 superduty with 6.7 diesel I can honestly say it get's the same if not better mileage then the 2003 2.7 4wd tacoma I just picked up. I average 19mpg unloaded in the super duty and 15 around town with stop and go. The tacoma does a steady 16 or so mixed. The Super Duty is 8300lbs the taco is listed at 3300lbs. Miracle of modern engineering if you ask me.

My 2015 PSD is spot on with your 2017. Everyone I've met that's deleted emissions are getting 20+ mixed driving (depending on running gear).

6.7 requires a LOT more oil though.

[jackattack]

Holy shit I thought that was a joke.

nope, just run of the mill corporate welfare.

[::: :::]

2011 4x4 2500 crew cab long bed gasser w/ canopy gets 14mpg around town & 17 on the highway

in 4x4, it's more like ice's 4 gal/mi...emotional truth anyway
let's hear it for a 36gal tank

[Peruvian]

I just received notice on my windshield yesterday that my quad cab 6 foot bed ram is no longer welcome to park on the two main streets in Bend.

Next time, feed the meter.

[TAFKALVS]

2011 4x4 2500 crew cab long bed gasser w/ canopy gets 14mpg around town & 17 on the highway

in 4x4, it's more like ice's 4 gal/mi...emotional truth anyway
let's hear it for a 36gal tank

How many miles to do you get to a tank? My 2500 got 250 - 300 miles per 30 gallon fill-up if I was hauling the camper or driving in 4wd.

[::: :::]

varies with usage, but pretty consistently +/- 550mi per fill-up
(i'm very rarely in 4x for more than 40mi & I don't haul anything super heavy [why i went gas])

[Ted Striker]

Since we are talking fuel efficiency, who's taking bets on how many more years until an electric full sized truck comes out that can go a few hundred miles on a charge?

That's an interesting idea, and the logical next step based on the reality that most people who actually use their trucks for work don't drive them very far in a single trip. And very few of them need 4wd. Plus electric motors have killer torque.

But I think the sales/marketing aspect goes against that logic. The big three have convinced the public that a pickup truck is now a car, and that everyone needs 4wd. That's why double cab short beds sell so well, and why soccer moms are trading in their suvs for pickups.

And gas is too cheap.

F150 is the best selling Passenger Vehicle (not just truck) in the world, so it is just a matter of time, but how much time?

That's USA only though - in that more Americans have bought F series trucks this year than the worldwide sales of Corollas during the same timeframe. Which goes back to the marketing thing.

[Name Redacted]

That's an interesting idea, and the logical next step based on the reality that most people who actually use their trucks for work don't drive them very far in a single trip. And very few of them need 4wd. Plus electric motors have killer torque.

But I think the sales/marketing aspect goes against that logic. The big three have convinced the public that a pickup truck is now a car, and that everyone needs 4wd. That's why double cab short beds sell so well, and why soccer moms are trading in their suvs for pickups.

And gas is too cheap.



That's USA only though - in that more Americans have bought F series trucks this year than the worldwide sales of Corollas during the same timeframe. Which goes back to the marketing thing.

With trucks being bigger already, they have more space for bigger batteries. 4WD is a necessity for most people, at least in the mountain west. However, many of the most recent Electric cars like Tesla, are already AWD.

[PowerWhore7]

That's with the 6-speed automatic, right?

My 2000 GMC Sierra 2500 (gas 6.0, 4L80E 4-spd transmission, 4WD, 4.10 axle gearing, ext cab longbed, stock tire size) with a Northstar TC800 camper gets 10.5-11 consistently. Empty, it only improves to 11.5, maybe 12 if driving slow (55 mph eastern Sierra).

Anecdotally, from what I've seen, the newer ones (like yours) see a decent improvement in MPG when empty. Older ones (like mine) suck down fuel at 10-12 mpg consistently no matter what -- city, hwy, mountain, flat, empty, full.... doesn't seem to make a difference.

Correct, 4x4 6 speed 6L 3.73 axle gearing...Also mainly traveling in the Eastern Sierra, up & down 395. Empty I was able to get 18 maaaybe with a tail wind, but I keep the camper in the bed permanently so 11/12mpg is my reality. In 4x4 I'm getting 7/8mpg lol, but a 36 gallon tank and 20 gallons of extra gas storage does the trick.

[TNKen]

Drove home from our little ski hill the other day. Babied the Duramax and managed to get 35.1 (obviously a lot of downhill)..

[Ted Striker]

4WD is a necessity for most people, at least in the mountain west.

