Photo Ethics

[Clack]

Originally posted by The AD

People who say the cigarette companies aren't doing anything wrong because it's people's choice to smoke are wrong, IMO. These companies are selling a product they know kills millions of people and is highly addictive. I'd say they have some burden of guilt here.

This mindset makes me crazy. No one will take personal responsibility or correctly identifies blame any more.

Same mentality:

Man is skiing in a blizzard, goes out of bounds and gets lost for two days. Sues Squaw (who's patrol found his ass) for not better marking their bounderies.

Kid shoots liquor store owner in the face. Blame falls on the gun manufacturers and/or lack of education/funding/something positive society should have done in the child's life.

I call bullshit on both. People are responsible for their own decisions. Sell the friking pictures.

[The AD]

Originally posted by monster dump.
This mindset makes me crazy. No one will take personal responsibility or correctly identifies blame any more.

Same mentality:

blah blah blah. Same mentality my ass. You're wearing blinders if you honestly think the scenarios you quoted are at all analogous to the liability the tobacco companies have for selling cigarettes. I just don't see the similarity at all.

I'm not saying the smokers are blameless, but the tobacco companies certainly share the blame.

[Clack]

People choose to smoke. They are not forced. They are not coerced any more than any other product. They know the risks involved. It's their responsibility. This comes from a smoker. I don't blame them. Why do you?

I agree with your comment on health care costs. That is a cost borne by all and I don't think it should be covered.

The blah, blah, in my opinion, is all the rhetoric about how people aren't smart enough to make their own decisions, and if they do make poor decisions, it must be someone else's fault through coercion, lack of education, etc.

Good dialouge here. Still, Grant, sell the pictures. [SIZE=1]and if I die it'll be on your shoulders.


edit - And I'll give you that the companies aren't saints, and should have come forward on their own account years earlier. Responsibility can be taken on both sides, but demand drives the market.

[BakerBoy]

Originally posted by FollowMe
Grant...how do you feel? I think you should Chase your dreams, build your resume, and parlay it into something better... [/B]

Grant's gf smokes, and he doesn't DARE tell her to stop!

[FNG]

Grant,

If I were you, I'd take the money and sell the pictures. It's no mystery that cigarettes are bad for you. Hell, there's a big sign on each package that says so. People still smoke. The cigarette companies even pay for the anti-smoking ad campaign TRUTH, yet people still smoke. Not wearing your seat-belt is not only illegal, but also has marketing campaigns and the like about it, yet people still don't buckle up. It is very unlikely that your pictures are going to have any sort of impact on smoking or smokers, they will however have a nice impact on your wallet.

That is all.
- FNG

[FollowMe]

Originally posted by BakerBoy
Grant's gf smokes, and he doesn't DARE tell her to stop!

My point exactly

[dipstik]

Originally posted by AH
Nice ethics dude..

The secret is to not fret about what is right or wrong or what is "morally acceptable", only what is effective. In this case, selling the pics for money is definitely the most effective. Nice guys finish last. You think anyone at the top of a competitive market got there by being friendly, generous, and moral? Bullshit. Take a look at every man who has been elected president, every single one is a shit slinger.

By not selling his pic MBS is not going to save some innocent little child from picking up a pack of smokes. To quote carlin "kids don't smoke because a camel in sunglasses tells them to. They smoke for the same reasons adults do, because it relieves anxiety and depression."

The first cigarette I ever smoked had nothing to do with an ad or a funny picture or any of that. I did it out of curiosity, and funny enough anxiety and depression. Second and third and fourth and fifth were the same. The difference is that after I went through enough packs to satisfy my curiosity, I knew and understood why it was time to stop.

Any kid who isn't a complete moron can tell you that if you smoke enough cigarettes, it will kill you. Same goes for eating at McDonalds or sniffing markers. You can't tell me adults are any different.

This question shouldn't even be being discussed, it's absurd. People choose to smoke that first ciggy full well knowing the consequences. And if they don't, it's not like there aren't shitloads of programs and support groups and books and chewing gum to help them break the habit. I know it ain't easy, but nothing in life is ever handed to you. Those that want it bad enough get it.


Cigarette companies are genius. They tell people straight up that their product will kill them, but people buy it anyway. They profit on idiocy and laziness, and people don't like facing that reality.

