OFFICIAL I70 BITCH THREAD....

[SkeezeBall]

Granted it's not safe to get out of their car there to help but they don't seem to give a shit about the other people's well being.

[smmokan]

Pretty calm reaction from a group of people who just witnessed a fairly major accident. I guess that's the norm on I-70 anymore?

[MakersTeleMark]

That's actually great driving. He is going just as fast as the conditions allow in the best lane.

Mr. Idiot tailgater passes on the right, walks into a pileup.

If 55 in grease is too slow, then meet your fate.

Bottom line, he kept his passenger's safe, didn't plow into a right lane pile up, and got home to sleep.

Bravo. If db in the pickup would have just chilled and gotten behind the van and cruised, he would have been just fine.

And that is the norm, not even "major".

Relax folks. We all want to just get there.

[bendtheski]

I wonder if the driver of the black truck can sue the shuttle company and shuttle driver for their part in the accident?

Not sure how you sue someone else for your own wreck that you caused by driving too fast for conditions, especially when the person you're suing was in no way responsible for your fuck up, and has video to prove it, but yeah, in these litigious times a frivolous law suit like that might gain some traction (ba-dum)

[montanaskier]

Fines, actual fines that are expensive, if a truck with no chains fine was 10k bucks they would stop doing it. If passenger cars with bad tires were fined 3k, they'd stop doing it too.

And like Makers said....chill out, no need to scream up and down the road when it's like that.

[doebedoe]

That's actually great driving. He is going just as fast as the conditions allow in the best lane.

Mr. Idiot tailgater passes on the right, walks into a pileup.

+100. Yeah, sometimes I'm in the clearest lane and its the left lane. And I'm not driving as fast as some would like. Deal with it. If you're capable at traveling at a much higher speed safely than my AWD van with fresh snows you should have no problem using the lane with poorer conditions to get around me.

When lane conditions are highly variable between the two, the rule of left-for-passing-only doesn't make sense anymore.

[capulin overdrive]

I'm a left lane camper on 70, but will always get over if somebody is really rock and rolling, and will give most others a shot at getting around. If they're not courteous and use the opportunity given to pass without blocking me in, then they can eat shit.

[The SnowShow]

That driver of the tiny grey car must have shit himself.

[summit]

+100. Yeah, sometimes I'm in the clearest lane and its the left lane. And I'm not driving as fast as some would like. Deal with it. If you're capable at traveling at a much higher speed safely than my AWD van with fresh snows you should have no problem using the lane with poorer conditions to get around me.

When lane conditions are highly variable between the two, the rule of left-for-passing-only doesn't make sense anymore.

That isn't your determination to make. You just get to decide "if you want to drive in the clear lane faster than me, I demand you drive faster than me in the not clear lane to get there, because I said so and I want to drive in the passing lane."

You don't have the right to drive in whatever lane is the clearest. That is the whole message of traction laws: you need to be able to drive in whatever lane in whatever conditions and the rules of the road apply, which includes don't drive in the passing lane if there is overtaking traffic.

That means if someone wants to drive 5mph faster than you, you move the fuck over to the right lane even if you have to drive slower.

Passing laws and traction laws have a basis in stupid human tricks like this guy who was frustrated because he was probably stuck behind the shuttle for the last 5 miles. Then he has to speed up to make the pass, and was quite frustrated in having to do so in the less clear non-passing lane.

I watched the vid 5 times last night and concluded that the black truck making the aggro pass almost certainly inadvertently SAVED THE SHUTTLE. The van starts braking when the truck starts braking at the edge of visibility. That gives the van several extra seconds of braking. If the van hadn't started braking early, it would have careened into the white vehicle that was almost a dead stop in the left lane which is what the truck swung right (and rolled) in a last ditch attempt to avoid rear ending.

[hatchgreenchile]

I'll camp in the clear lane (if that's the left, so be it) when weather is bad. Switching back and forth between snowpacked lanes, braking and accelerating as needed, are just additional opportunities to cause a skid.

Have the right equipment , get at a comfortable speed, keep a comfortable distance behind the lead car, take a shot of patience and you'll get home safe. Rocket science people.

I've lost tracked of how many times I've seen agro bros pass snowplow convoys. They're the best lead car you'll find on any highway!

[JaytaeMoney]

[goldengatestinx]

Fines, actual fines that are expensive, if a truck with no chains fine was 10k bucks they would stop doing it. If passenger cars with bad tires were fined 3k, they'd stop doing it too.

And like Makers said....chill out, no need to scream up and down the road when it's like that.

If the F'n CSP would actually fine those who break the laws and cause crashes and judges set max fines it would be a big step towards improvement. Most times it's awww OK...you've suffered enough, you can go home now.

