Snowpulse vs. ABS - 1 airbag vs. 2 - Redundancy?

[Gurterno]

Ok so I'm considering buying an airbag pack and I think I prefer the Snowpulse pack over the ABS in all aspects but one. It only has one airbag.

There was recently a guy in our local skiarea who got caught by and avalanche and he got fairly beat up. Nothing too bad, he walked away, but he hit some rocks and small trees and got a bit bruised. But the thing is that one of his airbags on the ABS pack got punctured and that's fine when you have two but with the Snowpulse there's only one bag. If that gets punctured you're screwed...

Have you guys heared of any other incidents where the airbag got punctured? This seems like a big weakness of the Snowpulse construction. No redundancy

And yes I have searched, tons of discussion about fit, weight, price but it is difficult to find anything about this in particular. And I am interested in what others think

[ed nauseum]

Airbag packs aren't engineered to withstand high impacts such as collisions with trees. They're designed to increase your "size" to better ensure you end up on or near the surface once the avalanche comes to a stop. These packs don't turn you into a bumper car, so don't expect them to protect you from impacts.
The Snowpulse design may offer some additional protection to the head and spine, but again, maybe, in an impact with force less than what will puncture the bag.
Whether one bag or two, the capacity is what's important (about 160-170 liters), not what it can hit and stay inflated. If you're going to buy an airbag pack, have realistic expectations of what it's going to do for you, and keep in mind that something like 30% of N. American avalanche victims die of trauma before the avalanche stops.
Packs are supplements to your decisionmaking. Don't rely on them, or any other piece of equipment, to guarantee your survival if you get caught.

[Shorty_J]

I agree... I think 2 bags would be better. Just a bit of redundancy.

[Gurterno]

Yes I do understand the concept of the airbag system and the other obvious things you mention

But as you say, lots of people die from trauma. That indicates something obvious to us all. That the avalanche is very violent and the chance of getting an airbag punctured is definately there. Even if you get thrown over rocks and get really injured it is still better to wind up on top of the avalanche to have a chance of rescue. To me it seams like there would be a bigger chance of getting to stay on top with the ABS packs two airbags then the Snowpulses and BCAs one airbag.

I also have a friend who tested his bag and had one of his airbags in the ABS pack malfunctioning and inflating into the bag (destroying the bag). But one of the bags still functioned and that may have given him a larger chance of rescue in a real situation.

And I do understand that the limited volume of one ABS airbag would reduce the chances of winding up on top of the avalanche, but the chances are still bigger then with a punctured Snowpulse bag

[wannabe]

A small advantage of the dual bag system is that it is also easier to repack the bags after being deployed in a cold environment.

Repacking these things in the store and doing it on the mountain are two different experiences, I was able to repack the ABS pack much easier than the single bag systems.

The material used in the bags gets very stiff in the cold and trying to fold it back up to one small pocket is not as easy.

Then you also have the advantage that you point out as well as I really like the trigger system used by ABS instead of the rip cord on the others.

[alkos]

But as you say, lots of people die from trauma. That indicates something obvious to us all. That the avalanche is very violent and the chance of getting an airbag punctured is definately there. Even if you get thrown over rocks and get really injured it is still better to wind up on top of the avalanche to have a chance of rescue.

Another consideration regarding trauma is that the shape/design of the bag may protect you from a traumatic injury.

One of the things I really like about the snowpulse is that it covers your chest, neck and head. Yes, maybe it will puncture and deflate - but on the other hand, maybe the instance the bag is punctured will also prevent YOU from being punctured....

No two avalanches are the same, but I do think there's some validity to a design like the snowpulse - especially in North America where we ski near trees..... those same trees also make having two bags instead of one a nice insurance policy...

YMMV, and both bags have pros and cons.

Not to thread-jack - but those of you who are considering one of these bags (I am): how many of you ski in the backcountry with a helmet? I certainly do. Traumatic Brain Injuries kill lots of people in avalanches. However it still seems rare for people to take helmets into the BC with them.

[TheDon]

Wasn't there a big difference in the refilling of the pack between the two companies?
(I could be wrong). I thought one was way more simple and easy to refill (Snowpulse), where the other (ABS) you had to send back to the manufacturer. I got this second hand so if I'm wrong I'm sorry.

[wannabe]

^^^^^ you are correct Snowpulse and BCA both utilize a refillable air cartridge and ABS uses a replaceable canister, that you can trade in at the shop you bought it at or back to the factory.

I feel like I have researched the shit out of these things and still have not bought one as none of them seem like the best pack for me yet.

I like the airbag system of the ABS the best but want a more american style organized pack, like an osprey.

Hopefully I'll see something super cool this week at OR.

[TheDon]

^^^^^ you are correct Snowpulse and BCA both utilize a refillable air cartridge and ABS uses a replaceable canister, that you can trade in at the shop you bought it at or back to the factory.

I feel like I have researched the shit out of these things and still have not bought one as none of them seem like the best pack for me yet.

I like the airbag system of the ABS the best but want a more american style organized pack, like an osprey.

Hopefully I'll see something super cool this week at OR.

Like mystery ranch? Aren't they coming out with one?

[WARY]

Yes, Mystery Ranch has its BlackJack avalanche air bag system now available, and full disclosure, we make the air bag system for Mystery Ranch.

Every year we do testing of single air bag systems in British Columbia, Canada and Nevada, USA. We try to get in a half dozen avalanche tests, using two separate life sized human dummies with single air bag systems harnessed to them. We use a chest harness in a vest configuration.

What we find is that an air bag is destroyed once every few years of testing. We are not ready to present the exact data. The air bags that have been destroyed in testing included one that did not survive a massive class 3 avalanche that pinned it against a large tree in the valley below, exploded the bag and buried it 4 meters deep. Another air bag that was destroyed went over a rock band and was torn open.

In all our years of testing we have never found an inflated air bag buried in an avalanche.