Euro mags- jong europe question

[snowfire]

VAT? eh? I think I missed something there.

We were planning on bringing beacon, shovel, probe anyways. I've heard stories about avy conditions in Europe, and we're hopefully planning on doing some lift-accessed out-of-bounds at least. If there's a good website to keep track of snowpack and conditions over there, let me know.

LITT, it'd be fun to get in some skiing/skinning with you (or anyone, really) if we could arrange it! We're going to try and stay pretty flexible, and make our plans depending on where it's snowing. Although, I'm sure you do that to some extent as well.

TeleAl, thanks for the hostel list! I'll definitely check into those in a couple of weeks when I get the flights and car figured out.

Thanks for the car advice too, we'll probably go with the 206 and get the roof bars and bring bungee cords. I think that'll get us by.

The petrol car is going to cost us $926 for 26 days and the diesel would cost $1,126. We'll probably just go with the petrol because I really can't see us saving $200 using diesel vs. petrol. Or is that not far off?

allright.. more research... and I'll click on the little British flag when I go to the Chambery site, thanks.

[Spamhelmet]

Here are few european avalanche sites.
They are ususally in the local language, and not translated in
english,witch sucks. The best info you get from local guides and
guide companies. Just go there and ask for the preavious weather
patterns and have a cup of espresso. Usually (at least in the italian side) they are more than helpfull.Especially if you are a woman...


Overview : www.lawine.org

Italy : www.aineva.it
: http://www.regione.piemonte.it/meteo...s/bollnivo.htm
: http://www.cai-svi.it/
: http://www.provincia.bz.it/lawinen/

Swizerland: http://www.slf.ch/

France : http://www.meteofrance.com/FR/montagne/index.jsp
: http://www.anena.org/

And if possible, take the diesel.In gasoline cars you see a drastic performance hit when you get higher up. After 1.5km you feel
like you´re towing a camper behind you.
Diesel isnt affected that much by altitude.
It´ll save lot of nerves, i can tell you...

[supercastor]

Thanks guys for the nice memories you brought me speaking of SSB & GSB. Oh so much fun in this place. I used to sleep in the Ribone's chalet in Bourg, like, a pure swiss Chalet with carved beams and all. The "resort" is gnarly, and I second all the scary (weather and topography) things that were said.
Added on my todo list for this winter (winter, she is coming fast. First snow flakes on the Pyrénées this WE).

Verbier... Well, if I remember well this is the place where I paid the most expensive ski pass in my whole life. And didn't had much fun (swiss GF stayed at home, was alone) except for a kicker with funny yankees (is this oxymoronic?).

[Hicks]

Originally posted by Spamhelmet
The best info you get from local guides and
guide companies

Just one thing:
Make sure you talk to a UIAA certified mountain guide and ask for a such- not all what's running around there deserves to be called a 'guide'.

[verbier61]

how to calculate gas vs diesel:
unleaded gas is about 1.15 euro/liter in france and italy
diesel fuel is about 0.95 euro/liter in france and italy

unleaded gas and diesel fuel are about 0.95 euro/liter in switzerland
(they have much less taxes on gas, but no discount on diesel)

then you can calculate that a Peugeot 206 makes approximately
10-13 km with one liter (unleaded gas version)
16-18 km with one liter (diesel fuel version)

You can calculate it, but I would say that the diesel version would almost certainly give you an advantage if you stay mostly in France (and maybe have a tour in the western italian alps). Should you stay in switzerland, then the cheaper swiss unleaded might seriuosly question the diesel advantage. Absolutely no problems related to horsepower etc. I usually travel with a car of the same size and power (citroen C3) and it's OK everywere. Instead of chains, you might get the new white texile covers for tyres (don't remember the name, but I'll let you know later). They are extremely easy to put on and remove from tyres (even under heavy snow at 3 AM.... ) and work pretty well.

When I heard all these comments on how switz is expensive compared to france etc, I am now a little bit skeptic. First, euro has changed a LOT of things. the Swiss franc is now definitely weak over the euro (exactly as the US dollar....) so when I go to Cham and Gressoney etc I feel costs in these places very similar (or even higher) to verbier area. Of course there are luxurious and affordable places everywere, and le Chable (7 min lift for verbier) is MUCH MORE cheaper than verbier, exacly like the small spots few Km before Gressoney and Alagna are cheaper than the resorts. In any case, the best scenario are towns near the border. Swiss people from Lugano usually went to cheaper italian Como for shopping. Now it's exactly the opposite. Italian people from Como (or even Milan) go to Lugano for cheaper shopping in swiss francs. See what's happen next.

I prolly already said that, but my bottomline suggestion is
TRAVEL!
once you have a car (which is by far the best option), stay tuned (use the euro maggot-net) to understand were the best snow is and go there. Last december-january was the south west of alps, this coming year who knows

[Lostinthetrees]

Originally posted by snowfire
VAT? eh? I think I missed something there.

