Binding suggestion for Atomic R:ex

**welbojo** · 06-28-2004, 08:12 PM

Any binding recommendations for the Atomic R:ex? I'm 165lbs and the ski lenth is 177cm.

I been looking at the Marker Piston control 1400 (I can also get a great deal on a pair of these), but read about some prerelease issues in other posts. I really am looking for a light set-up, but just don't want to go freerides (no toe release) for my everyday resort ski. I'm also concerned about the lifter in Markers. I already have a hard snow/race ski, so mainly looking to optimize off trail & powder performance.
thanks

**DJSapp** · 06-28-2004, 08:50 PM

Markers make great paperweights and doorstops. That's about it.

Get some Look P14's or whatever the Rossi equivalent is. Best binders on the market.

**CantDog** · 06-28-2004, 09:20 PM

I have friends who swear by the 1400, and havent had the release problem of the folks here. I'd say go looks as well. And I think the freerides do have a toe release.

**basom** · 06-28-2004, 09:49 PM

i dont know if i should believe the billygoat or the pooch? tough call. id like amanatee's opinion to tip it one way or the other, or maybe a garden gnome.

**Steven S. Dallas** · 06-28-2004, 09:55 PM

Take it from a rocking egg- Marker bindings suck.

**BakerBoy** · 06-28-2004, 10:09 PM

The 1400's are much better than the older Markers. Shouldn't have too many problems. Then again, its just a knee, right? Freerides do have a toe release, but they really aren't all that durable for everyday use. If you want to optimize your off-trail and powder performance, well, sell those R.ex's for something wider.

**Steven S. Dallas** · 06-28-2004, 10:18 PM

The rocking egg knows all.

**Odin** · 06-28-2004, 10:20 PM

stalking apk

**Spats** · 06-29-2004, 12:54 AM

Look/Rossi turntable will always be my choice. Not as light as Salomons, but much lighter than Atomics and comparable to Markers. If you run a low DIN (<8) the DIN 10 versions are a lot cheaper.

**skea 457** · 06-29-2004, 04:06 AM

Look / Rossi all the way. If weight is an issue get the Titanium version. The steel arms are replaced with a titanium alloy version which is about 100 grams lighter each. They go up to the DIN 12 version.

**Shredhead** · 06-29-2004, 08:37 AM

I have the 177 Rex with Freerides for my AT setup and it works pretty good for that. But if I was going for the optimum off piste/powder I would also get a fatter/longer ski. Especially if I lived in the PNW.

**welbojo** · 06-29-2004, 09:18 AM

Originally posted by DJSapp
Markers make great paperweights and doorstops. That's about it.

Get some Look P14's or whatever the Rossi equivalent is. Best binders on the market.

I keep hearing these bad comments about markers, but no facts to support. Specifically, what problems are people having with recent year markers?

Also, the Look P14 seem to be pretty popular, but they do not have an integrated toe/heel platform. Any thoughts on wether this matters? Also, I have a pair of explosivs for big powder days. I mentioned that I wanted to maximize off trail performance w/ the Rexs because who needs help skiing groomers???
Thanks for everyone's input

**Woodsy** · 06-29-2004, 09:44 AM

for a crud buster do everything ski this is the one, you have the explosivs for the fresh this is the midfat for all in between.

I would put a pair of the Soloman 912 tis on em, that with the rEX would be a very light set up for "heavy metal"

I have those binders on my Stokli SS & weight 225. I have had no probs @ all with em

**DJSapp** · 06-29-2004, 11:28 AM

Originally posted by welbojo
I keep hearing these bad comments about markers, but no facts to support. Specifically, what problems are people having with recent year markers?

I have a set of Marker M9.1's on my G41's. Fact: They are pieces of shit. Support: I have ridden them and prereleased too many times to count. M9.2's are the same binder. Marker has problems with their toe pieces.

**basom** · 06-29-2004, 12:07 PM

Originally posted by Woodsy
for a crud buster do everything ski this is the one, you have the explosivs for the fresh this is the midfat for all in between.

