Obama...Kennedy...MLK Jr.

**schindlerpiste** · 02-20-2008, 03:03 PM

The more I listen to Obama, the more I liken him to RFK and MLK Jr. Clearly, there has been no recent presidentail candidate (other than maybe Reagan) who matches Obama in public speaking and eloquence. Clearly, when he speaks, we are reminded of Reverend King. Obama is passionate, profound and eloquent. Apparently, both Clinton and McCain are attempting to attack this skill as being sum over substance.
While Obama lacks governmental experience, his passion, commitment and dedication to "change" are winning over the public. Although RFK was AG from '61-64, he was only a one term Senator ('65-68) before taking on the nation by storm with his ideas of civil rights, racial equality and the anti-aparteid movement. Furthermore, RFK did not support any commitment to ground troops in SE Asia.

All I'm saying is that there is a strong juxtiposition between Obama, RFK and MLK Jr. All three are/were very important, and seem(ed) bigger than life. I have an uneasy feeling...It's a bit scary.

**rideit** · 02-20-2008, 03:05 PM

Wow, awesome spooky conspiracy theory to ponder.

Interesting.

**RootSkier** · 02-20-2008, 03:06 PM

so schindler, are you considering voting for him?

**schindlerpiste** · 02-20-2008, 03:08 PM

I love listening to him. He is captivating...if not a bit too dramatic. He may be the right man at the right time. I just like a little more experience, and a little less governing.

**Rontele** · 02-20-2008, 03:12 PM

Bill Clinton was and continues to be a fabulous public speaker. That being said, Obama does have a certain penache for the stage. When I listen to him, I actually believe there is hope for this country.

The problem is that I worry its just smoke and mirrors and he doesn't have the experience to back it up.

**RootSkier** · 02-20-2008, 03:20 PM

The whole experience meme is interesting, but what reassures me is Obama's unbelievable organization in the primaries. He is putting unbelievable numbers of boots on the ground and producing shocking results. Inspiring people is a big part of the president's job, I think.

To me, he has proved that he can surround himself with high quality people and is not afraid to listen to opposing viewpoints...something that your friend who was his student probably noticed, right rontele?

Hillary might have more experience, McCain too, obviously, but they both strike me as incredibly stubborn and hardheaded, which seems to be a terrible quality in a president.

I have faith that Obama will surround himself with incredibly smart people and have the good sense and judgement to listen to them on important issues. The fact that he actually knows the Constitution certainly doesn't hurt my opinion of him, either.

**Adolf Allerbush** · 02-20-2008, 03:25 PM

Obama is a great speaker but maybe we're coming from such a low level of communication abilities in the GWB era that anything sounds great? It's embarrassing as an US citizen to listen to GWB speak publically about anything.

Also McCain is a terrible public speaker...He's so boring to listen to. He's not compelling at all. I'm not sure if it's his pussified voice or the extraordinarily slow monotone delivery of his words. Plus he's just spewing the same shit we've heard for the last 8 years.

Hillary's voice is just painful to listen to.

**PNWbrit** · 02-20-2008, 03:34 PM

Originally Posted by Adolf Allerbush

It's embarrassing as an US citizen to listen to GWB speak publically about anything.

Sorry couldn't resist.

**Adolf Allerbush** · 02-20-2008, 03:43 PM

Originally Posted by PNWbrit

Sorry couldn't resist.

Shit!!!! See but I'm not president nor would I ever run for it.

AlpineJunkie · 02-20-2008, 03:45 PM

He's going to have to do more then speak good though. You can't survive 12 months off of speaking alone. I think in a couple months his speaking is going to start wearing off on people and will have to start running off of other stuff as well. At the same time the attacks from the other side will start coming hard and strong. Once he starts responding to them, and especially if he starts fighting back as well, he is going to look like any other politician by Nov. I think a lot on the Dem side are naive as to how hard it will be for Obama. He will have a very tough battle against McCain. Especially considering that Obama didn't really ever do anything with his elected offices and actually even ducked from some of his responsibilities.

