First confirmed Measles death since 2003

[Adolf Allerbush]

There is none, and in fact his schedule is less safe. Mutivalent vaccines have been shown to be safer then give multiple single vaccines, but people who think they know better don't.

Since the vast, vast majority do not have reactions there is no good reason to do them seperateky, and many good reasons to use a Mutivalent vax. If there is a reaction seperated them out if you want, but it is not any safer.

The problem is a handful of people with no real knowledge think they know better then some of the best medical minds. We don't come up with vaccination protocols for the fun of it. There is a fuck load of information, thought and research behind them, and then some twit with Google suddenly knows better.

That's my take as well...which is why I don't understand why DBS has chosen this path...but to each its own...however, if his little one gets ill and spreads an otherwise preventable disease to those with compromised immune systems then it's not really "to each its own" anymore.

Not to pick on DBS, because he seems like a decent enough dude, but it gets frustrating when people dismiss science that they have no real knowledge of...it's very similar to climate change denialisms. Why can't we all get on board for these sorts of things?

[mall walker]

[doughboyshredder]

That's my take as well...which is why I don't understand why DBS has chosen this path...but to each its own...however, if his little one gets ill and spreads an otherwise preventable disease to those with compromised immune systems then it's not really "to each its own" anymore.

Not to pick on DBS, because he seems like a decent enough dude, but it gets frustrating when people dismiss science that they have no real knowledge of...it's very similar to climate change denialisms. Why can't we all get on board for these sorts of things?

I swear you guys are just either being intentionally dense or you're just not very smart. Do a little bit of research on your own about how many vaccines do us give the children in the first year of their life now compare that to many other industrial nations across the planet. If having a slightly delayed vaccination schedule was so awful then the rest of the world would be completely f*****. Is this some sort of that imperialism the US is the best type thing?

Furthermore you're ignoring as few simple fact that I mentioned which is that we have a family history of allergic reaction to medication.

And as far as Hood cash in his I can't understand anything b******* I never said we weren't going to take any multivalent vaccinations. Our kid will only be getting one shot at a time that shot may end up being a multivalent depending on the Vaccination

[doughboyshredder]

In other related news the sky is falling! The sky is falling! The sky is falling!

[doughboyshredder]

When you guys do realize that kids in the United States received the most vaccinations in the first year of their life than any other kids on the entire planet right? If this were entirely due to medical necessity then would not other industrialized nations be moving towards the same vaccination schedule

[Adolf Allerbush]

When you guys do realize that kids in the United States received the most vaccinations in the first year of their life than any other kids on the entire planet right? If this were entirely due to medical necessity then would not other industrialized nations be moving towards the same vaccination schedule

It's not a matter of realizing that...it's a question to you as to why it matters? There have been a number of posts indicating why the CDC's schedule is good to go...it is on you to prove why an alternate schedule is safer/better/provides the best outcomes. Until you're able to do that with some solid science you're just doing something for shits and giggles.

[doughboyshredder]

It's not a matter of realizing that...it's a question to you as to why it matters? There have been a number of posts indicating why the CDC's schedule is good to go...it is on you to prove why an alternate schedule is safer/better/provides the best outcomes. Until you're able to do that with some solid science you're just doing something for shits and giggles.

It doesn't have to be better for you it doesn't have to be better for anybody else it has to be better for my family. You keep saying there's a big risk involved in not following cdc schedule. And that is just factually incorrect if you are right then all of these other countries wouldn't be following different schedules

[doughboyshredder]

Furthermore the most rapid pro vaxer of all of you old goat has posted himself that the CDC schedule is partially based on economics and social Realities Not just on medical need

[Adolf Allerbush]

It doesn't have to be better for you it doesn't have to be better for anybody else it has to be better for my family. You keep saying there's a big risk involved in not following cdc schedule. And that is just factually incorrect if you are right then all of these other countries wouldn't be following different schedules

It's already been stated many times why comparing different countries vax schedules is not apples to apples. Come up with another line of reasoning.

[mtngirl79]

The only reason it isn't THAT dangerous to not follow the cdc schedule is that most people do follow it.

Other countries have different climates, different travel patterns, different immigration patterns, different population densities, different economic realities, different traditions for raising children and exposing them to others.... and on and on and on.

[doughboyshredder]

It's already been stated many times why comparing different countries vax schedules is not apples to apples. Come up with another line of reasoning.

Don't need to. There's nothing unique about the us that precipitates a medical necessity to vaccinate with such an aggressive schedule. It's mostly socioeconomic.

If you think otherwise prove it.

