Long, Fast, Charger

[El Chupacabra]

Would a swallow-tail really be the best thing for charging in crud? Seems like that's a powder feature, and I think he's got those conditions covered.

Not the best thing, but I don't view it as a drawback.

Just throwing it out there as a cheap, fun, stiffish ski, that works quite well in soft (including crud/chop) snow -- like the day-after-the-big-day stuff.

[shasti]

If all you are looking for is to charge in crud, not to ski tight technical lines or have amazing floatation, then the Goliath or 187 XXL is the way to go. The Katanas and MoShips are derivatives of this, but the 187 XXL or the 190 goliath seem to be the fan favorite of TGR, and me. However, if you want a day-after-pow-day/touring ski, more manoeuvrability and almost as good an ability to charge the shit out of crud, go with EHP. The thing is, the 186 EHP is no noodle, so make sure you are ready to manhandle it a bit if you go with the big one

[volklpowdermaniac]

shasti, your comments have been spot on.

is there a good source for all the effective edge length thats been pooled in one area,


I guess its more of a length thing then a stiff thing, remember I just want to try something relatively more stiff then my current twigs, rather than what I originally thought which was stiffffesst ever,


It is really more about fast charging, then tight technical lines....

but it seems like the 190 katana, might be a blend of a fast charger (Given my weight) and something I might be able to master on a tight line technical line...


as you can see my head is sort of pointing to the 190 katana, maybe because its going off at 325 brand new right now...


i guess its a desire to have something that is a big mountain ski, that will point and go, and feel stable while doing so,

thanks for everything,

i think its between 185 moships, 190 katanas, and 186 ehps.. maybe a 190 ehp?

since the EHPs have been streamlined, it seems like the 190 might give me some extra length....

although i am going to try Daywalker's 192 bros, even if its just to be humbled by a good asskicking, it will certainly give me some perspective.

[pappag]

You should add the 190 Moment Ruby to your list of options. While it's not overpowering stiff, the flex is plenty solid for what you want. 112mm in the waist and handles hardpack and crud very well. Couldn't find a speed limit on them. Not the quickest in trees and tight spots, but great otherwise. 160cm running length with a weight just over 9lbs. About as perfect as a 110mm+ stiffish touring ski that does it all gets.

$449 at Jibij:
http://jibij.com/entry.php?manufacture=64#1493

[Sinfield]

Marshal's advice was good. The skier, not the ski, does the charging, so pick the best ski for skiing. Look at Sage and Treadway - on the Rossinol S7 and Steeze respectively - Point being you dont need a ski that rips any harder than that to charge if you want to...


...I think the EHP, Lhasa Pow, Armada JJ, or Rossi S7 are the skis to be on right now.

While I fucking love the shit out of my S7's, they're not really a charger ski like he says he wants. The biggest size available (for now) are the 188's and they ski insanely short. The rumor is that Sage was on the pro only 195/6's in all his videos this year and those are supposed to be quite a bit stiffer. Alas they are also not available right now.

Again, don't get me wrong, I think the S7's are just about the most perfect skis I've ever been on...just not exactly what he wants. If he wants a pair of skis that feels stiff and charger, but can still change turn shapes, the Lhasas seem to really fit the bill. The flat tail makes the feel a lot more stable at speed imo.

[skifishbum]

Your looking for a touring ski yet weight isn't an issue??

[leroy jenkins]

I think you're asking one ski to do too much. In bounds crud buster = squads/xxls/katanas etc, but most of those would make really shitty touring skis.

I love my 194 squads in bounds, but I can only think of a small handful of times I've gone fast enough out of bounds to want them.

[volklpowdermaniac]

Your looking for a touring ski yet weight isn't an issue??

I'm already on Dukes with Bros and Alpines, so i'm slogging as it is...having been only on that setup, I don't know the pleasure of a lightweight setup...

ignorance is bliss.

My tours thus far have been 1/2 a day to day at the longest. I'll just sack up and deal with the weight....

my inbounds tour ratio is 70 in / 30 tour, and i just love the feel of dukes, even more then some regular alpine binders i've skied, burly solid, connected.


the use of this ski as a good touring ski, will be a secondary benefit.

[pfluffenmeister]

i agree with shasti, the goliath 191 crushes crud and allows one to ski mixed conditions very aggressively (i didn't think that the floatation was too bad, but they are the fattest in my quiver and i suppose surface area doesn't hurt when it comes to flotation).

anyway, the goliath rules!

[squatch]

D(c): that was a great review

Squatch: Love your brutal honesty, but i like to buy shit i don't need

interesting marshal, one of the first people on here i've seen advocating a shorter ski, usually its longer, longer, longer.....


maybe given all that the seemingly softest options of those group would be the ones to go for...185 Motherships and 190 Katanas....which Powtron says ski very similiar.

I'm just saying, I've been in your position. I went from one pair to about five pairs in a couple years; I was hoarding shit I didn't need, and ended up never mounting.

Eventually, you'll come around...we all do. Frankly, your money is better spent on a pow road trip to jackson or a cat trip or something. The fun factor is way higher.

[Fritz]

I think the Lotus 120 might fit the bill. Doesn't necessarily destroy the crud, but they handle it well. They satisfy the rest of your requirements IMO. The 200cm had been my go to ski for resort and short tours and I couldn't be happier. 190cm might be just right if you're a lighter dude.