We're probably going to have to agree to disagree on this, but I'm standing by my assertion that most people who drive pickups don't need them (how else would the sales numbers be so high?), and those soccer moms and cubicle workers don't need 4WD. They've been convinced that it's a magic safety feature - a substitute for actual driving skills. But they never encounter the conditions that warrant it.

Some people who actually use their trucks for work or live in remote snowy areas need 4WD, but they are the minority of owners.

However, many of the most recent Electric cars like Tesla, are already AWD.

Teslas need awd because of wheel spin. They are stupid fast. And fun. But expensive, which is what I was getting at before: an electric pickup would have to make financial sense or it won't sell (or even be made). 2wd would be cheaper.

[TAFKALVS]

We're probably going to have to agree to disagree on this, but I'm standing by my assertion that most people who drive pickups don't need them (how else would the sales numbers be so high?), and those soccer moms and cubicle workers don't need 4WD. They've been convinced that it's a magic safety feature - a substitute for actual driving skills. But they never encounter the conditions that warrant it.

Some people who actually use their trucks for work or live in remote snowy areas need 4WD, but they are the minority of owners.

Most trucks are worthless with 1" of snow on the road without 4wd, what magic driving school did you attend that negates the basic physics of extremely nose heavy, rwd vehicles handling poorly in the snow?

Unless you live in Texas or Florida 4wd is pretty important with a truck. I see a lot of stuck 2wd trucks in ski area parking lots doing the one tire fire trying to make it up hills or even pull out of a parking spot.

But I agree most truck buyers would do better with an SUV.

[Telemarketeer]

My Dad texted me once because he actually needed his 4wd. He was at a party and parked on the lawn. Grass was wet.

I agree to disagree with you. Our reality in the mountain west is that 4wd is a pretty damn good safety feature. Even Denver gets snow and ice enough to use it in the winter.

[TAFKALVS]

My Dad texted me once because he actually needed his 4wd. He was at a party and parked on the lawn. Grass was wet.

I agree to disagree with you. Our reality in the mountain west is that 4wd is a pretty damn good safety feature. Even Denver gets snow and ice enough to use it in the winter.

Everyone says they don't need 4wd until they are holding up traffic in an intersection or on a hill because they spinning a tire with no forward progress.

[Telemarketeer]

I used to have a 2wd Ranger. At least it was a manual, but I never crashed or got stuck in that thing. Came close a few times. I'd still never buy a 2wd ever again.

[Ted Striker]

You both missed my point.

[TAFKALVS]

You both missed my point.

Do you need 4wd if you live in the 'Ham? Would you want 4WD? How far up the Nooksack valley until you need it?

[::: :::]

most people who buy 4x4 or awd don't NEED it
but it sure is convenient

[TAFKALVS]

most people who buy 4x4 or awd don't NEED it
but it sure is convenient

I wish my neighbor would use 4WD on our road, she tears up the surface spinning her tires leaving big bumpy ruts. (It's a steep single lane private gravel road.) Definitely the sort of lady that pisteoff is talking about, driving a Dodge 2500 Diesel, never seen her tow/haul anything with it.

[Ted Striker]

The original context of this was with regard to the feasibility of an electric pickup truck. In order for that to sell, it would need to make a certain price point. One way to get to that price would be to make it front wheel drive only.

Since the sales numbers show that most buyers of pickup trucks in the United States are just driving them to and from the office, or local construction site, the only thing they will miss is the 4WD badge on the side.

You and I and the rest of the tgr forum are in the minority of pickup truck drivers.

[jackattack]

I think a hybrid pickup would be cool. Electric motor in the rear, gas/diesel engine for power generation and powering the front end in 4wd.

3/4+ size pickups are crippled without 4x4 in any sort of low traction situation.

[Swine]

I wish my neighbor would use 4WD on our road, she tears up the surface spinning her tires leaving big bumpy ruts. (It's a steep single lane private gravel road.) Definitely the sort of lady that pisteoff is talking about, driving a Dodge 2500 Diesel, never seen her tow/haul anything with it.

Agreed. Bunch of asshats tear up our dirt road and washboard it when they could easily save it by throwing in 4x4. Also the side by sides, god I hate those things.

[Swine]

The original context of this was with regard to the feasibility of an electric pickup truck. In order for that to sell, it would need to make a certain price point. One way to get to that price would be to make it front wheel drive only.

Since the sales numbers show that most buyers of pickup trucks in the United States are just driving them to and from the office, or local construction site, the only thing they will miss is the 4WD badge on the side.

You and I and the rest of the tgr forum are in the minority of pickup truck drivers.

Manufacturers have no incentive to create a stripped down electric work truck. Biggest margins are on pickups and they're selling like hotcakes. Only fuel prices will change that.