Climbing Stoke

[ex-powderbroker]

Toit de Ben looks SICK!! Hands through the roof?

hands, maybe a fist if you have small hands? i haven’t done it, there’s a funny video of mason earle coming up to montreal, playing flute, and getting the onsight. i haven’t done it yet!

https://m.facebook.com/notes/val-dav...3776069539160/

big controversy here ^

10c dihedral with lots of pro but shitty in the crux sees a second fall in a few years. this poor guy popped five pieces somehow. so now people are talking about putting a bolt in on a locally famous trad testpiece that saw its FA decades ago.

is it egotistical to want it to remain as is? i mean how can you keep people safe from themselves anyway, it can be top roped if you want to rehearse.

[Boissal]

hands, maybe a fist if you have small hands? i haven’t done it, there’s a funny video of mason earle coming up to montreal, playing flute, and getting the onsight. i haven’t done it yet!

https://m.facebook.com/notes/val-dav...3776069539160/

big controversy here ^

10c dihedral with lots of pro but shitty in the crux sees a second fall in a few years. this poor guy popped five pieces somehow. so now people are talking about putting a bolt in on a locally famous trad testpiece that saw its FA decades ago.

is it egotistical to want it to remain as is? i mean how can you keep people safe from themselves anyway, it can be top roped if you want to rehearse.

10c R is not something you jump on lightly unless you routinely crush 2 number-grades harder and are dialed on gear. If that's not the case you headpoint until you know you're not going to fall then go for it with the exact rack you need and tick marks everywhere. Yeah yeah it's trad but there's 0 glory in going for the onsight and decking from 35 feet after popping 5 pieces. It reads like the dude was at his limit and placed sketchy gear, I get pulling the crux piece which is apparently bad but the 4 below it should have been bomber.

The article makes it sound as if the R rating is a big secret only known to those who have climbed the route or have been warned about its nature. It took me 3 seconds to find the line on MP.com and notice the sketch factor. The description mentions adequate but tricky gear and a history of pulled pieces. I imagine the same wording is found in the guidebook (if there's one). Do people really need a plaque at the base of the line to warn them? Hard to believe there are still climbers left who aren't scoping every route online before jumping on them these days. All I see when I'm climbing are people with their nose on their phone only looking up to ask which route I'm on.

I share your sentiments about adding bolts. I'm perfectly OK not climbing routes that are well withing my difficulty range but over my head safety-wise, I don't feel entitled to bring them to my level. Nobody should. People need to do their homework and not get in over their head...

[ex-powderbroker]

I'm the guy who took the groundfall. I'm very lucky to have sustained minor injuries only. I've already starting taking steps without crutches and if all goes well should be climbing again in 6 weeks or so (if fractured shoulder blade is all healed up).

For what it's worth, I don't think Samourai should be bolted. I also would have said it protected well had my foot not popped at the crux and I'd made that move, but i didn't pull the crux and my gear didn't hold... I am truly baffled that it didn't, because I thought the #.3 i'd placed in the roof crack was bomber. (I fell on that very piece in a similar placement on the roof exit of a very wet Sceptre in the spring.) To the right of that .3, i placed a #2 in the undercling/sidepull slot which, again, looked pretty good to me. i had a solid stance while placing my gear so was by no means stressed out or rushed. the other 2 pieces I placed (there were not 5, but 4 pieces in all) were an old alien i didn't feel so good about (can't remember where exactly, somewhere before the .3) and a # 3 in the obvious right flaring crack which ripped out as I was tumbling head over heals after hitting the ground.

a little about me, I've onsighted 5.10 in val david and the gunks, bouldered v7, sport climbed up to 12+ (onsight up to 11+). i've been trad climbing for 5 years.... i've taken 20 foot whippers on gear multiple times and have no qualms about taking on gear when i feel i'm over my head. this is the very FIRST time I've had a piece rip on me (never mind 4!)

Though I am extremely grateful for the relatively very minor injuries i sustained, what I'm feeling more of is bewilderment at my gear failure. If experienced trad climbers reading this can offer any constructive criticism or advice here, i'd greatly appreciate it because of all the types of climbing i do, trad is my favorite. i love everything about it and certainly hope to get back to it as soon as my body will allow.

I'd like to end by giving the Val David crew that helped me immediately after impact (they were working nearby) and the medics and firefighters that carried me down the mountain a huge thank you hug and kiss for taking such great care of me every step of the way.