Do what you want, but don't blame anyone else for the problems you created.

[midget]

The only thing I'd be concerned about is the athlete in the photos being considered. If they don't care then make some real money! Stoked to hear that you'd be pulling some mainstream advertisement dorrahs! Just make sure yer charging mainstream advertising rates!

[Greydon Clark]

Cigarette companies produce a product that kills people. If you work for them you are contributing to someones horrible, painful death. You might not contribute much, but you are contributing something or they wouldn't write you a check.



Monster Dump, since you choose to smoke I encourage you to take responsiblity for yourself and show up for opening day in shape. It makes me crazy when smokers drag ass and complain about being out of shape. Correctly identifing blame isn't enough, you have to do something about it.

[freshie247]

This isn't a lofter than thou expose on whether or not he should market his photo's,it's a simple POV on why cigs are the worst.Yes Alcohol & other things can be bad,My Uncle & my best friend died from Alcohol & drugs.People don't consider nicotine to be that kind of drug,it's the most socially acceptable drug besides caffeine.No body will raise an eyebrow if you smoke at work,but you'll get fired if you drink at work,unless you're a bartender or musician.

Smoking to relieve anxiety & depression,that is the stupidest thing I've heard since compassionate conservatism.Does the phrase Pavlovian response mean anything?How can a stimulant calm you down ,settle your stomach,clear your head,or get you ready for bed? It can't ! Your mind makes an association & causes your body to release the chemicals needed to give the desired effect.

Any particular answer as to why cig's are the only thing you can ingest that doesn't have a list of ingrediants on it?I've got a few ideas about it.

It's a machiavellian dilemma ! I tell you,no matter what some may think,Young people have no idea what they are getting into.I hate it when people don't take responsiblity for there actions,but it's a tough sell to equate getting hooked on the most popular,socially acceptable drug ,to some one eating Mcdonalds every day & getting fat & suing MCD's.While we all have to eat to live,we don't have to smoke to live.Forgive me Tommy Chong!Some addicts have no idea that they are junkies,they live a partitioned life.

Kids see a sign that says black diamond on a run that doesn't have bumps & isn't steep,so they enter the gate ,& cruise down a flat groomed slope for a while thinking this is great,I'm skiing a black run,see there's nothing to worry about.After a little while when they are totally & irrevocally commited,they all of the sudden notice it's very steep & there are huge bumps.This when some start to think,How in the funk did I get here.Others are so amalgamated into the process,that they no longer remember a time when they weren't part of the matrix.Kind of like the axiom,if you do a bad thing long enough,it no longer seems bad.

[AH]

Originally posted by dipstik
The secret is to not fret about what is right or wrong or what is "morally acceptable", only what is effective. In this case, selling the pics for money is definitely the most effective. Nice guys finish last. You think anyone at the top of a competitive market got there by being friendly, generous, and moral? Bullshit. Take a look at every man who has been elected president, every single one is a shit slinger.

I understand where you're coming from, but your story has nothing to do with ethics. Ethics are about wrong and right, not what is most effective.

Second, karma has a way of helping the 'nice guys'. I know that they don't get up the corporate ladder as easy, but again, that doesn't say anything about wrong and right. Heck, in terms of the precidency, there's one hell of a un-ethical man in the oval office and I don't know if you should be proud of his effectiveness...

[mildbill.]

Originally posted by AH
Heck, in terms of the precidency, there's one hell of a un-ethical man in the oval office and I don't know if you should be proud of his effectiveness...

hey, that's really relevant!! thanks for that interesting perspective!!!

[AH]

Originally posted by mildbill.
hey, that's really relevant!! thanks for that interesting perspective!!!

In fact it is. It proves the point that effectiveness has nothing to do with ethics.

Try to read between the lines...

[mildbill.]

Originally posted by AH

Try to read between the lines...

i did.

we get it.

you don't like our president.

here's a medal [/bling]

[Potsy]

Same goes for eating at McDonalds or sniffing markers.

And some would say I'm wasting time here, but I just learned something....it's off to the supply room for me.

If you live in America and haven't heard that cigarettes are bad you for by now, it's amazing you've made it this far. Cigarettes companies are the new communists, seems like we gotta have someone to fear/hate in this country. Might as well be them. Anybody notce the dividend and 3 year chart on RAI?