I would put a pair of the Soloman 912 tis on em, that with the rEX would be a very light set up for "heavy metal"

I have those binders on my Stokli SS & weight 225. I have had no probs @ all with em

i have 912's on my 191 rex's aqnd i weigh 190. also no realese issue. and you can get those dirt ass cheep now.
my 912's did loose the white spheric units under the ball of one foot. kinda sketches me out.

why do you care if your toe and heel are intergrated? i pulled the axe plate off mine. i grew up skiing ice though, and have no trouble getting over my tips. you could add a look or rossi race plate to their p14 / rossi 140's if you need more lift.

i dont know. listen to the egg. its hard not to due to the hypnosis and all.

**Mechmaster** · 06-29-2004, 01:40 PM

The issues most people have with Markers relates back to the retension versus release arguement. Markers are generally biased towards release (especially rearward in the toe, when the mechanism allows backward release at levels of force mush less than lateral release) instead of retension. What this means is that in difficult/varied terrain or a loss on control, the boot will tend to release rather than absord the impact load. Team Marker bindings have a steel bar which locks the rearward release function out.

Conversely, Look/Rossi bindings favor lateral elasticity; in fact, they can be twisted the furthest off-center of any binding and still return to center without releasing. Consequently, many skiers feel comfortable running a lower DIN setting.

I personally run Salomon and Look bindings; My personal preference leans towards the Salomon S916 which has served me well for many years and has bomber reliability.

**Tyrone Shoelaces** · 06-29-2004, 02:10 PM

whoa....a Mechmaster sighting!

Quality tech discussion in TechTalk has just gone up a notch

**Arty50** · 06-29-2004, 02:44 PM

Originally posted by Mechmaster
I personally run Salomon and Look bindings; My personal preference leans towards the Salomon S916 which has served me well for many years and has bomber reliability.

Mechmaster covered it perfectly, as always (good to have you here, sir). I really don't need to say anything more, except that I share his binding preferences. My Rossi 140s (same as Look P14s) have been wonderful. I didn't think I could buy a better binder until I bought some 916s. I run both sets at the same DIN and prefer the 916s by a touch. But S916s are really hard to find, generally very pricey, and overkill for lighter folk. Looks/Rossis will serve you perfectly.

**Mechmaster** · 06-29-2004, 03:09 PM

Thanks for the kind words.

Three things to keep in mind when selecting bindings. First, some bindings are easier than others to get back into in deep snow. For example, the Salomon Spheric toe is more tolerant to snow and general crap being caked on your boot sole than the Look/Rossi. Second, toe adjustments are manual on the Salomon versus automatic on the Rossi. This implies that as your boot sole wears or you change to a different boot, toe width and height adjustments must be made to the Salomon toe. Improper setup on the Salomon system can lead to a stripped toe cup screw and play in the binding. Conversely, some may aregue that this adjustability leads to a more-precise boot-binding connection. Third, the Rossi and Look turntable heels will have interference with Trekkers in the bottom (flat) position.

**glademaster** · 06-29-2004, 08:43 PM

Now I've never used a green spring(high-DIN) Salomon binder, since I only weigh 135, but I do have quite a bit of experience of both the solly S912 and the Look Pivot 14. I have the S912's on my PR's, and I have them adjusted and calibrated at a shop maybe twice a season, yet I run the Din aroun 9.5 or 10 to not pre-release. I have the Looks on my race boards (dynastar omeglass 63) and my Spatulas. I run those at 6.5 or 7 and have yet to have them release except when totally needed to, i.e. snagging a ski tip on a gate at 35 miles an hour.

I run them with the 10mm lifter plate on my race boards, which makes them super tippy and quick and without even the smallest plate on my Spatulas, the total heigh from ski base to boot sole is less than 25mm's. You can also get 4mm and 6mm lifters for the looks. IMHO, I would get the looks, I plan on putting them on a pair of R:Ex's that i'll be buying and using the 4mm lifter, just a little. Think about how turny you want them to be and go from there. Good luck.