[MagnificentUnicorn]

I swear you guys are just either being intentionally dense or you're just not very smart. Do a little bit of research on your own about how many vaccines do us give the children in the first year of their life now compare that to many other industrial nations across the planet. If having a slightly delayed vaccination schedule was so awful then the rest of the world would be completely f*****. Is this some sort of that imperialism the US is the best type thing?

Furthermore you're ignoring as few simple fact that I mentioned which is that we have a family history of allergic reaction to medication.

And as far as Hood cash in his I can't understand anything b******* I never said we weren't going to take any multivalent vaccinations. Our kid will only be getting one shot at a time that shot may end up being a multivalent depending on the Vaccination

What medications are your family allergic to?

[Mofro261]

Don't need to. There's nothing unique about the us that precipitates a medical necessity to vaccinate with such an aggressive schedule. It's mostly socioeconomic.

If you think otherwise prove it.

If you do not trust the CDC, then likely you do not trust the WHO, from which most of the rest of the world relies on for vaccine schedule recommendations.

Here is a link to the WHO recommended vaccination schedule: http://www.who.int/immunization/poli...able2.pdf?ua=1

Here is the CDC:
http://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/schedule...s-schedule.pdf

You can see that the US is overwhelmingly in line with that of the CDC with a couple of exceptions- the CDC recommends seasonal Flu for infants greater than 6 months while the WHO does not, and the WHO recommends BCG vaccination within 24hrs of birth to prevent tuberculosis, which has been largely eradicated in the US for over 50 yrs. These immunization schedules are not arbitrary, but designed to enable the greatest degree of disease prevention at the youngest stage of life that the development of the immune system will allow. Further regional differences exist as well- JEV, yellow fever, etc are regionally indicated.

Other differences in country to country variation can also arise through supply/demand; currently production does not allow enough seasonal flu vaccine supply to cover the entire world and the virus is variable enough that supply cannot be stock piled.

[hutash]

I'll guess it's not vaccines.

[Mofro261]

Mutivalent vaccines have been shown to be safer then give multiple single vaccines, but people who think they know better don't.

As always there are exceptions to the rule. The MMRV vaccine has been shown to be more reactogenic than recieivng MMR and Varicella separately.

And not directed at you or anyone in particular, but in general multiple injections at one visit should not be confused with multivalent (blended). In general multivalent vaccines are a good thing as they lead to better compliance, especially in the third world where multiple trips to the doc are more likely to be missed and multiple shots per visit have a higher chance of causing problems either by the re-use of needles of lack of a sanity environment.

[PNWbrit]

Sanity environment often missing in US

[old goat]

Doesn't change anything from my end, and I hate to even suggest that a dope like DBS may not (at least on this) be a complete dope, but there is this:

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3170075/

Didn't we deal with this article pages ago. If not, let me explain. Infant mortality has everything to do with nutrition, availability of health care, poverty, and public sanitation, among other things. The US does poorly in the first 3 areas compared to other industrialized countries. Our plumbing is pretty good, at least compared to France, although we don't do so well as far as preventing food-borne infections. The article does not consider any of these factors. It happens that the country with the worst nutrition, health care system, and poverty also gives the most vaccines. Since these other factors were not considered or controlled for and since no multivariate analysis was done, the article is meaningless. All it shows is that vaccines don't prevent the causes of child mortality, the top 3 of which in the <1 year old group are congenital abnormalities, prematurity, and complications of pregnancy; and in the 1-4 group are accidental injury, congenital abnormalities, and homicide. I wish we did have a vaccine to prevent murder.

I think it's time to give DBS a break--he's explained his position and his plans clearly, his reasoning is sound as far as spacing out the vaccines, as long as they are given in a timely manner, and most of the people criticizing him don't seem to be reading what he writes, although it is fun criticizing him I must admit.

Now if people feel the need to harsh on someone, how about the lady who posted a comment in Moonshine Ink that we should rely on natural herd immunity, not artificial immunity from vaccines. I'm not quite sure where she thinks herd immunity comes from.

[KenJongIll]

Child abuse/neglect. Those parents should be in jail along side people who beat their kids or leave small children unattended.

We chose an alternative vaccine schedule for my daughter, who is fully vaccinated btw. Would you call us child abusers?
Just curious, because my wife was basically accused of such at a girls dinner party at our own home.

To expand a bit, definitely believe (most)vaccines have their place. What we were concerned with is the volume of vaccines put into a baby at the same time and what does that do? If you haven't had a child recently, you might not understand.