[Danno]

That isn't your determination to make. You just get to decide "if you want to drive in the clear lane faster than me, I demand you drive faster than me in the not clear lane to get there, because I said so and I want to drive in the passing lane."

You don't have the right to drive in whatever lane is the clearest. That is the whole message of traction laws: you need to be able to drive in whatever lane in whatever conditions and the rules of the road apply, which includes don't drive in the passing lane if there is overtaking traffic.

That means if someone wants to drive 5mph faster than you, you move the fuck over to the right lane even if you have to drive slower.

Passing laws and traction laws have a basis in stupid human tricks like this guy who was frustrated because he was probably stuck behind the shuttle for the last 5 miles. Then he has to speed up to make the pass, and was quite frustrated in having to do so in the less clear non-passing lane.

I watched the vid 5 times last night and concluded that the black truck making the aggro pass almost certainly inadvertently SAVED THE SHUTTLE. The van starts braking when the truck starts braking at the edge of visibility. That gives the van several extra seconds of braking. If the van hadn't started braking early, it would have careened into the white vehicle that was almost a dead stop in the left lane which is what the truck swung right (and rolled) in a last ditch attempt to avoid rear ending.

Sorry, I think that is simply not realistic when road conditions are such that one lane is much better than the other. In fact, in bad conditions, there often isn't even a left lane and right lane, as there is just one clear lane that meanders from left to right, and you can't even see the dotted lines. What do you do then? Do you honestly go in and out of the clear lane out of some Dudley DoRight attempt to stay in what would be the right lane if it were visible?

When road conditions are really bad and there is only one clear lane, left or right, it is normal to expect all traffic users to be in that lane, and if road conditions are that bad, you should chill your agro instincts and slow the fuck down. If you can safely go into the bad lane (whether it's to the left or right) and pass, go right ahead, but don't bitch at the drivers staying in the cleared lane, and don't bitch at them when you crash because you're too aggressive for the conditions.

[goldengatestinx]

Fines, actual fines that are expensive, if a truck with no chains fine was 10k bucks they would stop doing it. If passenger cars with bad tires were fined 3k, they'd stop doing it too.

And like Makers said....chill out, no need to scream up and down the road when it's like that.

If the F'n CSP would actually fine those who break the laws and cause crashes and judges set max fines it would be a big step towards improvement. Most times it's awww OK...you've suffered enough, you can go home now.

[doebedoe]

There is not enough video to know the whole situation to make such a determination that the black truck saved the van. You are assuming the van was camped in the left lane for miles on end. Maybe. Maybe the van had recently passed someone. Maybe the truck decided there was room to pass on the right, but the van was waiting until there was an adequate gap given the conditions before moving back into the right lane.

As for "left lane camping" -- state law does not say how often you must switch back and forth if there is consistent traffic in both lanes. If I'm driving at a speed which is in excess of traffic in the right lane you are not obliged to pass every car individually, and return to the right lane. Even if the person behind you believes you are not passing fast enough. I'm not going to jump back and forth between lanes when I can see someone ahead of me going much slower in the right. That is unsafe behavior, especially in winter conditions where people are driving beyond themselves in the left lane.

There is a lot of grey area in such circumstances.

[goldengatestinx]

I don't see any 'except when I'm too sceerd to drive in the snowy lane' exceptions on that sign...keep the fuck right except when passing. Always.

[goldengatestinx]

Sorry, I think that is simply not realistic when road conditions are such that one lane is much better than the other. In fact, in bad conditions, there often isn't even a left lane and right lane, as there is just one clear lane that meanders from left to right, and you can't even see the dotted lines. What do you do then? Do you honestly go in and out of the clear lane out of some Dudley DoRight attempt to stay in what would be the right lane if it were visible?

When road conditions are really bad and there is only one clear lane, left or right, it is normal to expect all traffic users to be in that lane, and if road conditions are that bad, you should chill your agro instincts and slow the fuck down. If you can safely go into the bad lane (whether it's to the left or right) and pass, go right ahead, but don't bitch at the drivers staying in the cleared lane, and don't bitch at them when you crash because you're too aggressive for the conditions.

Heading down from the tunnels on a snowy day the right lane inevitably is not used and the 5 lane wide pavement turns into 1 or 2 driving lanes. Perfect time to safely and moderately use the right lane. Most times the unplowed lane has better traction than the polished dumbass wandering lane. Most of these people have driven that stretch of road many times and know there are 3 lanes.

Same as in town when snow covers the lane markings...all of a sudden people become brainless morons not remembering where the lanes are even through they drive it every freaking day.

[Hott Butt Mud]

All of you saying that you park in the left lane when it snows must be scared little bitches. Do you stick to the groomers as well? I thought this was TGR. Man up, pussies!