-Ben

**skea 457** · 06-29-2004, 11:05 PM

Originally posted by welbojo
Also, the Look P14 seem to be pretty popular, but they do not have an integrated toe/heel platform. Any thoughts on wether this matters? Also, I have a pair of explosivs for big powder days. I mentioned that I wanted to maximize off trail performance w/ the Rexs because who needs help skiing groomers???
Thanks for everyone's input

The integrated stuff provides more lift and provides a bit of dampening on groomers but it is a liability off piste. If you are after a soft snow ski, mount the skis with as little lift as possible.

I just got the Legend 8000 with 6mm of lift which seems a good compormise for a ski which will spend about 1/3 of its time on hard snow and groomers.

**brig** · 07-01-2004, 11:17 AM

I personally still like a spacer even in pow, but the connected toe-heel setups I've ridden so far do very little to benefit even on the groomed. I don't think I'll ever spend $300 on bindings anymore just for something like that, to put it one way.

I think that sort of functionality is kind of like the guy who has to have every last golf gizmo, thinking that spending money on the latest toys will make him better, but he doesn't really work hard on his skills.

**Arty50** · 07-02-2004, 01:36 AM

Originally posted by skea 457
The integrated stuff provides more lift and provides a bit of dampening on groomers but it is a liability off piste. If you are after a soft snow ski, mount the skis with as little lift as possible.

Just a note. The Look Maxplate/Rossi T-Plate is not an "integrated" lifter. Most of the integrated systems (Railflex, Motion, Pilot, all Atomics) attempt to allow the binding to float while the ski flexes. In the case of Atomic, the toe is connected to the ski and the heel floats. In the Motion system the center of the binding connects to the ski while the toe and heel float on rails. The T-Plate/Maxplate don't do that. The toe and heel are both still screwed into the ski individually. The link in the middle is merely cosmetic.

Frankly, I think all the floaters are a bunch of hooey. I've heard several people complain about slop in the Motion system. I can't comment on the pilots. And Atomic bindings suck (except the 1018s). I prereleased like a mofo when I rode on some Sugar Daddies with 412s cranked way up.

**seldon** · 07-04-2004, 11:11 PM

Sorry to call you on it Arty, but I watched the guy drill my P14 maxplates (I got a pair of '04s uber-cheap brand new - $130 online) and the screws are closer together than the standard P14s. It just reduces the length of the flat spot and doesn't attempt to eliminate it altogether.

That, or I'm just full of shit.

On a binding note, I had a pair of Markers that I got on a pair of XXs I bought off of a demo shop way back "in the day". I honestly couldn't stay in the pieces of shit. They would release constantly, on groomers, in bumps, whenever they needed to hold - bam, I was out.

Mechmaster <---- SERIOUSLY knows his shit.

**Arty50** · 07-05-2004, 12:51 PM

Originally posted by seldon
Sorry to call you on it Arty, but I watched the guy drill my P14 maxplates (I got a pair of '04s uber-cheap brand new - $130 online) and the screws are closer together than the standard P14s. It just reduces the length of the flat spot and doesn't attempt to eliminate it altogether.

That, or I'm just full of shit.

I think you're full of shit.

I don't see why the location of the screws in the ski should be different for any of the lifters Look/Rossi use.

Whether you're mounting them relatively flat (Rossi Scratch), up a little (Rossi Power), or high (Rossi T-Plate), the screw location should be exactly the same. All of the plates/lifters/shims used in those bindings merely have holes for the screws to pass through. The shims/lifters/plates are not mounted to the ski separate from the bindings. This way, if you're not happy with the lift you've chosen, you merely need to find different plates and the corresponding shorter/longer screws. If any tech told you otherwise, [Fletch]I think they need a refresher course[/Fletch].

Now if the bindings have changed for 04/05, then throw out everything I said. But I haven't seen a single shop that carries them yet. Otherwise, Looks and Rossis have been this way for a few years.