Super7 vs lotus 120

[jerr]

Any one have a comparison?

Any thoughts?

[capulin overdrive]

do a search for S7 sidewall blowouts and i'd think you'd have your answer.

[hutash]

I know someone who just bought S7's, and has some 120's for sale. If that says anything.

I don't know about side wall issues, but the one run I did on the S7's was pretty sweet. I wouldn't say better then the Lhasa's I was skiing, just different.

[I've seen black diamonds!]

I like the 120'S much more. I think it comes down to skiing style.

[jerr]

^^Can you elaborate, describe which ski suits what attributes. Thanks

[fouldsys]

maybe look into the new w112 rp? seems like a better alternative to the s7 than 120s.

[nightfryer]

Dont have too much expierence on the lotus 120 but the rocker shape and construction of the S7 deffinatly takes some getting used to, just like on all rockered skis you cant ski too far forward on then on anything hard packed but in my opinion I have never skied a rockered ski with so much versaility. I just took my S7 188 not even the 195 back to east vail chutes yesterday they floated over everything and I have a blast. Then I took them on the frontside and RIPPED them down the mountain for the rest of the day. I would have to say if you have an interest in those skis the best thing about the 195 is the sheet of metal in them and the only small gripe I have is that they might not be still enough. I think if you buy the S7 in my opinion you wont ski anything else ever!

[wcf3]

I own a pair of 200cm 120's (2) and have skied with a number of people on the S7's. The designs are very different:

-Super 7 / S7 has a 'recurve shape' with a lot of side cut: Lots of rocker on tips and tails with center section having a traditional shape (cambered with sidecut). Radius on S7 17.5m, Super 7 22.5m.

-120's are a semi-pintail with some tip rocker and very little sidecut (big, wide tip, mounting point quite far back on the ski, tail at widest point barely wider than undedfoot). Radius 46m (190), 51m (200).

Don't know the exact weights on the rossi's, but the Super 7, with a sheet of metal is fairly heavy, while the 120's in carbon are probably the lightest skis of that size available.

Advantages/disadvantages:

-Powder: Both are very good. The 120's probably have a slight advantage in float (pintail) and a bit more stability at high speed (less rocker, sidecut).
-Crud/breaking crust/variable: This is not the strong suite of either of these skis. The sharp sidecut of the S7 can make them twitchy at speed in these conditions while the light weight and 'reactiveness' (quick rebound) of the 120's can also make them rather twitchy. Of the two I'd probably give a slight edge to the 120's, particularly in a flex-3, due to the long turning radius.
-Firm, steep snow (think icy couloir): Here is where the tight sidecut and more symmetric shape of the S7/super7 shines. Much easier to hold an edge on steep firm snow than with the 120's. Probably the weakest point of the 120's, which can skid and chatter under these conditions and the pintail is prone to washing out a bit.
-Jibbing: The symmetry in shape and big tail rocker of the S7/super7 give them the nod here, in spite of the heavier weight.
-Touring: The light weight and relatively short tail without rocker (kick turns) give the 120's a major advantage for this usage.

[bptempleton]

^^^ Well said, I was considering attempting a similar synopsis, but it would have come out alot stupider. I haven't been on the S7, but lotus 120's absolutely kill it.

[jerr]

wcf3 - Thanks for that - insightful.

[I've seen black diamonds!]

wcf3 said it well. I would add that the 120's, like most skis with little sidecut, are extremely predictable in all conditions, while in chopped up snow that is beginning to set, the S7's sometimes shoot off in an unexpected direction. While I haven't experienced much tail washout with the 120's the S7's can certainly carve short turns with far less input.

I ski the 120's with Dynafits, and think they are the greatest, although I think I might prefer flex 3 to my flex 2's. I thought the S7's were a bit too soft for a resort ski, so I bought ON3P Billy Goats, which are definitely a bit more powerful. I've had some issues getting the tune dialed in, which has made them behave bizarrely on groomers, but if you are heavier or ski with more muscle than finesse, I would recommend them over the S7. On the other hand, even though the 120's are the softest ski I own, I never seem to over power them, most likely because the flat tail and subtle rocker makes it easier to engage the entire length of the ski.

In powder they're all great.

If I could only keep 1 it would be the 120's because they fly uphill and I value predictability over turnability. If you don't tour and ski a steep area that gets tracked out quickly the S7's or Billy Goats might be the ticket.

[khyber.pass]

I've had some issues getting the tune dialed in, which has made them behave bizarrely on groomers, but if you are heavier or ski with more muscle than finesse, I would recommend them over the S7. On the other hand, even though the 120's are the softest ski I own, I never seem to over power them, most likely because the flat tail and subtle rocker makes it easier to engage the entire length of the ski.

In powder they're all great.

Indeed.

re:/ 120 tuning. I've been meaning to detune the tips significantly to reduce catch & release on the groomers, which produces annoying scrubbing and imperfect arcs, but the taper is so long that I don't want to turn them into snowlerblades. Did you detune the tips? If so, how far down? Curious.

[I've seen black diamonds!]

I've had few issues with the 120's on groomers, but I bought them used (about 10 days) so I've never skied them razor sharp. I find that if I tip them on edge gently, they'll make clean, long radius turns. Or I can throw them out to the side aggressively and arc medium radius turns. It's when I try to do something in the middle when they can act a bit funny.

Figuring out the Billy Goats on groomers has been harder for me in part because the base bevel was a bit off to begin with, but also because I'm not used to skis with a turning radius under 30m (BG's are about 22m). I'm planning on detuning the Billy Goats bit by bit over the course of a day (starting with the front-most section that could conceivably interact with groomed snow), while teaching myself to let the ski's sidecut do more of the work for me. I think my issues are due to the fact that I've grown accustomed to an Explosiv, and more recently a Bro Model turning radius and longer running length, as well as the fact that a rockered tip can engage unpredictably. If I'm too old to adjust, I'll trade them for something less turny.