We were planning on bringing beacon, shovel, probe anyways. I've heard stories about avy conditions in Europe, and we're hopefully planning on doing some lift-accessed out-of-bounds at least. If there's a good website to keep track of snowpack and conditions over there, let me know.

LITT, it'd be fun to get in some skiing/skinning with you (or anyone, really) if we could arrange it! We're going to try and stay pretty flexible, and make our plans depending on where it's snowing. Although, I'm sure you do that to some extent as well.

.

VAT = value-added tax (France). Here is your first lesson - "Est-ce que le veh-ah-teh inclus?" (enclue...do not pronounce the s.)

Prices in CH always include tax(es).

If you are bringing skins you will be doing more than lift accessed!

Ditto on getting together. Follow the storms and stay mobile. I always do it...not to "some extent"...ALL the time! We have 12 big areas within 2 hour drive. Even as we are driving we are determining the best location depending on day of week, snowfall totals, weather forecast, who has discount passes, etc.

If it happens that we cross paths, then it happens. As time comes closer check the Board and PM me.

litt

[horizon]

Er, isn't it TVA in French? (Taxe sur la valeur ajoutee)...teh veh aah

(I don't know as much about the best skiing as other maggots, so I'm nitpicking. FWIW, I could fit 180 skis in a Ford Fiesta, about the same size as the Peugeot you're looking at).

[Ripzalot]

Originally posted by Lostinthetrees

SSB. TeleAl,
I never knew you made the trip over to Italy (Etroubles)? We were up there and decided against it 'cause we had a friggin' boarder with us who was going to have to posthole his way into Italy!!! I am taking the trip into Italy this year. I have skins. Let's do it!

"friggin' boarder"? who waits on whom?

don't make me jong you. remember i have pics.


snowfire, we'll hook you up. between us three jongs, we should be able to find some decent pow. looks like i'll be here (lausanne) for all of december, so just holler when you get in the neighborhood.

[Lostinthetrees]

Originally posted by horizon
Er, isn't it TVA in French? (Taxe sur la valeur ajoutee)...teh veh aah

I stand corrected, horizon.

[Lostinthetrees]

Originally posted by Ripzalot
"friggin' boarder"? who waits on whom?

don't make me jong you. remember i have pics.

Ripz,
Reading too much at work, I see.

Well, if you are ready this year, let's make the trip to Etroubles, IT. I can try to hold the bus as you posthole into town.

Decided to pick up a digital camera this season. Save your pics of me crashing, burning, and floundering in the pow. You will be needed them. This season I will be digitizing your amazing attempts of weightlessness.

litt

[snowfire]

My boyfriend and I just purchased our tickets!! We are REALLY GOING !!! I am so stoked right now!!! We're flying into Paris on Dec. 27 and flying back out of Geneva on Jan. 25.

Next order of business... leasing the car. We're still debating between petrol and diesel.

[snowfire]

Okay... planning the tentative loose route (leaving lots of space open to follow the snow).

Does anyone know of a map (France, N. Italy, Switzerland, Austria) that shows all the ski areas? I'm having a hard time finding one and it would help to know where I'm trying to go. I have a few maps, but none show the ski areas.

Also, we loosely calculated the mileage, and it looks like we'll be driving ~2500 km. This would not be enough to cover the $200 price difference between leasing a petrol and a diesel, especially when you factor in time in CH. So, I think we're going with the petrol. We might just have to push it up some hills.

I think I'm experiencing buyers shock at the moment.

[Spamhelmet]

ADAC is a (german?) mapmaker, that makes maps for skiing too.
They have 2 or 3 different thickness books,that have a piste map and
all nessecary telephone numbers etc... In those books you have covered
almost all european resorts(in the big one at least). Here they sell for
10 - 29Euros. I wouldn´t go and do a Haute´Reute with them, but for
planning and fantasizing they are exelent.

And go for the diesel, goddammit.

Highest passes are closed in the winter, so you dont have to tow your petrol engine through a 3000m pass, but diesels rule.

Diesels are the poor mans automatic transmission.

[bad_roo]

Snowfire pulls the trigger with furious abandon!

Nice work, girl.

[verbier61]

Okay... planning the tentative loose route (leaving lots of space open to follow the snow).
Also, we loosely calculated the mileage, and it looks like we'll be driving ~2500 km. This would not be enough to cover the $200 price difference between leasing a petrol and a diesel, especially when you factor in time in CH. So, I think we're going with the petrol. We might just have to push it up some hills.

:

2500 km..... if you do not travel more lookin for good snow and euro maggots I would probably pick the diesel option, but in any case it will be a matter of a few euro of difference. Do not loose your sleep thinkin about it. ADAC or Kompass are good map options.
WE'RE WAITING FOR YOU, GUYS

[snowfire]

Hostels, a partial list:

Zermatt (there are at least 2)
The Matterhorn
And the Government one
www.hostelz.com/view.php/Switzerland__Zermatt_Hostels

Saas Fee
Hotel Derby (not a hostel, but bomb shelter in hotel)
saas-fee.ch/en/hotel.cfm?ID=DERBY

Chamonix (Argentiere actually, better place to be for skiing)
The Belvedere
www.holidayfrance.com/index.cfm/property/2138

Al--

Those links didn't work, it might be my computer though.

