Softshell vs. Windproof Fleece

[glademaster]

I'm looking into buying a jacket that will be used for backcountry trips in the northeast and resort skiing in milder conditions. Since breathability is key, I narrowed it down to either a softshell or winproof fleece jacket, but can't decide between the two. I've been looking at the Marmot Sharp Point, the Patagonia Cold Smoke and two Beyond Fleece offerings, the Cold Blooded windproof fleece and their Cold Fusion softshell.

Which would be better suited for backcountry and inbounds skiing if wind resistence is of pretty high importance? Ideally, I'd like to be able to throw a hardshell over whatever I buy for really cold days, so I don't want something hooded. So if you have any ideas or suggestions, let me know. Thanks.

[laseranimal]

fleece is gonna be hot, and doesn't really compress down that well into your pack for when you overheat or don't want it. You're better off buying a really thin windproof/waterproof softshell and adding a puffy down/synthetic jacket to throw on over it for the times that you're standing around. My experience with windproof fleece is its never breathable enough for slogging or warm enough for standing. It is however IDEAL for lift served skiing where you can wear it by itself most of the time and throw a hardshell over depending on conditions.

[schuss]

I disagree with laser. I've been using a windbloc fleece for about 7 years for XC and alpine, and I'm rarely found without it. They work great, and the one I have is rather tight, so it doesn't create any extra bulk. They block the wind perfectly, and are thinner and denser than normal fleece (sidenote: what is the plural of fleece?). I haven't used any softshells, but I'll tell you that my windbloc has never let me down, even on the arctic tundra days in maine and at tremblant.

[glademaster]

Yeah, I have a Windstopper vest, and love it, breathable, warm and bomber. I have an Arcteryx softshell made of some Schoeller fabric, and I really don't like it. It isn't windproof, not warm enough to wear when it is below about 40 degrees, and simply did not live up to expectations. Thats why maybe the Sharp Point would be nice, a windstopper softshell with pit zips, best of both worlds, no? And I suppose it would be used as a layering piece too, which seems to be kinda hard with other stuff I've seen.

[Dromond]

Here's my real wonder about windstopper fleece. When you bail doesn't it get snow all stuck to it which in turn melts and leaves you soaking wet and freezing?

[schuss]

not really. The windstopper fleece doesn't garner snow like normal fleece, since its far less porous. It takes a lot of rolling around in the snow to get it soaked.

[Shin-to-Win]

I like windblock for cool, but not too cold, days with no weather or new snow. I have the NF Sentinel. It's fairly thin and I can layer under it. Below 20 degrees, I add a shell. It's also the first jacket I grab to wear around town from October thru March here in the PacNW. Doesn't breathe as well as you think it should. Gets clammy when hiking.

I have to disagree with Shuss, don't like fleece in powder conditions. Switching to medium weight soft shell thid year for all but the nastiest conditions. It should breathe better and shed the stuff we call powder out here.

[Phil]

I tour losts and ski resorts sometimes and one thing I always have on is my beyond fleece soft shell. Awesome breathability ( pit zips ) and great for bumping up the water repellancy of goretex in case you end up in patagonain rain.

I use it warm or cold and rain or shine. It is always with me, fits perfect and has all the bells and whistles i could come up with. Mr. Jones lets you totally customize it ( I took a biker cut for ass warmth and short in the front for ease of use with a harness).

True it will be less warm than the fleece but it is super comfortable, less bulky and more waterproof. I'd use it with a light shell and light down jacket and you got yourself a take everywhere perfect layering system. Switch the down for synthetic if you on the coast or hate down like me.

My 2 cents, hope it helps

[glademaster]

So Phil, you throw a Gore-Tex shell over your softshell when it's dumpin? I like that idea, since within the next year I'll be buying a big storm shell, but want something that I can throw on under it in arctic conditions. Seems like Beyond Fleece's top of the line softshell may be the way to go.

[Phil]

Glademaster,

That is how I work and how most guides around here work ( well all guides I've meet ) and I can't figure anything more convenient. For colder days take a thicker underlayer, thermoregulate at the base then layer.

Good luck and if you do consider beyond fleece, know that they have my full confidence. Even if you can't try the stuff on before they'll take it back and make all the ajustments till you are satisfied.

[seldon]

I have a Mtn HW windstopper fleece and I love it. It doesn't allow a Gtex shell to breathe quite as well when you're wearing both, but it's a great piece. Completely windproof, I've worn it when its puking (4" an hour in 35 degree sticky wet conditions) b/c I left the shell at home that day and stayed completely dry.

I'd also recommend you look into one of the Mtn HW/TNF windstopper shirts. If your arc'teryx isn't windproof you could just get a large version (I wear an XL so I can put it over the top of longies instead of next to my skin) and wear it like a fleece. They're pretty thin pullovers and if you're wearing one you'll be completely dry even if you get snow up the jacket in a wipeout. They're also nice to be able to throw on underneath a sweatshirt for spring skiing.