[Boissal]

I'm the guy who took the groundfall. I'm very lucky to have sustained minor injuries only. I've already starting taking steps without crutches and if all goes well should be climbing again in 6 weeks or so (if fractured shoulder blade is all healed up).

For what it's worth, I don't think Samourai should be bolted. I also would have said it protected well had my foot not popped at the crux and I'd made that move, but i didn't pull the crux and my gear didn't hold... I am truly baffled that it didn't, because I thought the #.3 i'd placed in the roof crack was bomber. (I fell on that very piece in a similar placement on the roof exit of a very wet Sceptre in the spring.) To the right of that .3, i placed a #2 in the undercling/sidepull slot which, again, looked pretty good to me. i had a solid stance while placing my gear so was by no means stressed out or rushed. the other 2 pieces I placed (there were not 5, but 4 pieces in all) were an old alien i didn't feel so good about (can't remember where exactly, somewhere before the .3) and a # 3 in the obvious right flaring crack which ripped out as I was tumbling head over heals after hitting the ground.

a little about me, I've onsighted 5.10 in val david and the gunks, bouldered v7, sport climbed up to 12+ (onsight up to 11+). i've been trad climbing for 5 years.... i've taken 20 foot whippers on gear multiple times and have no qualms about taking on gear when i feel i'm over my head. this is the very FIRST time I've had a piece rip on me (never mind 4!)

Though I am extremely grateful for the relatively very minor injuries i sustained, what I'm feeling more of is bewilderment at my gear failure. If experienced trad climbers reading this can offer any constructive criticism or advice here, i'd greatly appreciate it because of all the types of climbing i do, trad is my favorite. i love everything about it and certainly hope to get back to it as soon as my body will allow.

I'd like to end by giving the Val David crew that helped me immediately after impact (they were working nearby) and the medics and firefighters that carried me down the mountain a huge thank you hug and kiss for taking such great care of me every step of the way.

Weird situation. Popping 4 pieces is unlikely, esp. if a couple are placed from a solid stance with plenty of time to find the best option. Maybe the nature of the rock? People rip small gear at the Creek a lot since it's so soft it doesn't take much to open a small cam. I know gear in gneiss and quartzite can slip out if the crack is ever so slightly flared...
Dude seems like he got lucky and has the right attitude about it. Bet he'll send that route next year.

[bodywhomper]

Lucky guy!

A classic discussion had many times over. Where and when the line is drawn. Who has the “authority” of deciding when fixed pro is allowed.

I once dropped into a slot with a friend with expectations of buddy-assist to escape a few dark water filled potholes only to find newly installed fixed chains! That was disappointing.

[Boissal]

Lucky guy!

A classic discussion had many times over. Where and when the line is drawn. Who has the “authority” of deciding when fixed pro is allowed.

I once dropped into a slot with a friend with expectations of buddy-assist to escape a few dark water filled potholes only to find newly installed fixed chains! That was disappointing.

I've had the opposite problem several times while canyoneering in the Roost. Show up to a drop that has been bolted for as long as I can remember (10+ years) only to find chopped bolts and 35' of webbing running to an anemic patch of brush. Bolt was never end.

I've changed my stance over the years regarding R rated routes. I used to take pride in climbing them and now I stir clear, not worth the risk IMO. I'd rather climb 100 mediocre well protected pitches than crater on a stellar but sketchy one. If the fall isn't clean it's not worth it, the price is too high.
I developed a fair amount of routes I felt were safe but in hindsight are pretty heady. The kind you work on TR for a while, dial in the moves and all the gear to the point where you don't even need to think, put in the minimum number of bolts to deal with gear-free sections, send once, and move on. I rated those based on how they felt when I knew all the moves and had the exact rack I needed.
I jumped back on some of them 5 years later and shat my pants. No tick marks, no memory of the funky moves or the inobvious tiny gear, they felt a few letter grades harder and pretty damn serious. I realized that anyone jumping on them with only a rating and general rack information would have a nasty time unless they regularly onsighted a full number grade harder. If they were at their limit they would have a significant chance on taking a big fall and getting mangled. So, I added a few bolts to protect cruxy sections with inobvious gear (we're not talking about perfect cracks here, those routes are mixed and sometimes all you get is a 6" wide horizontal that has 1 small spot for 1 small cam and if you don't see it you're fucked). Turns out the routes are not any less fun when you get done and your underwear isn't stained brown...
I have no problem doing that to my routes. They're not exactly classics and have probably seen 1 repeat at most so nobody really gives a shit. I'd never do that on a route somebody else established though. Not my work, not my responsibility or right.