[summit]

There is not enough video to know the whole situation to make such a determination that the black truck saved the van. You are assuming the van was camped in the left lane for miles on end. Maybe. Maybe the van had recently passed someone. Maybe the truck decided there was room to pass on the right, but the van was waiting until there was an adequate gap given the conditions before moving back into the right lane.

Reread what I wrote. None of those things have anything to do with the inadvertent save provided by the black truck being overly aggro.

The save was because the truck happened to be in the right spot ahead of the shuttle where it's braking, at the very edge of the shuttles visibility, clued the shuttle to brake earlier than it would have.

If the aggro truck hand't pulled that unsafe pass, the first clue the shuttle would have had it needed to brake was when it reached the point where it could see the stopped white vehicles in the left & right lanes just as it passed over the extra slick area where black truck lost traction (and where the previously wrecked vehicles lost traction).

It was chance, nothing more, that the white vehicle in the left lane was stopped, that the aggro truck was in spot to take the hit, and the shuttle full of people was obliged to slow down early because aggro truck slammed his brakes.

That is why the save was inadvertent.

As for "left lane camping" -- state law does not say how often you must switch back and forth if there is consistent traffic in both lanes.

You are being pedantic.

If I'm driving at a speed which is in excess of traffic in the right lane you are not obliged to pass every car individually, and return to the right lane.

Actually, yes you are. You'd know that if you drove somewhere folks actually follow those rules, like Europe.

Even if the person behind you believes you are not passing fast enough.

You think you are the only one who gets to decide what is fast enough and when you have to follow the left lane rules? Yea, some folks think that overtaking at 1mph is "passing." We have adjectives for people like that.

And yes, very clearly the law expects you to move right to allow others to overtake you, even if moving right means you have to slow down. Otherwise you are in a position of dictating the speed of traffic as long as you are going faster than the right lane, even if you are going 25 mph and the right lane is going 20mph. See how that works?

[goldengatestinx]

A little bonus of actually following the law (and common sense) is the right lane will become less 'unpassable/scary' as more drive in it. Win-win. Two lanes available. One for slower traffic. One for faster.

If it's not manageable, then obviously you're out in conditions where you should have stayed home. A man's gotta know his limitations.

[DasBlunt]

I'll camp in the clear lane (if that's the left, so be it) when weather is bad. Switching back and forth between snowpacked lanes, braking and accelerating as needed, are just additional opportunities to cause a skid.

Have the right equipment , get at a comfortable speed, keep a comfortable distance behind the lead car, take a shot of patience and you'll get home safe. Rocket science people.

I've lost tracked of how many times I've seen agro bros pass snowplow convoys. They're the best lead car you'll find on any highway!

Totally cool, because now I can pass all you scared chicken shits on the right and get there WAY faster...

[goldengatestinx]

Passing those trucks is scary....gotta go only 0.001 MPH faster than them taking 15 minutes to pass.

Leaving the right lane open to the truck and someone always slows to leave a gap to slide into to make the pass. The predictability is amazing. Even with the long bed crew cab camper truck. Which is a nice little though self admittedly douchy intimidation factor in and of itself but fuck them if they're not going to pass. 4x4, new KO2s, and a wife that knows when to say uhhh...step it down, makes for a good feedback loop for getting there.

[hatchgreenchile]

Totally cool, because now I can pass all you scared chicken shits on the right and get there WAY faster...

Cool story - you win I70.

I can assure you that my "scared chicken shit" approach isn't based on my fear of spinning out. It's based on the reality that the road is filled with bald tires, no 4WD/AWD, truckers without chains, under the influence bros and Dale Earnhardt wannabes who feel it's their constitutional right to make it from Dillon to C470 in 60 minutes, rain or shine. That is what I'm worried about.

[goldengatestinx]

Makes sense HGC. Then why don't those of your thinking stay right, going conservative with good tires and plenty of time/distance to stop, allowing the overly fast drivers to blow by you and crash ahead of you where're they're of no danger to you? Versus tempting those guys to blow by on the right, breaking the pass left rule creating more problems?

[hatchgreenchile]

Makes sense HGC. Then why don't those of your thinking stay right, going conservative with good tires and plenty of time/distance to stop, allowing the overly fast drivers to blow by you and crash ahead of you where're they're of no danger to you? Versus tempting those guys to blow by on the right, breaking the pass left rule creating more problems?

In good conditions, many people do stay right, except to pass and try to drive in a safe & legal manner.

All bets are off when the conditions are shit. Lanes aren't as defined, one is often more snowpacked than the other, and equipment flaws are greatly magnified. No surprise people stack up in the clear lane, and I can't say I blame them.