Snow (except for teh wet sticky glop) doesn't really stick to my Mtn HW fleece cause its not really all that "fuzzy". Also, you can just brush it off.... Windstopper is basically waterproof in and of itself but just isn't seam sealed...

[13]

I disagree with laser. I've been using a windbloc fleece for about 7 years for XC and alpine, and I'm rarely found without it. They work great, and the one I have is rather tight, so it doesn't create any extra bulk. They block the wind perfectly, and are thinner and denser than normal fleece (sidenote: what is the plural of fleece?). I haven't used any softshells, but I'll tell you that my windbloc has never let me down, even on the arctic tundra days in maine and at tremblant.

Same here, 6 years with my TNF windbloc fleece.

Cuts the wind like butter, highly breathable (even when earning turns), and I've skied it in a few Wasatch dumps -- snow isn't a big deal, just brush it off or ski fast and you'll stay dry.

If the flakes are fat & wet, or if it's absolutely nuking, I'll throw on my Marmot rainshell.

Softshells are all the rage, but my windbloc is so versatile that I can't justify buying a softshell. To be honest, I can't think of a single day that I didn't have it on last season.

[schuss]

note: I'm in the east, so powder=no most of the time. I also usually wear my hardshell over it, mainly because my fleece has but one pocket.

[CantDog]

Do a search for beyond fleece and see how much I love mine. Took it for a tour today, and when it was really windy and cold up on the summit I threw on my shell. Packs small, is lightweight, and does equally well as a stand alone ski jacket, insulation, or used for running in cold weather. Its scholler fabric, but I've got pit zips and have never had a problem.

[house]

MHW alchemy. i wear it a lot. the end

[Viva]

I'm with Seldon on this topic. I run a Marmot Driclime wind shirt under my Cloudveil softshell when things get windy. The Cloudveil (Serendipity) isn't very wind resistant, but it does breathe well. This combo works well when hiking in the snow or light rain.

I also have a Cloudveil wind proof fleece that I don't use so much anymore. Still, it's a very nice jacket with a Schoeller (I'm impressed that you guys know how to spell Scholler- I had to cut 'n paste) back.

[powndnstein]

For bc and resort all i ever use is a polar tech 200 fleece pullover on skin and an incredibly inexpensive Cabellas soft shell gore-tex parka with pit zips. When it gets hot in the spring just take off the parka for hiking. That's up here in the PNW where it gets down to the low teens in the coldest of times.Parka has a hood, but have had mine for 4 seasons and besides being breathable and waterproof it's warm too for being a mere shell, also half the price of gore-tex by any of the manufacturers.

[jonski]

Used to work for North Face, so got to try plenty of the stuff out.

If the breathability is the thing, its all about the soft shell. No way the windstopper or the windbloc can match the new soft shells out there. Also they both have the same DWR coating to keep *most* of the damp stuff out (same at least on TNF), except as was already said, no sealed seams.

If you want to keep out the wind, then the windstopper wins. However, if the wind is really that bad, your generally not gonna go looking for a day in the BC cos of the associated problem this brings (well, at least I wouldn't ), so it is potentially less of a biggy, as it when your more likely to be resort or take a days rest.(my excuse there!! )

Most of the TNF athletes now use the soft shells as this mixed mid/outer - the climbers climb, then chuck on the down jackets to belay, the skiers use it for ascents then chuck on the XCR to descend, the ultra marathon guys use it for running during night when they need extra warmth without the lack of breathability, etc.

Last thing is that as the softshell is NOT a bonded fabric like windstopper, it has the benefit of give and stretch, making it more comfortable to wear as it 'moves' more easily.

Personally, I use the soft shell, as has all the above benefits and feels to me to be lighter, but that is obviously dependent on the cut of the chosen garment.

[homerjay]

Softshell all the way, especially since 'breathability is key.' If it's too windy/nasty for the soft shell, throw on a light goretex shell.

Consider Arcteryx Gamma jackets, I think it's made of Polartec Powershield.

[Dromond]

For bc and resort all i ever use is a polar tech 200 fleece pullover on skin and an incredibly inexpensive Cabellas soft shell gore-tex parka with pit zips. When it gets hot in the spring just take off the parka for hiking. That's up here in the PNW where it gets down to the low teens in the coldest of times.Parka has a hood, but have had mine for 4 seasons and besides being breathable and waterproof it's warm too for being a mere shell, also half the price of gore-tex by any of the manufacturers.

This Cabelas jacket? http://tinyurl.com/5g6dz

[SPREAD EAGLE]

MTN Hardwear Windstopper = happiness for me 4 six years.

I like the soft shell contouring, but I have only used the fleece. I ski most of my days in it.