Canon 20D - good starter DSLR?

[D(C)]

I've done a bunch of reading from people buying their first DSLRs in some threads a couple years old. The main recommendation is to get an older higher end body over a newer entry level one. I'm finding some Canon 20Ds for not much money and was wondering if people thought this was a good model to start with or if I should try and get something a bit newer. I figure it will still take great shots and will give me the control to do some good learning. The lack of video is a bit of a bummer since that would be fun to play around with, but I'm mainly concerned with photos.

On a related note, what signs of wear should I look for when buying used camera equipment?

[Edgnar]

I was in the same spot as you 6 months ago. I ended up buying a 20D. I really like it a lot. The price was right and it takes some great pictures. The thing I dislike about it is that the screen is so small, and the lack of video. I'm considering up grading now, but I don't really have the money to do it.

From what I read doing my research, you want to check things like the hot shoe, which is where the flash attaches to the body, for signs of wear as this can indicate that the camera has seen a lot of use. You should also try to determine how the camera was used by its previous owner, as the shutter is only good for a certain number of cycles (basically the number of photos taken with the camera). For example, a sports photographer is going to be taking a lot of photos, compared to a landscape photographer. Once the shutter wears out, its probably more expensive to fix than the camera is worth. Unfortunately, its nearly impossible to tell how many cycles the older model cameras have seen.

The other draw back is the relatively low megapixels offered by the 20D at 8.2 mpx. The new iphone is 8 megapixels.

Even with all of that, I'm glad I've got it, as I have learned a whole lot about using a DSLR and the sensor size gives you great images, even if they aren't 18 megapixels. From what I've read, that is all you really need unless you are blowing it up to life size proportions.

Maybe check out the 30D, which is basically a 20D with a larger LCD screen, or a 40D which has an even larger screen and a better sensor.

If you are just getting into the DSLR world and want to use a more advanced camera with a low entry cost, I think the 20D is a good buy. I do not regret buying mine.

There are guys on here that take a lot better photos than I do and who have been doing this a lot longer than I have so hopefully they will chime in with more info. Also, do a google search on what to look for when buying a DSLR (SEARCH JONG!).

They say its not the camera that makes the photo, its the photographer. Keep that in mind too. Buying the most expensive camera out there won't instantly make you great.

I do wish I could shoot video though.

Also, if you want to use older film lenses, Canon is apparently a better choice than nikon because you can put an adapter on and have less chance of interfering with the shutter movement.

[supermodel159]

What is your price range? I would say check out the 40d or ti2

[BigKuba]

Older model of the double-digit-D Canons is the way to go (or their Nikon equivalent about which I know nothing). 40D or 20D, depending on your budget

Megapixel difference between the two is really a non-issue in the grand scheme of things. The biggest differences to me are FPS, high-ISO noise, and LCD screen size.

[D(C)]

What is your price range? I would say check out the 40d or ti2

I was thinking I'd end up spending close to a grand on a setup, but just looking on Craigslist, I can get a 20D or 30D with a kit lens for $400 or less. I'm thinking that may be the way to go. I'm not sure how much of a difference the latest and greatest will make for me at this point, and this gets me out shooting and saves future funds for more equipment once it's time (or more ski gear ). For that kind of money, I figure I can't really go wrong as long as the thing is in working order.

[Arno]

you can check shutter count for some cameras on myshuttercount.com
it works with Nikon and Pentax raw formats;might work with Canon jpegs?

[smmokan]

For a couple hundred more, I'd go with the 40D. It's tried and true, and shoots at 6.5 fps for skiing. You should be able to find the 40D for $400-450, which leaves you plenty for a couple lenses. However, if you don't want to spend the extra dough, the 20D is more than capable.

Edgnar- you can't compare the iPhone's 8MP to the 20D's 8MP.... it's the quality of the MP that counts.

[Todds]

Older model of the double-digit-D Canons is the way to go (or their Nikon equivalent about which I know nothing). 40D or 20D, depending on your budget

Megapixel difference between the two is really a non-issue in the grand scheme of things. The biggest differences to me are FPS, high-ISO noise, and LCD screen size.

I agree about megapixels and FPS.

Haven't they made improvements in noise with newer cameras? Does an old high level camera really have better high-ISO performance than a much newer low level camera?

A 20D only has 1.8" screen with 118K pixels. Doesn't every newish DSLR have a better screen than that? My old eyes would not want to go back to a screen like that.

I bet you get a great value on a 3 year old used high end camera, but wonder if a 7 year old one is too far behind the curve.

[D(C)]

Thanks everyone! I just pulled the trigger on a 20D with 28-80 lens for $260. Hard to go wrong for that! And definitely meets my budget.

[advres]

The lens isn't wide enough. That equals 44.8 on a crop. While OK length for portrait work, doing anything inside is gonna pretty much suck. All-in-all though I think buying a cheaper DSLR to learn on and buy better glass as time goes on is the smart move. You'll want to upgrade your body sooner rather than later if you really like it, but glass is extremely important and saving your money on the body will allow for lens upgrade in your budget in the future.

[Edgnar]

Congrats, sounds like the price was definitely right.

Read the manual, take a lot of shots and have fun. Here is a link or two I've found useful.

http://jimdoty.com/Digital/20d_menu_..._top_deck.html
and
http://actionphotoschool.com/ for lots of good stuff about shooting skiing and snowboarding.

[D(C)]

Congrats, sounds like the price was definitely right.

Read the manual, take a lot of shots and have fun. Here is a link or two I've found useful.

http://jimdoty.com/Digital/20d_menu_..._top_deck.html
and
http://actionphotoschool.com/ for lots of good stuff about shooting skiing and snowboarding.

Thanks for the links - very helpful.

[Chainsaw_Willie]

I agree about megapixels and FPS.

Haven't they made improvements in noise with newer cameras? Does an old high level camera really have better high-ISO performance than a much newer low level camera?

Can't speak to Canon but in the Nikon world the newer camera's high ISO performance puts the older stuff to shame. I loved my D200 and got some great pictures with it, but iso performance at 400-800 was pretty bad and above 800 was terrible. Lots of sensor heating on long exposures too. Even the new low-end D3100 turns out good looking shots at iso 800 as long as you're not expecting real good highlight detail.