School me on trucks with manual transmissions

[Timberridge]

No, he really doesn't. Fool.

No, he really does.

[GPP33]

hey shitdick, I never said snow tires didn't enhance traction. imo, they are clutch for winter driving for 2 wheel drive vehicles. imo, buying winter tires for a good awd/fwd vehicle is a waste of money, and if you drive like a normal human being, you don't need them. my accord was a scary sled without them in the winter. amazing with. my crv kicks ass even with mediocre all seasons with 50k on the set.

rog

Please don't listen to this dumb ass advice. Snow tires are properly equipping your car for winter travel. They aren't absolutely necessary but they aren't a crutch. I don't run them on my truck due to size/load availability but they are a nice addition to my wife's subi and out perform an all season tire.

[systemoverblow'd]

No, he really doesn't. Fool.

I actually feel bad for you that I need to post this...

[Name Redacted]

200K on a '98 Taco with a stick here. I prefer driving a stick in the mountains, easier to downshift, coast, save your brakes. Don't remember when I last had to change brake pads. I haven't owned an auto since the nineties. Just prefer the feel and control of the stick.

But driving it around Denver and other big cities is sort of not optimal. That's when I take the wife's car which is auto.

[El Chupacabra]

Depending on the vehicle, sometimes the automatic transmission is the more reliable option than the manual, and sometimes vice versa. Manuals in heavy trucks tend to shift like crap - not snick - snick like in rog's beloved Hondas. That's because they're big heavy transmissions.

Personally, I'll probably never buy another manual transmission unless it's a sports car. And even then, the dual clutch automatics are impressive, where they are offered.

[fantastic_damage]

I've had a truck and an SUV (99 Trooper) with a stick, now I've got a truck with a sequential sport shift and that is hands down the best of both worlds.

Personally I found towing with a stick shift to be downright awful, driving in the light snow/slick conditions with a rear wheel drive kind of sucked in that it's very easy to over torque the take off and spin a bit. If you have snow tires that will help immesenly on that and if it's enough snow that you would use 4wd then you're good there too. I'm referring to in between conditions where there is a minimal but slick enough surface conditions (where it doesnt quite justify 4wd yet).

Sent from my SPH-D710 using TGR Forums

[icelanticskier]

This just in... rog knows everything about everything.

since when did having an opinion mean knowing everything?

rog

[icelanticskier]

Please don't listen to this dumb ass advice. Snow tires are properly equipping your car for winter travel. They aren't absolutely necessary but they aren't a crutch. I don't run them on my truck due to size/load availability but they are a nice addition to my wife's subi and out perform an all season tire.

hey retard, i never said they were a crutch. read it again.

rog

[XXX-er]

imo, buying winter tires for a good awd/fwd vehicle is a waste of money, and if you drive like a normal human being, you don't need them. my accord was a scary sled without them in the winter. amazing with. my crv kicks ass even with mediocre all seasons with 50k on the set.

rog

yeah but any awd or 4x4 is gona be better with snow tires than without and it doesn't matter how you drive shit happens sometimes 2 or 3 things at once then you are fucked , some jurisdictions are protecting people like you from themselves and have mandatory snow tire laws

manual transmission trucks often have higher load ratings if you need to tow

A lot of trucks get the same MPG with a stick or auto

new my truck was 1400$ cheaper with a stick

I have driven tacos with both and if I was buying used which is likely cuz they are so fucking expensive I would take either or

[::: :::]

OT a bit for your tacoma thread
in the big truck world, auto transmissions are coming w/ a manual shift component
my 2011 silverado has this...it works great for downhill braking and other times you want to control which gear you're in. it is not for sporty driving and acceleration or feeling one with your vehicle, tho

[icelanticskier]

yeah but any awd or 4x4 is gona be better with snow tires than without and it doesn't matter how you drive shit happens sometimes 2 or 3 things at once then you are fucked , some jurisdictions are protecting people like you from themselves and have mandatory snow tire laws

snow tires on 4wd/awd totally takes the fun outta driving. gotta have a lil bit slip and drift to keep shit real, yo. plus with the money you save you can afford that useless pair of 120+ skis that you've been pining for for skiing dense bouncy pow in the pnw

best truck buy going are the new dodge ram with 8 speed auto. full size 4wd truck that gets 25mpg highway. not much more expensive than a lil taco with a much better ride, payload, and less at the pump.

rog

[GPP33]

hey retard, i never said they were a crutch. read it again.

rog

Ok. You're opinion is still way out there though. How much does that AWD help you when getting on the brakes? That's right, it doesn't. How much do winter tires help you? That's right, a lot.

[asbvt]

I have a 2007 Tacoma Access Cab with the 6 Speed stick. Great truck! Love it for tricky access roads where picking a gear really helps smooth out the off road. Also for towing (snowmachine) especially on mountain passed. Helps keeping things in the torque band on the up, saves brakes on the down, etc. I think it does get better mileage, as mentioned I can cruise along at 35 mph in 6th gear no problem in traffic barely at idle.

That said, all that pertains to living in Montana now. When I lived in VT, and explored every dirt road imaginable for skiing, climbing, etc., a manual Subaru was definitely IMHO the way to go.

Good luck!

Oh, and Rog:

snow tires on 4wd/awd totally takes the fun outta driving. ....

rog

I would highly disagree with this! You should drive my modified WRX with 300+hp, super stiff rear swaybar, etc. I have snow tires for it, and there is absolutely nothing more fun than being able to controlled drift it through every turn in 6-12" of snow on the way to the trailhead.