**RootSkier** · 02-20-2008, 03:49 PM

You are 16 aren't you?

AlpineJunkie · 02-20-2008, 03:50 PM

Who? Me?

**MassLiberal** · 02-20-2008, 03:55 PM

Originally Posted by schindlerpiste

The more I listen to Obama, the more I liken him to RFK and MLK Jr. Clearly, there has been no recent presidentail candidate (other than maybe Reagan) who matches Obama in public speaking and eloquence. Clearly, when he speaks, we are reminded of Reverend King. Obama is passionate, profound and eloquent. Apparently, both Clinton and McCain are attempting to attack this skill as being sum over substance.
While Obama lacks governmental experience, his passion, commitment and dedication to "change" are winning over the public. Although RFK was AG from '61-64, he was only a one term Senator ('65-68) before taking on the nation by storm with his ideas of civil rights, racial equality and the anti-aparteid movement. Furthermore, RFK did not support any commitment to ground troops in SE Asia.

All I'm saying is that there is a strong juxtiposition between Obama, RFK and MLK Jr. All three are/were very important, and seem(ed) bigger than life. I have an uneasy feeling...It's a bit scary.

The difference is that people rallied around Kennedy and MLK due to what their goals were for the country. They had stated policy goals (civil rights etc) that inspired the country, not speeches. Ask any Obama supporter what he stands for, and you'll never get a straight answer.

**RootSkier** · 02-20-2008, 03:58 PM

I see you are still working for Hillary.

Are you going to go down with the ship?

spook · 02-20-2008, 03:58 PM

obama is nothing close to mlk and only in our braindead, superficial culture could such a comparison be made in anything but jest.

anyone who inspires the self-absorbed, enthusiastic beneficiaries of ruthless predation should be feared, not embraced. you can be sure that whoever wins will be exactly who the powers behind our glorious empire conclude will not upset the status quo. which means any of the remaining candidates.

“In many countries, we have chained the savage and starved him to death. In more than one country, we have hunted the savage and his little children and their mother with dogs and guns, through woods and swamps for an afternoon’s sport. In many countries we have taken the savage’s land from him and made him our slave and lashed him every day and broken his pride and made death his only friend and worked him till he’d drop in his tracks. There are many humorous things in the world, among them is the white man’s notion that he is less savage than the other savages.”

-Mark Twain, 1895

“But it was impossible to save the Great Republic. She was rotten to the heart. Lust of conquest had long ago done its work; trampling upon the helpless abroad had taught her, by a natural process, to endure with apathy the like at home; multitudes who had applauded the crushing of other people’s liberties, lived to suffer for their mistake in their own persons. The government was irrevocably in the hands of the prodigiously rich and their hangers-on; the suffrage was become a mere machine, which they used as they chose. There was no principle but commercialism, no patriotism but of the pocket.”
— Mark Twain

AlpineJunkie · 02-20-2008, 04:01 PM

Who's Mark Twain????

**rideit** · 02-20-2008, 04:04 PM

He invented the dust ruffle, duh.

**Adolf Allerbush** · 02-20-2008, 04:08 PM

Originally Posted by AlpineJunkie

Who's Mark Twain????

Yeah, I didn't think he was 16...way younger me thinks. Maybe 12? Just got a laptop from the parents and discovered this place.

**RootSkier** · 02-20-2008, 04:12 PM

Yeah, I'm changing my bet to 14.

AlpineJunkie · 02-20-2008, 04:16 PM

Originally Posted by Adolf Allerbush

Yeah, I didn't think he was 16...way younger me thinks. Maybe 12? Just got a laptop from the parents and discovered this place.

Haha. This is coming from two guys who thinks that Obama is going to have a landslide despite half the country being solidly red and the last two election cycles has seen the most conservative president we've ever had get elected twice both times despite having a terrible record both times. I mean you take the most conservative president ever with a really fucked up war, a really fucked up economy, the most spending anyone has ever seen, and HE still wins yet you think just 4 years later the same people who voted him in is going to vote the most liberal candidate since McGovern into office by a LANDSLIDE (while facing a solid moderate btw)??? Dude you guys are the naive kids here not me.