[marshalolson]

I'm already on Dukes with Bros and Alpines, so i'm slogging as it is...having been only on that setup, I don't know the pleasure of a lightweight setup...

compared to a moship or whatever, the soft bro is super light.

[puhisurfer]

I'm pretty much your height and weight and have been looking for the same ski.

I've been pretty much going back and forth between the Katanas and the LPs, which a lot of folks around here seem to like. But they don't seem to be much on your radar. Curious why.

And I too am tempted by the extra length. Rationally, I know that I should be looking at 183s/186s, but when I'm charging through the crud I just feel this need for the extra length... 196 LPs I guess no way am I big enough for, but 190 Katanas no problem, right?

[flip]

You want to find out if you can handle a stiff charging ski, pick up a pair of head 103s in a 183 for cheap. It's an awesome, damp ski that crushes crud and has no speed limit. For $150-200, it'll tell you a whole lot about whether you would ever want anything like a mothership or 190 EHP. Aside from powder performance (which is fine at speed, especially if you actually know how to weight and unweight a ski), it is the equal to anything you've listed for crud, mank, chunder, avi debris, tracked out mung, hootch, splatch, and floo flau.

[shasti]

VPM: I see your point about being into the Katana as far as the float/carve versatility it possesses, the EHP might be able to do the carve thing ALMOST as well, while doing the float thing better. That being said, I know you will have a blast on the Katanas. I know a lot of peeps who have. Its a fun versatile ski that is powerful but not uncompromising like the XXL can be.

Sinfeild : I bet your are spot on about the S7 and Lhasa. I already own the skis he is thinking about so maybe i projected my desire to ski a short playful powski like the S7 onto him. I bet the bigger one would rule, but how big/old are you ? I wonder if the S7 would be too small/noodley for me.

In conclusion, you, like the rest of us, are analyzing this pretty thoroughly. You are probably best off either going with the best deal you can find now, or just waiting longer as you probably will only get a few days or so on the setup this season anyways and the deals will only get better over the summer. Plus who knows, they might come out with something even cooler next season. Its happened before.......

[jpow]

I think my Kuro's destroy crud, can move quick, are stable, and stomp. You might have different one's than me though.
Think about the Scott Stunt it's a really rad ski. They do all of that too and are just more chargey, pretty frickin nimble too. Super fun ski!

[volklpowdermaniac]

I think my Kuro's destroy crud, can move quick, are stable, and stomp. You might have different one's than me though.
Think about the Scott Stunt it's a really rad ski. They do all of that too and are just more chargey, pretty frickin nimble too. Super fun ski!

Kuro= amazing stomp, amazing deep pow.

DEFINITE SPEED LIMIT IMO!

Open it up over some crud or avy debris, and woah things get interesting.


I hear ya shasti...much obliged, it truly will come down to watching the deals. I don't think I can afford a new ski....ugh, especially not if I'm planning this six month hiatus to Japan and Alps.....

[volklpowdermaniac]

Well, i'll have four weeks to think about this.

Cast goes on tommorow for a broken fibula, i don't bear much weight on it, so i was able to get around for three weeks, but constant pain drove me to doctor.

Anyway, anyone think selling the bridges to pay for the katanas is a worthwhile idea to save some coin. Or is there always a place for a skinny shorter ski (early season, bumps, rocks), i might try and pick up an old karma down the line....

anyway.

[Fritz]

You want to find out if you can handle a stiff charging ski, pick up a pair of head 103s in a 183 for cheap. It's an awesome, damp ski that crushes crud and has no speed limit. For $150-200, it'll tell you a whole lot about whether you would ever want anything like a mothership or 190 EHP. Aside from powder performance (which is fine at speed, especially if you actually know how to weight and unweight a ski), it is the equal to anything you've listed for crud, mank, chunder, avi debris, tracked out mung, hootch, splatch, and floo flau.

heh. good point. I have a pair of these in a 183 and I find the 200cm lotus to be even more versatile and forgiving. go figure. very heavy, damp, and stable the 103s are. broke my tib/fib on these skis last year BTW.

[Skis]

I'll vote for Katanas. Even wrote a review, http://tetongravity.com/forums/showthread.php?t=146954. The 183s have a speed limit, but I bet 190s retain much of the maneuverability you get from having no camber while really charging.

[nick > jesus]

tag:

vpm=newgosey

[tone capone]

you most certainly "could" ski most of those skis, as in skid them around and think you are ripping, but if you want to ACTUALLY kill it, check that ego a couple clicks and get something that is appropriate. super long and super stiff really are very specific and frankly are not that sweet in most situations.

These are valuable words. Ignore them at your peril...

[volklpowdermaniac]

These are valuable words. Ignore them at your peril...

I have checked the ego down, I'm now just looking for something stiff(ER) than what I have, I want to get the feel of a stiff (er) ski, before jumping to the stiffest.., and the width to fill the gap in the quiver.




plus all this katana quality issue has me squirming.

I'm trying to sell the bridges and some other stuff, then just watch the GS and see what pops up.

But this whole thing is moot now, broken leg=time to contemplate.

all you people who love me must be psyched: vpm misery rules!