Dynafit boot sole issue?

[PowderPig]

My recently tele-converted wife was using her new Dynafit setup (ST binding/Gaia boot) in Wolf Creek last weekend and noticed some issues - when stomping down with the heel (not very hard - just to make sure the heel is securely locked in), the toe would release. She also pre-released at one point when skiing.
When I was looking at the toe, it seemed like the pins weren't going in as deep as they do on my setup (ST binding/Radium boot). I was checking for ice/snow buildup on the binding and in the sockets, but it all looked fine. She ended up locking the touring lever one click, which fixed the issue.
After we got home I noticed that the soles have wear marks right underneath where the arms lock into the boot.
When looking at the boot/binding when the toe is locked in, it seems like the cutouts in the soles are placed too far backward, and that the sole therefore prevents the toe arms from locking down completely. I love my Dynafit setups and have never had any issues over the years, but it's a bit disconcerting to find this kind of issue with a Dynafit boot/binding setup, should this be the root cause of the problem. Even though it should be pretty easy to fix it.
On the pictures, the toe seems to lock in the same amount on both boots, but I'm thinking that this could be due to the rubber in the soles being softer, as I shot the pictures indoors.

I'm curious to hear if other people have noticed anything similar? Does it sound like a reasonable cause, or did I just miss a tiny piece of ice somewhere? Someone in [ame="http://www.tetongravity.com/forums/showthread.php?t=146057"]this thread[/ame] mentioned something similar; I wonder if it's the same going on there?

Cheers,
-pp

[jon turner]

Her boot is the gray one? Looks like the edge of the boot sole might not be letting the binding fully engage. I would shave a 1 or 2 mm of rubber off where the arm hits the sole and see if it engages better. Your boot (blue/orange) looks to have more room for the toe arms to move there.

[Tye 1on]

When i look at that second picture, it makes me wonder if the cups aren't a bit forward of where the should be. Aren't the pins usually engaged symmetrically, so they are catching the same amount of the cup all the way around? These look like the back part of the cup is engaging a lot more pin than the front edge of the cup.

[PowderPig]

Her boot is the gray one? Looks like the edge of the boot sole might not be letting the binding fully engage. I would shave a 1 or 2 mm of rubber off where the arm hits the sole and see if it engages better. Your boot (blue/orange) looks to have more room for the toe arms to move there.

Yeah, her boot is the gray one.
I agree with your observation and possible resolution, but am surprised to experience an issue with it in the first place, especially since it's a Dynafit boot/binding combo.

[GeezerSteve]

I would shave a 1 or 2 mm of rubber off where the arm hits the sole and see if it engages better.

Assuming that her boot is the gray one, I'll second this suggestion. Maybe the binding arm is acting a fulcrum when she stomps down on the heel, resulting in the top popping out.

SO Anita had a similar problem with her Spirit 3's & Comforts. Some grinding of the sole cured the problem.

[PowderPig]

When i look at that second picture, it makes me wonder if the cups aren't a bit forward of where the should be. Aren't the pins usually engaged symmetrically, so they are catching the same amount of the cup all the way around? These look like the back part of the cup is engaging a lot more pin than the front edge of the cup.

I think this could be an illusion caused by the "quick step-in" feature on the boot?

[Tye 1on]

I think this could be an illusion caused by the "quick step-in" feature on the boot?

Could be, although i thought that feature was simply the track that runs straight down from the cup center. If you have the same amount of that 'slot' on the backside [you know, the four 'slots' that are on the pins for god knows what reason] then it would be symmetrical.

[Dromond]

Could be, although i thought that feature was simply the track that runs straight down from the cup center. If you have the same amount of that 'slot' on the backside [you know, the four 'slots' that are on the pins for god knows what reason] then it would be symmetrical.

As far as I know, the slots on the toe pincers themselves are there to clear ice from the toe sockets as your tour and/or before you lock the toe before touring. Just FYI.

[jon turner]

Yeah, her boot is the gray one.
I agree with your observation and possible resolution, but am surprised to experience an issue with it in the first place, especially since it's a Dynafit boot/binding combo.

You would hope that things would work perfect out of the box, and I believe usually they do, but with Dynafit being a small company and close tolerances in the manufacturing process, occasionally this can happen. I would imagine if you took them to the shop you bought them from, they would call dynafit and deal with it as a waranty issue, but it's probably easier to try trimming the sole first. I believe Lou at Wildsnow has documented other similar issues and solutions.

[GeezerSteve]

Grinding on the mark left by the jaw arm seems to be the obvious place to start:

Glued on boot soles, like all soft goods, defy precise manufacturing standards. If a bit of grinding solves the problem (as it did on Anita's Spirit 3's), then no big deal.

Aren't the pins usually engaged symmetrically, so they are catching the same amount of the cup all the way around?

No. The pins always penetrate shallower at the front of the dimple and deeper at the rear of the dimple. The outside edges of the boot toe are tapered, not parallel. The pin penetration in the second pic looks fine to me. What looks wrong is the sole jamming against the jaw arm.

[Tye 1on]

thanks for the clarification Steve-

[PowderPig]

Thanks for your comments.

We went back to the shop and tried another pair of size 23 as well as a size 24 of the Gaia; those boots had the same sole issue. We also tried a size 25, which looked better. Consequently, I believe there is a problem with this boot in size 23 and 24.
As expected, grinding the sole seems to have solved the problem.
It may not seem like a big deal, as there's an easy fix, but consider the possible consequences of a pre-release. I will definitely double-check the boot-binding interface when I get new boots in the future!

-pp