4FRNT Renegade ~ Hand built in SLC.

**whyturn** · 10-04-2011, 06:53 AM

But don't fear them they are actually very easy to ski

**pow314** · 10-04-2011, 07:39 PM

thanks for the info guys, it helped a lot. hmmm, now I need to decide if I want another stiff ski- I've been on nothing but a 192 moment M1 since I was 14 and 150. three years later I'm starting to think that you don't need a super stiff ski to haul ass. I can't seem to get myself to buy something soft though, so it looks like I'll be pulling the trigger on some 196's tonight.

**SiSt** · 10-05-2011, 12:23 AM

Originally Posted by pow314

thanks for the info guys, it helped a lot. hmmm, now I need to decide if I want another stiff ski- I've been on nothing but a 192 moment M1 since I was 14 and 150. three years later I'm starting to think that you don't need a super stiff ski to haul ass. I can't seem to get myself to buy something soft though, so it looks like I'll be pulling the trigger on some 196's tonight.

From the last issue of FriFlyt (norwegian magazine) where they do flex testing of all the skis, the 196 comes out being only slightly stiffer than completely average for skis of that length. I don't remember the exact numbers, but I would not worry about the flex. The rossi SS7 is exactly average with SFI numbers of 55555 (I think the ren was something like 55556? will correct this once I get to check the numbers...)

196 Ren is softer than the 186.

**arild** · 10-05-2011, 02:29 AM

Originally Posted by SiSt

From the last issue of FriFlyt (norwegian magazine) where they do flex testing of all the skis, the 196 comes out being only slightly stiffer than completely average for skis of that length. I don't remember the exact numbers, but I would not worry about the flex. The rossi SS7 is exactly average with SFI numbers of 55555 (I think the ren was something like 55556? will correct this once I get to check the numbers...)

196 Ren is softer than the 186.

Since I´m on welfare, I can correct you right away!

The SFI of the Rens is actually 44445, so slightly softer than average, with exception of the tips, which are average.

**4FRNT** · 10-05-2011, 10:58 AM

That's interesting to see the actual data come out from those guys.

I can see that the 196 would flex along it's length softer than the 186, since the core thickness isn't uniformly thicker along the length of a longer lever, so it's flex per inch, or however you would measure it would be less.

I can also tell you that they definitely don't SKI softer than the 186, and personally I think they ski much stiffer than the Rossi's, which could be as much a function of the shape as opposed to the actual flex stifffness. YMMV I guess.

**pow314** · 10-05-2011, 11:04 AM

huh, interesting information. I'll let you know what I think when the snow starts falling.

**arild** · 10-05-2011, 01:50 PM

They also won the big mountain ski category this year, FWIW.

**Mustonen** · 10-05-2011, 02:21 PM

I might have missed it...what are the flex numbers for the 186 Renegade? ...and are these available online?

**verbier61** · 10-05-2011, 02:42 PM

Originally Posted by arild

They also won the big mountain ski category this year, FWIW.

Interesting... Who won the other categories?

**arild** · 10-05-2011, 02:56 PM

Rocker2 won best allround pow ski, Line Opus won best pow toy, and the Pon2oon won best strictly powder plank award. Pretty fair test this year, I think. They used to have only one winner for each test, but this time they had four.

**merlinmassoud** · 10-06-2011, 11:10 AM

@4frnt: just saw the loyalty video; there is a skinny Renegade at the begining, can you tell us more?

**4FRNT** · 10-06-2011, 11:50 AM

Originally Posted by merlinmassoud

@4frnt: just saw the loyalty video; there is a skinny Renegade at the begining, can you tell us more?

Well, I am not exactly sure which shot you're talking about, but we use our extra Renegade top sheets for all of our prototyping. The odds are you were just seeing a proto of another ski, like the YLE or the MSP or something.

**merlinmassoud** · 10-06-2011, 12:16 PM

bases are black and 4frnt is written on white.

http://www.earlyups.com/featured/loy...vie-full-film/
the first man, red jacket black pants, looks hjorleifson, at 0.43 to 1.51

**huge-go** · 10-06-2011, 04:01 PM

Originally Posted by merlinmassoud

bases are black and 4frnt is written on white.

http://www.earlyups.com/featured/loy...vie-full-film/
the first man, red jacket black pants, looks hjorleifson, at 0.43 to 1.51

I can't tell a difference when they're on someones feet from that distance. Just look like renegades to me.

**4FRNT** · 10-07-2011, 02:08 PM

Originally Posted by huge-go

I can't tell a difference when they're on someones feet from that distance. Just look like renegades to me.

Yep. Those are Renegades. Those are the first working prototypes from three years ago that Eric still skis.

**D(C)** · 10-07-2011, 03:28 PM

Originally Posted by 4FRNT

Yep. Those are Renegades. Those are the first working prototypes from three years ago that Eric still skis.

So obviously the original Renegade design is a product of Eric's testing and preferences. I'm wondering what the process was for adding the extra tip rocker for 2011/2012. Was this based on Eric's suggested modification or more as a result of public feedback saying the skis were quite demanding and could use a touch more float?

(Btw I've been anxiously fondling mine through the summer months, awaiting their return to pow)

**4FRNT** · 10-07-2011, 08:01 PM

Originally Posted by D(C)

So obviously the original Renegade design is a product of Eric's testing and preferences. I'm wondering what the process was for adding the extra tip rocker for 2011/2012. Was this based on Eric's suggested modification or more as a result of public feedback saying the skis were quite demanding and could use a touch more float?

