Photo JONG questions

[shirk]

So I want to take my photo's to the next level from the basic digital point and shoot. Currently I have a Panasonic Lumix DMC LC33 (3.2 meg point and shoot with Leica optics). Looking to upgrade to something better. The question is do I go all the way to a digital SLR or something like the DMC LC1. I would be using it for biking, skiing, and scenery pictures mostly.

Second question. Any suggestions on a good photography book so I can move along from JONG to mearly a gapper.

[summit]

Photography by London and Upton
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg...books&n=507846

Take a class.

Get a manual focus 35mm SLR

Learn real photography

Otherwise be sure your digitoy has full manual controls.

[The AD]

Looking to upgrade to something better. The question is do I go all the way to a digital SLR or something like the DMC LC1.

I'd say go for a high-end fixed lens camera UNLESS you already have a few SLR lenses that you want to continue to use. If you do upgrade, look for a camera with a good lens otherwise you'll probably get worse photos than you did with the Lumix. Be more concerned about the optical quality than the zoom range.

[Max Gosey]

Photography by London and Upton

Holy balls. $100?

Don't know if I'll be able to fit photo I in my schedule... particularly not soon (and I want to learn photo sooner than that), and I'm wondering if this book is a good substitute. Need some summer reading material.

Do something similar plus what's not covered in my physiology book and I'll be edjumcated when I get back to Boulder.

[pechelman]

Holy balls. $100?

Don't know if I'll be able to fit photo I in my schedule... particularly not soon (and I want to learn photo sooner than that), and I'm wondering if this book is a good substitute. Need some summer reading material.

Do something similar plus what's not covered in my physiology book and I'll be edjumcated when I get back to Boulder.

you dont need to spend 100$ on a book
the internet has a lot of information, however, at this stage in the game, ignore EVERYTHING you read about filters. Get the basics down first.
get a cheap 35mm SLR camera as suggested
if youre at\near a university see if you can get cheap access to a darkroom
I know at my school students were 12$ a semester and faculty\others were 35$ a semester. Considering how much fixer and developer I used over one semester, it more than paid for itself just in chemicals.

find a friend that knows how to dev film and make prints
that way you can do this on your own pretty damned cheap.

[yesIsaidyes]

^^^ fuck film, go digital - you get more instant results so you learn faster...plus you get to email all your friends the pics..

check out the forums on dpreview.com - SO MUCH info there...

[yesIsaidyes]

you dont need to spend 100$ on a book.

true - there are used copies on amazon for under $30...

[cj001f]

^^^ fuck film, go digital - you get more instant results so you learn faster

2x

Quicker feedback, lower cost per image, plus the exif info will give you aperture, shutter speed, focal length, metering mode, and film speed so you can tell part of what made that good picture good.

and it's called a library for fucks sake. Most have tons of photobooks available FREE!

[Max Gosey]

Damnit. I forgot libraries exist...

I got the book for $10 off ebay. Looking forward to learning this summer.

Didn't know dpr had a forum. That's where I was looking for buying my camera... Good stuff over there for sure. I will take a peek.

Thanks, guys.

[yesIsaidyes]

just don't spend more time on DP than you spend here...also don't forget to look at the forum at Wheelsandwax - for expertise on photo stuff, dp is to TGR like WAW is to newschoolers - or something like that...

[Max Gosey]

just don't spend more time on DP than you spend here...

For loyalty reasons? Or because it will dominate my life?

[yesIsaidyes]

^because we'll miss you...
and yes, it will dominate your life (and its full of a bunch of middle aged limeys obsessed with pictures of birds and insects)...

[mtbakerskier]

just don't spend more time on DP than you spend here...also don't forget to look at the forum at Wheelsandwax - for expertise on photo stuff, dp is to TGR like WAW is to newschoolers - or something like that...

HUH? Post then smoke crack.

Anyways.

Fuck the read a bunch of books and study website bullshit. The ONLY way that your goingto learn how to take pics is to go out and start taking pictures. Put the camera on manual, and just accpet the fact that intill you shoot a few thouasnd pics your probally not going to get very many god pics consistantly.

Thats how I and every pro photog I have ever met learned, and if you want ot get good, thats how to do it.

[Meathelmet]

Fuck the read a bunch of books and study website bullshit.

Have to say that i couldn´t disagree more...

The (theory) books are a good add to your learning,just dont get too focused on the techicality.

More important, i could say,the most important thing is to LOOK at photographers pictures in books.
See how they have percieved the world, how they have chosen the moment and framing.What lighting,how and why they have used it.

And to add to that, study the basics of the visual arts,f.e painting, if you have the intrest.
Learn on what the basics of compositon, framing and dynamics of visual percieving is based.
The eye and human brain.

You propably will have about three phases in the near future, after you have gotten your camera, be it digi or manual filmcamera.

1.Tech phase:like in skiing,you are intrested in the basic fysics and mechanics.What,how and why? You know, the guy stuff. You might be more intrested in the camera than the result. (Read, Max Gooseys quiver diliemma...)

