4FRNT Renegade ~ Hand built in SLC.

[Utahrd]

a rad vid review of the 2012 Renegade from the crew over at BC.com:

http://www.youtube.com/user/Backcoun.../0/KB9ioGppecM

[4FRNT]

hello,

@4frnt: I just receive today my renegade from Vieux Campeur ( 186 n* 191 )
shape, flex and graphics as expected : wonderfull!
good finish.

two questions :

- how thick is the mapple sidewall?

- I'm 90 kg for 1m75, 86cm mounting point would be better for me?

Glad you're excited about your Rens! As for mounting, there are a few schools of thought on how to mount them based on height/weight and riding style. They are covered in this thread pretty well, actually. 86 is the recommended mount, and most people are happy somewhere in that area.

As far as the maple sidewalls go, they are just the edges of the core showing through. We used to only use wood sidewalls for our prototypes, as it's much simpler to produce a pair of skis quickly without adding sidewall material into the mix. What we found was that the skis actually hold up better. As long as you bring your skis in, and dry them out every day (like you should be doing anyway), the wood will actually get harder over time. We have never seen any issues with any prototypes or production Renegades. The other advantage is that it doesn't give like ABS does when you edge really hard on top of it (think digging into a steep icy couloir). It's nice to have a stable platform all the way out to the metal to push down on.

[merlinmassoud]

nice, with maple chestnut locust Larch... ABS should be dead.

[D(C)]

@4FRNT:

I like my edges sharp (btw thanks for the awesomely sharp factory tune they came with). With plastic sidewalls I use a sidewall remover to shave them down so that my file grips the edge better and doesn't get gummed up. How would you recommend doing something similar with the wooden sidewalls?

[4FRNT]

@4FRNT:

I like my edges sharp (btw thanks for the awesomely sharp factory tune they came with). With plastic sidewalls I use a sidewall remover to shave them down so that my file grips the edge better and doesn't get gummed up. How would you recommend doing something similar with the wooden sidewalls?

Well, as the manufacturer, we obviously don't recommend doing anything to the sidewalls of the ski. You should be able to get more grip than on traditional ABS sidewalls, since we don't have a vertical lip on top of the edge.

That being said, if you still want/need to do it, we work on them with traditional woodworking tools. Routers, belt sanders, hand files, etc. I'm sure you could shape them how you want with those same tools.

[ Edit to add Barnhill's specific response]

In general I think that the design detail of the Renegade should allow for you to sharpen at will without much problem, as the angle of the sidewall drops directly down on to the top of the edge, without the typical vertical few MM before the angle starts. However if that is not enough, you could try using a fine(ish) wood file to very carefully knock back the wood that is directly above and in contact with the top of the edge before sharpening. Being a person that only skis on tuned skis when they're new, and not looking directly at what you're looking at, this is the best I've got for a method to making dragon-slayingly sharp edges. Hope it helps. CB

[D(C)]

Well, as the manufacturer, we obviously don't recommend doing anything to the sidewalls of the ski. You should be able to get more grip than on traditional ABS sidewalls, since we don't have a vertical lip on top of the edge.

That being said, if you still want/need to do it, we work on them with traditional woodworking tools. Routers, belt sanders, hand files, etc. I'm sure you could shape them how you want with those same tools.

[ Edit to add Barnhill's specific response]

In general I think that the design detail of the Renegade should allow for you to sharpen at will without much problem, as the angle of the sidewall drops directly down on to the top of the edge, without the typical vertical few MM before the angle starts. However if that is not enough, you could try using a fine(ish) wood file to very carefully knock back the wood that is directly above and in contact with the top of the edge before sharpening. Being a person that only skis on tuned skis when they're new, and not looking directly at what you're looking at, this is the best I've got for a method to making dragon-slayingly sharp edges. Hope it helps. CB

Thanks! I have only machine-tuned them so far but I will try without removing sidewall when I hand-sharpen and see what happens. I appreciate the info.

Btw, I find they ski a lot better in variable/hard conditions when sharp. They seem to track better and engage better on edge, without giving up looseness when it gets soft.

