Climbing Question

[bagtagley]

Definitely a jongish question here, but I'm curious. Is relying on the rope (top roping, specifically) common practice or bad form?

I find that, as I take more technical lines, I get tired more quickly. Rather than give up, I sometimes lean some weight on the rope for a break, or for balance. I try not to, but sometimes it's inevitable.

[Parvo Pup]

Hanging on the rope is considered "bad form" as in being lazy or in over your head.

However, if the alternative is falling on your belay partner - then hang away.

Sounds as if you are pushing your limits (good) - but may not be in the physical shape required for the climb (bad).

Work on your aerobic state at least 3 days a week for 30 to 60 minutes a session and throw in weight training on the alternate days.

Oh yeah - climb more - this will train your body for the actual stress climbing requires.

[mntlion]

bad form to use the rope to get up (pulling or just weighting it a bit)

use the rope to hang, thats what it is used for.

leave 12" slack in the rope to stop a climber from getting help. Climb or hang, but dont try to do both

[cj001f]

Penalty Slack for Hang Dogs!

[bagtagley]

We're talking climbing wall here, though an excellent one. Either your using the holds (somewhat easy) or your using the wall (much harder). I have to go over my ability to learn technique, but I get arm fatigue. I don't think it's so much physical shape, as it is arm stamina.

Anyway, the reason I asked is because I always considered this to be bad form (though I do it occasionally), but I belayed a guy today that was really good, except that when he got stuck he relied on the rope a lot.

I try to get my belayer to let up some slack, but he's very hesitant because he's afraid I'll fall too far. Just have to keep practicing. Thanks.

[Spats]

I disagree that hangdogging is an automatic foul on TR. Pushing limits is what top roping is for -- you can try lines and moves you'd never dare on lead. If you have to hang because you're tired or missed a move, yell "Take!" and hang.

There is a limit, though. If you have to hang every few moves, you're either too tired to climb, or you're over your head. It sucks to belay someone like that: sometimes courtesy demands you give up and come down.

As has been said, it's always cheating to use the rope to go upward. Your belayer shouldn't be putting tension on the rope unless you're hanging.

[bagtagley]

As has been said, it's always cheating to use the rope to go upward. Your belayer shouldn't be putting tension on the rope unless you're hanging.

I never really use it to boost myself, more to plan my next move.

[Sphinx]

That's how you work a route. Do a few moves, fall off, repeat. But you can't say you TRed a route unless you climbed it top to bottom without getting any assistance from the rope. Just like you can't claim a route if you fell off, hung, and then made it to the anchor.

[Mountainman]

Spats speaks the truth.

Bad form for hanging on a route where you are pushing yourself? BS

[Snow Dog]

If you're practicing or training then do whatever you want. If you want to claim that you climbed a route then style counts. Check the terms for red point, pink point, flash, on-sight, and hangdog (that's you).

In theory you should keep your weight on your legs and use you arms for balance. If your arms are tired then you're putting too much weight on them.

[bagtagley]

What do you do to reduce the arm strain on overhangs? I guess a better question would be, how do you best put your legs to use in this situation?

[Sphinx]

What do you do to reduce the arm strain on overhangs? I guess a better question would be, how do you best put your legs to use in this situation?

Keep your arms straight when possible. Pull with your toes. Use drop knees.

If you still can't do it, pull harder.

[Meathelmet]

But you can't say you TRed a route unless you climbed it top to bottom without getting any assistance from the rope.

And claiming a route as toproped is as as useless as claiming mexico to being your kindom.

Dont get so hung up on claiming routes in the first place.You are digging a hole for your self and a wonderfull hobby/lifestyle.

Toproping is a essential to your developement as a climber.
In your novice years, it preps you up for taking of to leadclimbing, when you
are allready leading sports, you work on some trad routes and figure out your placements, and when you are a superb tradking, then you can fix a toprope-solo-aid belay for your self and hang on the wall all by your self in a middle of a rainstorm.

Well, in short, for me the toproping has allways the sportier/pushier side of the climbing. I do technical/endurance trainign while leading too, but many times climbing a coulple grades harder routes as a trainign is so much more beneficial than leading a route within your ability.
It´s a pity that i lost personally "lost" a year or two in climbing just by not toproping.I was only doing leads and trad leads. Eventually i practically climbed as good(lousy) whatever i was doing sports,trads or bouldering.
My "evolution" as a climber had stopped.
I didnt go "over the top","pushed it" or "tried impossibles".
Everytime i was climbing, i was at the max and i was terrified to cross the line
fearing the consequenses (you cant take a 20ft runout on a N.0.5 stopper..)

Well, end of my mumblings...Do toprope. Get yourself pumped or totally pumped.Even better. But keep on leading.And if you are not still leading, move there as fast as possible (in safe surroundings,of course,indoors,sportroutes) because your tolerance agains starting it rises all the time.

Go for it and treat toproping as the "gym" part of the climbing.
Sometimes painfull neccessity, but most of the time as a tool that gives you a opportunity to hang on the rope and have a closer look at the climber chicks with tank tops.

I like toproping.

[Sphinx]

And claiming a route as toproped is as as useless as claiming mexico to being your kindom.

True, but all climbing is by nature superfluous. The differences between flash and onsight and redpoint and pinkpoint are pretty small, but people still seem to care. Saying 'I TRed that 12d right there' when you really flailed up it move by move is disingenuous.

I really don't care. I gave up climbing for skiing three years ago. Climbing is too full of cliques and attitude. I still have fun even if I only climb once every three months.

[Spats]

What do you do to reduce the arm strain on overhangs? I guess a better question would be, how do you best put your legs to use in this situation?

Get your pelvis closer to the wall. Use your core muscles to bring it up until you're humping the rock. This will get as much weight as possible on your feet.

Heel and toe hooks are your friend. Get one foot over the roof and up on something, even if it's at chest level. Doesn't matter if you can't push off it -- at least it's supporting part of your weight.

Don't bend your arms until you have to push to the next hold. You can get away with this on slabs but it'll kill you on overhangs.

Get some grip exercisers. This is the next item on my shopping list.

[cj001f]

I really don't care. I gave up climbing for skiing three years ago. Climbing is too full of cliques and attitude. I still have fun even if I only climb once every three months.

Don´t forget checking off the trade routes off so you can become an official hardcore climber! 8 party line ups are so core.