I'm also forced to get a flu vaccine annually now due to my job. I never got one until about 5 years ago and had gone 40+ yrs prior to that without ever getting the flu. The first time I was actually diagnosed with the flu was after I had the vaccine....and there is a whole other story of how the healthcare providers reacted that I won't get into. It made zero fucking sense.

[Mofro261]

Sanity environment often missing in US

ar ar ar.

[hutash]

We chose an alternative vaccine schedule for my daughter, who is fully vaccinated btw. Would you call us child abusers?
Just curious, because my wife was basically accused of such at a girls dinner party at our own home.

To expand a bit, definitely believe (most)vaccines have their place. What we were concerned with is the volume of vaccines put into a baby at the same time and what does that do? If you haven't had a child recently, you might not understand.

I'm also forced to get a flu vaccine annually now due to my job. I never got one until about 5 years ago and had gone 40+ yrs prior to that without ever getting the flu. The first time I was actually diagnosed with the flu was after I had the vaccine....and there is a whole other story of how the healthcare providers reacted that I won't get into. It made zero fucking sense.

Good for getting the proper vaccines (eventually). While you my think you where doing what is better for your child, most of the data says otherwise.(which is one reason why multi-valiant vaccines are given, the chance of reaction is less for one shot of three vaccines, verse three shots given separately.) Most people can get away with an alternate schedule, as most can get away with no vaccines. The issue is not just what is best for your bundle of joy, but society as well. Many say fuck society, i am going to what I feel is best for my child, which is fine to a point, but such a decision has effects, like the recent measles outbreak and possibly this woman's death. What is the best delayed schedule, wait and extra month, year, ten years? How do you know? If everybody waited as you chose too, we might very well have disease outbreaks, which is why the schedules are set up as they are, as the best balance between multiple factors.

I am not saying these schedules are written in stone, they can and should be modified as needed based on the best medical evidence, not some google search which is what is happening. Most people don't walk into their ped's office and ask do you think is best?, they walking in with a preconceived notion that some alternate schedule they read on the internet is best and start tell their ped how to practice.

To answer your question, if she got some nasty disease that could have been prevented, then yes, I would consider you a child abuser. Just like if you got in an accident and didn't have her in a child seat. If you had a medical reason to change the schedule, that would be different, but most people who choose to not vax, or delay vax do not do it for a valid medical reason, just irrational fear.

Disclaimer: My two, now grown daughters got all the vaccines recommended by their pediatrician. Other then being genetically predetermined to being internet assholes, they are fine

As for the flu vaccine, that is a whole other can of worms. You did not get the flu from the vaccine (which you implied, but did not say). I have never been diagnosed with the flu either, but that doesn't mean I haven't had it multiple times, just that I never went to the doctor to get diagnosed.

[Adolf Allerbush]

Don't need to. There's nothing unique about the us that precipitates a medical necessity to vaccinate with such an aggressive schedule. It's mostly socioeconomic.

If you think otherwise prove it.

It's on you to prove the WHO and CDC wrong homie, not me. There are of course geographic variations in diseases from one country to another...obviously.

[doughboyshredder]

I think it's time to give DBS a break--he's explained his position and his plans clearly, his reasoning is sound as far as spacing out the vaccines, as long as they are given in a timely manner, and most of the people criticizing him don't seem to be reading what he writes, although it is fun criticizing him I must admit.

.

Thank you very much.

My apologies for calling you asshole goat. I guess you're not so bad after all.

[DasBlunt]

I think you may have a complete misunderstanding of my position.

I never said that you shouldn't vaccinate, in fact I said that I am vaccinating my child.

The only thing I'm doing different than the CDC recommendation is the schedule that we are on. We chose the schedule that we did based on research of how other countries do it which is not nearly as aggressive as a schedule. For many reasons we feel that this is better for the health of the child.

As discussed earlier in this thread the US schedule is heavily based on cost and convenience. We don't mind going to our doc every other week so as to avoid multiple vaccinations at one time.

My entire reaction in this thread was to old goats comment that parents that chose not to vaccinate should be charged with child abuse. It was a hyperbolic b******* comment.

I do not support government mandated vaccinations. One person dies from measles and people lose their shit. It's ridiculous when thousands of people die from other things that could be prevented and nobody says shit.

We are doing the exact same thing, but we did not know the Euros do it that way...

The modern vaccine schedule was completely illogical.....like shit for brains stupid.....HepB at birth?

I asked the nurse if she was a crack addict.

[iceman]

This thread just took a turn for the truly scary. DasBlunt is a Dad???

[Adolf Allerbush]

This thread just took a turn for the truly scary. DasBlunt is a Mom???

FIFY

and Anti-CDC/WHO...pretty cool