[bodywhomper]

^^good post^^!

[old goat]

Well said, Boissal.
I climbed in a different era, when the average climber did not expect to take leader falls, certainly not regularly. People are much more willing to push their limits today. If you plan to fall you'd better pay attention to the protection rating. What you wrote should be required reading--I think a lot of people don't appreciate the difference between the process you describe and onsighting a route in a guidebook.

My son was talking to me today about 5.9 being the scariest grade, since back in the day no matter how hard a climb was it was rated 5.9--until the conceptual breakthrough of 5.10 and above. The idea of 5.10 being higher than 5.9 required the same kind of innovative mathematics as general relativity. There are still some of those old 5.9's that haven't been rerated and climb harder than modern 5.9.

[ex-powderbroker]

new boulders in town:

[ex-powderbroker]

who needs a gym?!

[Boissal]

^^^ Nice urban choss!!

Wrapped up a long standing project and put up a few random lines at the Jungle (Aquarius Plateau, central/southern UT) this weekend. Alpine choss (volcanic rock) of the extremely fun variety, about 250 pitches now, sport, trad, mixed, faces, cracks, it has it all. For anyone based in SLC, Flagstaff, or other hot-as-shit areas within 4 to 5 hours of Bryce Canyon I'd recommend spending a long weekend there in the summer. It's not the most kid or dog friendly place as there is talus everywhere but at least half of the crags have short mellow hikes suitable for kiddos and old canines. All of the climbing is above 10,400' and there's shade to be found at any hour of the day, the camping is great, and there are enough good lines to keep the average climber entertained for 4 days without having to climb anything sketchy (of which there is plenty). The mayor is a character, extremely friendly, he'll give you whisky and belays until you pass out from exhaustion.
No action shots here, just scenic and work pics:

[Dantheman]

Wow, super cool. It's so nice down there in the summer.

[DolphinSki]

The Jungle looks awesome. Always heard of it, but hadn't made it out there. Now that I'm close I'll have to make it a priority.

[Boissal]

The Jungle looks awesome. Always heard of it, but hadn't made it out there. Now that I'm close I'll have to make it a priority.

It's definitely worth a trip. Used to be a bit on the sketchy side but traffic these past few seasons has really helped clean up the popular lines.
The season goes from early/late June (bad/good snow year) to mid October, after that the nights get a bit too cold for comfort. Same as the Uintas really.
If you ever need a list of must-do shoot me a PM!

Bromontana, nice shots, Climbers in the Mist (2nd one) is one of my favorite lines up there.

[ex-powderbroker]

skaha





lost boys



weeping wall



have to plug in my camera to find more pics of canadian choss and random sport crags in between other typical vacation shit. fun trip.

[anithadixon]

It will be nice there during summer.

[criscam]

The youngest performing his first legit rapping this wknd at the city.








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[Dantheman]

Cool! That had to have been a bit nerve-wracking.

[ex-powderbroker]

no stoke from me this week. i backed off a scary 5.8. these old weissner routes are too heady. and so weird how one week you can feel unstoppable and the next you’re made out of wet cardboard. sucks.

[old goat]

Young goat exiting Red Dihedral, Incredible Hulk.

(The picture is staged. He face climbed around the tunnel-through, then dropped the rope through the tunnel to his partner who wanted to do it that way, then posed himself coming out, because everyone takes that picture.)

[ex-powderbroker]

Nice, pretty sweet being able to get out with your kid like that.


Kind of a cool sport climb I got to do today in Val David. You get out of that roof and then head all the way right (past the wasps) to get the anchor. PITA to clean.


my babe following earlier in the day on some trad:




colors approaching peak on north sides, but south facing is just starting to get going.

great day.

[old goat]

Nice, pretty sweet being able to get out with your kid like that.

I only wish. My climbing days are long over. He did it with a friend. Besides, I think my gut is too big for the tunnel through.

[hutash]

No problem, you'll just have to lead the face.

[yeahman]

One from the vault: Caveat Emptor, Death Canyon, Tetons. This and the Snaz (next to it) are well worth doing if you like multipitch trad cragging in the 5.10 range.

[ex-powderbroker]

looks sick.

Do any of you guys with a little more history have recommendations for Skytop? My better half got me a guide for my bday, hoping to get on classics at every level from Gargoyle to Foops. Pretty pretty pretty stoked.