[supercastor]

try to copy/paste them...

and go diesel...

And I may have a flat in grenoble, you're both still welcome. We'll show you les 7 laux (www.les7laux.com )

[snowfire]

try to copy/paste them...

and go diesel...

And I may have a flat in grenoble, you're both still welcome. We'll show you les 7 laux (www.les7laux.com )

Ah! There we go. IT worked. Thanks!
so excited for you and everyone else who has offered to show us around. We most definitely appreciate it!!

[snowfire]

I just leased a car. It's a Peugeot 206 1.4 diesel. We decided to go with the diesel based on all the maggot recommendations and the fact that we'll probably be putting more mileage on it than we loosely calculated with all the trips to the ski areas. It cost us $1,133. Ouch! More buyers (or in this case, leasers) shock. All I can say is, it better snow so the car leasing wasn't in vain!!



I also got chains for it... I'm hoping I can sell them at a hostel or something before we leave. They didn't know anything about the white covers and I figured it would be better just to get the chains right off instead of having to hunt for them in Paris. Hopefully we can sell them.

(Any Euro maggots need chains??)

yay!!

[Lostinthetrees]

I just leased a car. It's a Peugeot 206 1.4 diesel. We decided to go with the diesel based on all the maggot recommendations and the fact that we'll probably be putting more mileage on it than we loosely calculated with all the trips to the ski areas. It cost us $1,133. Ouch! More buyers (or in this case, leasers) shock. All I can say is, it better snow so the car leasing wasn't in vain!!



I also got chains for it... I'm hoping I can sell them at a hostel or something before we leave. They didn't know anything about the white covers and I figured it would be better just to get the chains right off instead of having to hunt for them in Paris. Hopefully we can sell them.

(Any Euro maggots need chains??)

yay!!

Chains:
- where you want to be...i.e. chasing the powder storms...driving up mtns. and over mtn passes you are required to carry chains. In dangerous conditions you could be stopped and not allowed to proceed without them.

- Good move, you don't want to wasting your vacation time in France looking for chains at the Carrefour (like Walmart).

- as long as the chains are never used and still in packaging you will be able to find someone to take them at 1/2 price. Each wheel size takes a different chain size.

Sticker shock... keeping car 30 days is about $38.00 US/day. keeping car 40 days is just under $30.00 US/day. Unlimited mileage, avoiding TVA, insurances, registration, and drop-off in location other than pick-up....
That is a bargin!

Drop us (Ripzalot & TeleAl) a line when your ready to ski Valais, CH. or PDS.

Bonne chance! U will have a great and memorable trip.

[snowfire]

...because our trip is less than 3 weeks away!!!! I am getting really, really excited. I booked hotels in Paris and Lyon for our first few days... that will take us until Jan 2. Then we are ready to ski! I'm going to be using this board and pm's a lot over there (hopefully there are internet cafe's all around) so I'm hoping you all will know where the snow's been and where it's going.

We're bringing skins, beacons, shovels, probes, and are really looking forward to skiing with anyone and everyone we can hook up with. Any crash pads are most appreciated as well, as it's seeming like most our money is going to be spent on lodging. We'll have sleeping bags. Supercastor, TeleAl, if the offers to crash are still open we'll take it. My email address (taking the risk of being stalked here ) is elizabethrs@eml.cc. Feel free to contact me directly if there's anything going on we shouldn't miss.

We're hoping to make at least a few days of the La Grave summit at the end of Jan. Our flight leaves Geneve on the 25th, so weather permitting we'll swing back down that way before we take off.

Thanks for all the ski area recommendations and hostel recommendations. I've written them all down, now I just hope we can find them when we get there. I've got a bit of a knack for getting lost.

Euro mags, SEE YOU SOON!!!

Liz (& Jamie)

[comish]

I will be in Austria from Dec 22nd - Jan 8th. I konw St. Anton fairly well after a bunch of weeks there and will have a very large mized ability group there from the 1st - 8th so it should be a good time. Let us know if you make it that way at all during your trip. Austrian apres ski needs to be experienced!

Comish/Doug

[snowfire]

We leave tomorrow! I'm so excited. Everything's packed and ready to go. It's snowing in Pittsburgh, I hope there are no delays. On the way here I ended up having to spend the night in Atlanta because of broken plane. I spent 15 hours at the airport, ugh. So, hoping for a clean, no-frills journey tomorrow. We will be arriving in Paris on the morning of the 28th. I'll be keeping in touch with people through PM's or email... one more time, elizabethrs@eml.cc if you want to hoook up for turns or beers.

Of course, all this is now overshadowed by the death of Reggie White. So unfortunate. Hopefully there will be some fresh pow to cheer me up.

Au revoir, everyone! Wish us luck!