**rideit** · 02-20-2008, 04:18 PM

UH, AJ, you ARE aware of GB's popularity now as opposed to four years ago?

**summit** · 02-20-2008, 04:20 PM

AJ does make a point

Originally Posted by Adolf Allerbush

we're coming from such a low level of communication abilities in the GWB era that anything sounds great? It's embarrassing as an US citizen to listen to GWB speak publically about anything.

yep

W is such a terrible speaker that he couldn't sell air conditioning to a Texan without using the "or 9-11 will happen again" line.

**mr_gyptian** · 02-20-2008, 04:22 PM

Originally Posted by spook

obama is nothing close to mlk and only in our braindead, superficial culture could such a comparison be made in anything but jest.

anyone who inspires the self-absorbed, enthusiastic beneficiaries of ruthless predation should be feared, not embraced. you can be sure that whoever wins will be exactly who the powers behind our glorious empire conclude will not upset the status quo. which means any of the remaining candidates.

“In many countries, we have chained the savage and starved him to death. In more than one country, we have hunted the savage and his little children and their mother with dogs and guns, through woods and swamps for an afternoon’s sport. In many countries we have taken the savage’s land from him and made him our slave and lashed him every day and broken his pride and made death his only friend and worked him till he’d drop in his tracks. There are many humorous things in the world, among them is the white man’s notion that he is less savage than the other savages.”

-Mark Twain, 1895

“But it was impossible to save the Great Republic. She was rotten to the heart. Lust of conquest had long ago done its work; trampling upon the helpless abroad had taught her, by a natural process, to endure with apathy the like at home; multitudes who had applauded the crushing of other people’s liberties, lived to suffer for their mistake in their own persons. The government was irrevocably in the hands of the prodigiously rich and their hangers-on; the suffrage was become a mere machine, which they used as they chose. There was no principle but commercialism, no patriotism but of the pocket.”
— Mark Twain

I think I just agreed with spook.

holy shit.

schindler, RFK was a weasel on a level that only his father could be proud of. I have no idea how the stink of being a McCarthy henchman never stuck to him. I have no idea how the mob's involvement in his brother's election and then RFK's subsequent prosecution of the mob was never called into question. How the hell he could have been such a divisive person and then all the panty dropper's believe his can't we all just be friends bullshit.

When did being a good public speaker all of the sudden become our litmus test for a president?

**MassLiberal** · 02-20-2008, 04:22 PM

Originally Posted by rideit

UH, AJ, you ARE aware of GB's popularity now as opposed to four years ago?

19% According ARG.

The arrogance of Obama supporters is what turned me off of accepting his campaign's job offer.

That and the fact that he hired Jim Cooper, a staunch health insurance company lobbyist, as his Health Care Policy guy.

**Cliff Huckable** · 02-20-2008, 04:24 PM

Originally Posted by spook

“In many countries, we have chained the savage and starved him to death. In more than one country, we have hunted the savage and his little children and their mother with dogs and guns, through woods and swamps for an afternoon’s sport. In many countries we have taken the savage’s land from him and made him our slave and lashed him every day and broken his pride and made death his only friend and worked him till he’d drop in his tracks. There are many humorous things in the world, among them is the white man’s notion that he is less savage than the other savages.”

-Mark Twain, 1895

“But it was impossible to save the Great Republic. She was rotten to the heart. Lust of conquest had long ago done its work; trampling upon the helpless abroad had taught her, by a natural process, to endure with apathy the like at home; multitudes who had applauded the crushing of other people’s liberties, lived to suffer for their mistake in their own persons. The government was irrevocably in the hands of the prodigiously rich and their hangers-on; the suffrage was become a mere machine, which they used as they chose. There was no principle but commercialism, no patriotism but of the pocket.”
— Mark Twain

That commie would get hammered here for his anti-Americanism.