You know, they made those changes in early January to the ski, so I don't know if they had heard any feedback yet. I imagine Eric had talked to some Whis peeps about it, and had come to a similar conclusion himself. I'm sure Cody and Eric spending two weeks skiing super deep snow in BC last winter sold them on the idea.

**|K_M|** · 10-21-2011, 12:49 AM

After reading this thread- I want a pair really, really badly. Currently I am building a no holds barred touring setup, only ski I "need" right now is for a mix of big mountain lines, wide open bowls, and tree skiing in the PNW and BC.

I am 6'1 or 6'2, 160, and love big stiff skis that go fast but can also pivot in tight places and slarve. based on that pov video, they can do everything I want my skis to do. I was thinking about these, then I got swayed over to a pair of 190 lotus 120 pures for cheap. After reading this thread- I want a pair of 196s really badly. I'd be putting plum guides on them and skiing them with dynafit tlt5 mountains or performances (undecided at the moment mainly due to whether or not I can raise enough cash).

Would that be a solid setup for what I am aiming to accomplish?

edit: I am also looking at dynafit titan ultralight boots (the more I look at these the better they sound), they seem to fit the "more focused on the downhill" ethos that I am going with for my skis, but will also fit the ultralight/good for the way up as well ethos I am going for with the plums.

So what do you guys think of
196 renegades
plum guides
ultralight titans?

**D(C)** · 10-21-2011, 08:23 AM

Originally Posted by |K_M|

After reading this thread- I want a pair really, really badly. Currently I am building a no holds barred touring setup, only ski I "need" right now is for a mix of big mountain lines, wide open bowls, and tree skiing in the PNW and BC.

I am 6'1 or 6'2, 160, and love big stiff skis that go fast but can also pivot in tight places and slarve. based on that pov video, they can do everything I want my skis to do. I was thinking about these, then I got swayed over to a pair of 190 lotus 120 pures for cheap. After reading this thread- I want a pair of 196s really badly. I'd be putting plum guides on them and skiing them with dynafit tlt5 mountains or performances (undecided at the moment mainly due to whether or not I can raise enough cash).

Would that be a solid setup for what I am aiming to accomplish?

edit: I am also looking at dynafit titan ultralight boots (the more I look at these the better they sound), they seem to fit the "more focused on the downhill" ethos that I am going with for my skis, but will also fit the ultralight/good for the way up as well ethos I am going for with the plums.

So what do you guys think of
196 renegades
plum guides
ultralight titans?

You weigh 160? I'd say go with the 186. It is awesome in the open but will likely be a lot more fun in tighter terrain. It's lighter, too. They don't ski short.

**|K_M|** · 10-21-2011, 10:18 AM

Originally Posted by D(C)

You weigh 160? I'd say go with the 186. It is awesome in the open but will likely be a lot more fun in tighter terrain. It's lighter, too. They don't ski short.

Yeah I am super skinny, no matter what I do...ah well. I enjoy longer skis, I own 191 wrens, 191 caylors, 192 lotuses, etc...still think I should go 186? I'm leaning 196 just because I feel like they could still be thrown around relatively easy but the extra length would be really nice.

**4FRNT** · 10-21-2011, 11:41 AM

Originally Posted by |K_M|

Yeah I am super skinny, no matter what I do...ah well. I enjoy longer skis, I own 191 wrens, 191 caylors, 192 lotuses, etc...still think I should go 186? I'm leaning 196 just because I feel like they could still be thrown around relatively easy but the extra length would be really nice.

The Renegades definitely ski a little longer than their size may suggest. But that being said, if you want a pair of rocket ships on your feet, go for the 196. I'm always surprised at how fast they are, but how easy it still is to shut them down. The 186s are a lot more maneuverable in tight spaces, however. So you just need to decide what you'll need them for.

Either way, I think you'll like them better than anything you've ridden yet.

**|K_M|** · 10-21-2011, 12:56 PM

Originally Posted by 4FRNT

The Renegades definitely ski a little longer than their size may suggest. But that being said, if you want a pair of rocket ships on your feet, go for the 196. I'm always surprised at how fast they are, but how easy it still is to shut them down. The 186s are a lot more maneuverable in tight spaces, however. So you just need to decide what you'll need them for.

Either way, I think you'll like them better than anything you've ridden yet.

I am definitely leaning towards the 196, thanks for the input. I love the fact that both here and on NS you can communicate directly with the people designing/building the skis you have questions about. hell yeah skiing! I'm probably going to be touring to places that are more wide open, so definitely thinking 196. Thanks a ton!

what do you guys think of 196 rens, plum guides, and titan ultralights? Will those boots be able to drive the 196 rens? Also, any way to know what north american retailers are getting the 196s in (specifically in WA/ID) and what the price will be? Thanks!

**4FRNT** · 10-21-2011, 02:01 PM

Yeah man, anytime! In Idaho you should be able to find them at Barries in Pocatello, Eco Lounge in Boise or Ski Shack in Hayden. In WA we'll have them at evo in Seattle, Spokane Alpine House (in Spokane obviously) and Mountain to Sound in Seattle. They should be right around $799 everywhere.

**|K_M|** · 10-21-2011, 03:23 PM

Originally Posted by 4FRNT

Yeah man, anytime! In Idaho you should be able to find them at Barries in Pocatello, Eco Lounge in Boise or Ski Shack in Hayden. In WA we'll have them at evo in Seattle, Spokane Alpine House (in Spokane obviously) and Mountain to Sound in Seattle. They should be right around $799 everywhere.

Sweet! I live 5 minutes away from Spokane Alpine Haus so that should be prime, they are for sure getting the 196s in? Thanks for all the help!