[Maker]

Glad you're excited about your Rens! As for mounting, there are a few schools of thought on how to mount them based on height/weight and riding style. They are covered in this thread pretty well, actually. 86 is the recommended mount, and most people are happy somewhere in that area.

As far as the maple sidewalls go, they are just the edges of the core showing through. We used to only use wood sidewalls for our prototypes, as it's much simpler to produce a pair of skis quickly without adding sidewall material into the mix. What we found was that the skis actually hold up better. As long as you bring your skis in, and dry them out every day (like you should be doing anyway), the wood will actually get harder over time. We have never seen any issues with any prototypes or production Renegades. The other advantage is that it doesn't give like ABS does when you edge really hard on top of it (think digging into a steep icy couloir). It's nice to have a stable platform all the way out to the metal to push down on.

so did the recommended mount get moved from 88 to 86cm? last year I thought it was 88cm....

[4FRNT]

so did the recommended mount get moved from 88 to 86cm? last year I thought it was 88cm....

No, sorry. I misspoke. The recommended mounting point is 88cm. Just like last year. Although, some people have liked the 86cm mount better.

[merlinmassoud]

hello,
@4frnt: which edge angle's is better on the base? mine seems to be +1 degree.
and what is the lenght where the edges need to be sharp on the 186/2011 ?

[4FRNT]

hello,
@4frnt: which edge angle's is better on the base? mine seems to be +1 degree.
and what is the lenght where the edges need to be sharp on the 186/2011 ?

It comes from the factory with a 1/1 bevel all the way up the edge. I would just take a gummy stone with you the first day or two out on them and detune as necessary. Or, you can ski pow with them, and never need edges at all

[merlinmassoud]

great!
I ski only 10 days/year but it's almost powder.
one complain with the renegade: why this baby is not 2cm wider with this nice shape?
anyway, thanks for all these details. it,s near two years now I follow this mellow rocker, the future of versatile/effetive skis. happy to see so much people interested by this project.

right now I think about an edge sharpe on groomers or hard snow, and round on crusty or soft snow: two lewels, the top one round and on contact with the snow only when the ski is tilted on soft snow. should be nice on fatties

[merlinmassoud]

on the front of the ski, after 100/115 cm

[4FRNT]

Final pair of Renegades pressed by Cody and Hoji, and others are already fully finished.

We're way ahead of last year already.

[merlinmassoud]

please, replace the masks after the photo, you've got talent!



the fiber does not exceed core, or there is a second layer wider?

[gramboh]

Glad you guys got everything sorted this year, everyone wins .

[whyturn]

@4frnt-had 186 getting 196 hat is rec -7? The new topsheet looks better than last years which seemed impossible. So stoked to be getting 196

[4FRNT]

@4frnt-had 186 getting 196 hat is rec -7? The new topsheet looks better than last years which seemed impossible. So stoked to be getting 196

Cody says 93 from tail, or else one million. Which ever comes first. (It's been a rough day in the White Room apparently )

[whyturn]

@4frnt, that is -5, wow alot of tail. Well I guess look at it when it comes. Suggested is -5 to -7 on the 186 and appears same for 196. i thought it might be -6 to -8 (90-92 or 93). They were right on 186

[otto parts]

Whyturn-new topsheet?

[whyturn]

Yep, orange and crows the same but trees at the bottom
Old on right new on left

[ARpowhound]

The trees on the bottom are tribute, the same as the trees on the EHP. The trees are a throw back to the OG EHP. The one that only came in 193.

[whyturn]

Love the topsheet looks so wicked and menacing. Just in time for Halloween

[gramboh]

Some dude told me last year I had the best looking skis on the mountain.

I blushed. Good thing he didn't see me skiing.

[pow314]

I already asked this, but I didn't really get an answer. can anyone that owns them compare their stiffness to a commonly known ski? I won't be able to see these before I buy, and I would love to know how they compare to say a b-squad?

[DerekPersson]

I already asked this, but I didn't really get an answer. can anyone that owns them compare their stiffness to a commonly known ski? I won't be able to see these before I buy, and I would love to know how they compare to say a b-squad?

Slightly softer in the tip, about the same in the tail and I would say slightly more solid underfoot...they fucking crush it.