2.Fan phase : You have started to take pics, you have your photographers that you like and like to copy their visual style. Wich is nice, you learn to look at pictures how they are made,technically and arrangment wise.
(Read, participating at str8gthlines camps..)

3.You phase : You start to create your own world, chose your own reality and shape that in to a picture that is "you". That phase will take you on a ride of a lifetime, meeting people,seing places and expericening stuff that you never otherwise would have dreamed of.
(Read,iskibc TR of skiing pyramid peak)




Sorry, didnt mean to sound patronising or anything.

Just some thoughts if people are intrested in photography (wich there seems to be quite a lot on this board) .

Enjoy the trip...







Edit: And i totally agree with MBS on shooting stuff as much as possible, off course.

[summit]

I wouldn't pay $100. Buy one used or an older edition or check it out from your local library.

Photography is a CRAFT not an art. This means it is a mixture of technical knowhow AND artful creativity.

You get better results when you tell the camera how you want it to capture what you see in your mind and have composed with your hands and feet instead of letting the auto-everything figure it out for you.

Part of being able to do that is commanding a basic understanding of the technical aspect of photography. Probably the best way to do that is to enrol in a little 2 or 3 hour photo course at your college with a full manual camera and print all of your own work. Especially barring darkroom access, you should teach yourself the basic technical understanding using a good book and the internet.

Combine your knowhow with a study of the works of others, of their creativity and composition, and you'll have a good footing to expand into your own minds eye with the ability to put what you imagine into what others can see. Burn out your shutter, you'll get better.

[Max Gosey]

I just can't see how you have nothing to gain by reading the technical basics.

Compare it to skiing. Yes you can get good at skiing by skiing a LOT and never really knowing what you're doing, but doesn't it make more sense to have some coaching before you begin? That's the way I see it, anyway.

I need to learn what looks GOOD (and why it looks good) before I can make anything of my own look good. (And with obligations assoc. with med school, my time to go shoot a shitload of pictures is a little constrained... I'm not saying that a book is a substitute for experience because it's not... what I am saying is that if I have a technical knowledge base, I won't be taking "shots in the dark" so to speak when I do go out and start to shoot photos.)

Does this make sense?

[cj001f]

no, but in other news people learn differently and there is no one road to any destination

[shirk]

More important, i could say,the most important thing is to LOOK at photographers pictures in books.
See how they have percieved the world, how they have chosen the moment and framing.What lighting,how and why they have used it.

...but then all my pictures will look like someone elses pictures

Make the pictures look like what YOU want them to, not just trying to copy what someone else saw.

Not trying to bust your chops just my opinion that you should work to be original.

Lots of great points here.

[Meathelmet]

...but then all my pictures will look like someone elses pictures

Yup.

That was the "phase 2" that i mentioned about...




Summit nailed it very well in his post.

The technical part is extremely importan,obviously.
And learning that part,say, in a class with a good teacher and likeminded friends is propably the best possible way to do it.
Hands on,hands dirty,dark room and a lot of mistakes.
You´ll get very far with it.


If you just do it for your fun, then you will have a lifelong hobby that will reward you in exremely many ways.

If it at some point of life turns into a work, well, then you propably have one of the best professions in this world...

So it is a win/win situation.

Apart from that in either case it will suck all your money.

Everyone insert a pun of choice here.

[ski-smurf]

go with film, once you learn everything about film photography it can transfer over to digital, its a lot harder to just jump straight into DSLR photography. plus SLRs are really cheap right now

[Cirquerider]

You can get a 7+ megapixel camera that is small and takes great pictures, and is fast like the Canon A620. It won't break the bank, and its small enough you will likely carry it. You dont' get pics unless you take the camera. If you are ready to ski around your camera, get a big SLR with an assortment of lenses. Otherwise, take great pics with a high resolution compact camera and enjoy life.

[mtbakerskier]

I just can't see how you have nothing to gain by reading the technical basics.

Sure, reading books will teach you some of the fundamentals, but YOU HAVE TO GO OUT AND APPLY IT, by shooting a lot. Just readingbooks and ocassionally shooting pics wont do it. Plus by shopoting a lot and experimenting, you will learn when to and when not to break the "rules".

[Max Gosey]

Sure, reading books will teach you some of the fundamentals, but YOU HAVE TO GO OUT AND APPLY IT, by shooting a lot. Just readingbooks and ocassionally shooting pics wont do it. Plus by shopoting a lot and experimenting, you will learn when to and when not to break the "rules".

Of course. I'll have my camera on the boat a lot this summer. Might post some slalom pics for critiquing if that's ok with some of you photogs, even though they're NSR (but they're action photography...)

[mtbakerskier]

Of course. I'll have my camera on the boat a lot this summer. Might post some slalom pics for critiquing if that's ok with some of you photogs, even though they're NSR (but they're action photography...)

Lets see em. Looking at pics sure beats actually doing work anytime

[Max Gosey]

Excellent! Looking forward to taking a shitload...