[Shredhead]

best truck buy going are the new dodge ram with 8 speed auto. full size 4wd truck that gets 25mpg highway. not much more expensive than a lil taco with a much better ride, payload, and less at the pump.

rog

Dealers will make their money back in the service bay.

[El Chupacabra]

manual transmission trucks often have higher load ratings if you need to tow

I've seen the opposite be true. For example, Dodge/Ram sold a detuned Cummins diesel with its manual transmission trucks, because the manual couldn't handle the output that the automatics did. (IDK if this is still the case today.)

Each transmission has its pros/cons. Automatics are a lot easier on the driveline and easier to get started with a heavy load (torque converter multiples torque, lessens shock load, no need to slip a clutch to get started). OTOH, automatics can overheat, and if they do, can be $$$ repairs.

[icelanticskier]

How much does that AWD help you when getting on the brakes? That's right, it doesn't. How much do winter tires help you? That's right, a lot.

looking far ahead and paying extra close attention when shit is sketch is a far better way to roll than relying on rubber. winter tires do help fer sure, but that is often the problem. they are relied on too heavily. and on icy roads they aren't that much better unless you run studs.

rog

[ill-advised strategy]

I miss the old 4 speeds with the unsynched creeper gear. You could just crawl along in stop and go traffic without having to clutch all the time.

[Hugh Conway]

This just in... rog knows everything about everything.

that's me ME ME!

[kevin267]

I used to think snows were too much $ but last year I changed tires mid Dec so drove in snow on all seasons then winters back to back and the only place you really tell the difference is stopping which is worth it when something unexpected happens. And all the cars in the ditch on a snow day are 4x4 SUVs

[XXX-er]

snow tires on 4wd/awd totally takes the fun outta driving. gotta have a lil bit slip and drift to keep shit real, yo. plus with the money you save you can afford that useless pair of 120+ skis that you've been pining for for skiing dense bouncy pow in the pnw

best truck buy going are the new dodge ram with 8 speed auto. full size 4wd truck that gets 25mpg highway. not much more expensive than a lil taco with a much better ride, payload, and less at the pump.

rog

yeah IME one has not really lived till a snow plow backs out on the hywy in front of you on glare ice while a girl in her mom's kia is bouncing off a snow bank into your lane

with a set of studded 10ply haks I am more likely TO be around to ski all the skis I own that I don't really need and I can still have fun by just going a little faster

Actualy i think they are building transmissions that take the load nowdays for awhile back in the day the cummins trany couldn't take as much load as the stick, I drove one of those sequential shifting cummins (08) on a river shuttle and they seemed pretty nice

when anything on those trucks fucks up its BIG $$$

[GPP33]

I've seen the opposite be true. For example, Dodge/Ram sold a detuned Cummins diesel with its manual transmission trucks, because the manual couldn't handle the output that the automatics did. (IDK if this is still the case today.)

Each transmission has its pros/cons. Automatics are a lot easier on the driveline and easier to get started with a heavy load (torque converter multiples torque, lessens shock load, no need to slip a clutch to get started). OTOH, automatics can overheat, and if they do, can be $$$ repairs.

What years? Early 24 valve Cummins had a detuned Ca emissions model coupled to a 5spd, everyone else got the HO with a 6spd. The autos were all detuned as well I think. Today's trucks are all rated the same regardless of transmission though a lot of the autos produced over the past 10 years coupled to diesels in light duty trucks shouldn't be towing as much. Not because they are autos but because the OEM's put out a poor design.

[Buster Highmen]

I miss the old 4 speeds with the unsynched creeper gear. You could just crawl along in stop and go traffic without having to clutch all the time.

I just use 1st or 2nd gear on the 6 speed awd station wagon with studded snows I've got. Works for me.

[El Chupacabra]

What years? Early 24 valve Cummins had a detuned Ca emissions model coupled to a 5spd, everyone else got the HO with a 6spd. The autos were all detuned as well I think. Today's trucks are all rated the same regardless of transmission though a lot of the autos produced over the past 10 years coupled to diesels in light duty trucks shouldn't be towing as much. Not because they are autos but because the OEM's put out a poor design.

Some quick googling:

2013 model year -- the automatics are rated to tow a bit more than the manuals:
http://www.ramtrucks.com/en/towing_g...wing.Specs.pdf

Apparently the manual trans Cummins is rated at 350 hp/660 tq, the automatic Cummins at 370/800:
http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/...t-drive-review

[beaterdit]

Another point to the OP, If you're buying used I'd look at the older body style Tundra with the 4.7L V8 like mine. Mine's an '06, first year of the five speed auto and last year you could get a four door with a six foot bed. It's not much bigger than the new tacos but with gobs more power and room for a small MPG tradeoff. Not saying it's good on gas by any stretch but neither is a taco. Also these truck can generally be had cheaper than a comparable Taco.

I was looking to buy a Taco and came to the above conclusions and never looked back. Haven't had to do shit to this truck.

The new Tundras with the 5.7 are a different ballgame however.

[Beyond]

Mainly no one learns how to drive sticks anymore, so they convince themselves they don't need it anyway. And sticks interfere with texting while eating.

Own a 97 4-Runner (last year it was the Tacoma with a covered back) with stick, 4WD (separate stick for that too), also a very carish truck (Ridgeline) with an auto, and spend some time each year driving an ancient pre-Tacoma pick up with an auto. Agree that trucks are not for everyone; if you get a real one with leaf springs, they handle badly unless loaded,, have weak ergos, and don't do as well in snow or mud as an average AWD SUV. That said, my next truck will be a stick, even if I have to get a custom installed. Better total control in dicey conditions, higher reliability, more options about fine tuning which gear with which RPM, generally more connected to the experience of the surface, less numbed/dumbed feeling.