enduro closeouts

[Mike Adamson]

I hear you knocking, but those are smooth moto style trails, I've seen dudes on hard tails rocking those. Head knocking Goats Gully style, rooty-rocky, steep the Enduro just doesn't cut it based on my experience and riding style. My Nomad will survive, and I've taken it down every line at Whistler several times. Would I bring my Enduro? Nope, not even close.

The geometry of the SL feels too X-country for my tastes, but don't get me wrong. It is a great bike, when I am riding X-Country. Just not for some trails or rides. I'll take the pepsi challenge on my Nomad anyday

You know that if you ask ten people about bikes, you'll get ten different opinions, so mine is just that. Another point of view.

You're right about parting the bike out though, it can be done, but it seems kind of backwards to me just to get that frame. I'd rather have an SX-Trail. Is there a coil that fits the SL yet?

Anyway, Each his own. NICE-NICE trails you've got there.

[davep]

He's got you there woo, it's a good thing there aren't any rocks in North Lake or else you'd have broken your pretty little SL by now. And with a 67* head angle, well that thing's practically a road bike!

Is there a coil that fits the SL yet?

Yes they're made by a company called Fox, perhaps you've heard of them?

[Dickeymotto]

I hear you knocking, but those are smooth moto style trails, I've seen dudes on hard tails rocking those. Head knocking Goats Gully style, rooty-rocky, steep the Enduro just doesn't cut it based on my experience and riding style.

Does Porcupine Rim qualify as rocky? My 2004 Enduro Expert (when it was stock none the less) eats the gnarliest sections of that trail for breakfast. I don't mean slowly finding my way down a line, I mean going full throttle, finding a the biggest rock I can at the top of a line, boosting off of it and holding on for dear life as the 5 (not 6) inches of suspension take care of me. 10+ foot drops to flat at speed into a rocky line, no prob. Take that bike, add an inch of travel, improve the pivot placement, drop a few pounds and you get an Enduro SL. It can handle rocks. Oh and it has tire clearance too

Air or coil? Just curious, I'm thinking of swapping the dhx air to coil on my 05 enduro.

Probably coil up front and air in the back. Is your shock aftermarket? The '05 Enduro came stock with a 5th Element.

On a side note, how are things over in Kabul?

[gunniride]

Might want to reassess the 'operator' part of that equation.......


http://kidwoo.com/images/boots/endurolittleleague.wmv


There's nothing 'non-modular' about an enduro. I didn't like the afr shock and promptly put a stock, standard bought from fox RP23. The headtube is 1 1/8 just like a few other bikes out there on the fringe.

I ride hard on it too.

that's my friend john in the vid

He rides his harder than I ride mine. There's nothing from intense or santa cruz that holds a candle to this bike. I tried. And then sold my 6.6 to buy this one

Someday, I hope to ride/build trails like that around Crested Butte. God that looks fun.

[kidwoo]

I hear you knocking, but those are smooth moto style trails, I've seen dudes on hard tails rocking those.

No you haven't That's far from some boneyard trail.

It's the rider that's smooth, not the trail. I'd pay $200 to anyone who can make it down that trail on a hard tail. And that includes our favorite pros. You can't see all the loose rocks he's riding through. The jumps are smooth, the trail between them is anything but.

Head knocking Goats Gully style, rooty-rocky, steep the Enduro just doesn't cut it based on my experience and riding style. My Nomad will survive, and I've taken it down every line at Whistler several times. Would I bring my Enduro? Nope, not even close.

I think your experience and riding style suffers from riding that AFR shock. It doesn't move, so it keeps the bike steep and never lets it sink into its travel. It ruins that bike in my opinion.

There's nothing XC about a bike that's got a 66-68 degree headangle and a sub 14" bottom bracket. Setup right, there's very little that bike can't ride over comfortably.

You know that if you ask ten people about bikes, you'll get ten different opinions, so mine is just that. Another point of view.

True. But you claimed there was something inferior about the new SLs so I had to give you the correct one



dickeymotto: please stop doing 10 ft drops to flat

[pechelman]

dickeymotto: please stop doing 10 ft drops to flat

seriously
who even does that anymore?

20 is the new 10

[Dickeymotto]

dickeymotto: please stop doing 10 ft drops to flat

Good idea, my seals don't like it

[flowtron]

dickeymotto: please stop doing 10 ft drops to flat

Yes pleeze.
I thought I was on PinkBike for a second.

[Mike Adamson]

He's got you there woo, it's a good thing there aren't any rocks in North Lake or else you'd have broken your pretty little SL by now. And with a 67* head angle, well that thing's practically a road bike!



Yes they're made by a company called Fox, perhaps you've heard of them?

Yeah, I've heard of them. I spend most of my time glued behind a Colt and a Glock. Perhaps you've heard of them?

Woo, sounds like you are a believer. No ones taking anything away from your trails, and yeah I know how digital video never translates well, so I'll take your word on that one. Not taking a thing away from your friends riding, or Specialized. Fact is Santa Cruz is a better bike, and I don't love the SL.

[Dickeymotto]

Yeah, I've heard of them. I spend most of my time glued behind a Colt and a Glock. Perhaps you've heard of them?

Woo, sounds like you are a believer. No ones taking anything away from your trails, your friends riding, or Specialized. Fact is Santa Cruz is a better bike.

Santa Cruz has so much confidence in their bikes that they have a two year warranty!

[Mike Adamson]

The VPP isn't the Hoerst link that's for sure. Specialized has a fantastic warranty and customer service department. I rode Specialized bikes almost exclusively since around 1992, and since 2004 I've owned 3 Enduros, a Demo 9, and I currently own an SL, so it's not like I'm just blowing smoke out of my ass. I switched over to a Nomad 2 years ago, and at first I hated the bike, but after giving it a chance I preferred it. I bought the Enduro as a second bike, and because I wanted to check it out. If it was the only bike I had I'm sure I would love it too, but I would still take my older Enduro Pro over it anyday.

I've cracked chainstays on the Enduro's, and my main issue with the Nomad is the dropouts, but they replace a lot easier than chainstays that's for sure.

[kidwoo]

Fact is Santa Cruz is a better bike if high bottom brackets, overly long chainstays and a falling suspension rate that blows through its travel every time you try to pump something and accelerate, in between pivot bearing replacements of course.

fixed that for ya



I owned an intense 6.6 and an uzzi vpx and rode the santa cruz counterparts (nomad and vpfree) before buying those. I can't stand the chainstay and bottom bracket measurements on those santa cruz bikes. The intense versions have the same high BB issue (can't believe the published numbers) but the chainstays on the nomad were rediculous. They're longer than my dh bike. I like pumping corners. The nomads I've ridden (two) just feel like dead turds. If you have any interest, I'd give the SL some leeway. I'm not kidding.....that AFR shock kills that bike. It's pretty much the worst shock you could ever put on a 6" travel bike. Thow an RP3 or RP23 on your bike. It will change your opinion of it.





please don't shoot me

[Mike Adamson]

Hahaha. Good one! I've maintenanced the VPP and haven't had a problem with it, the long chainstays are what I initially disliked about the Nomad, because I was used to stuffing my the back end of the Enduro bikes into tight spots, and then dragging them through the turn. Also being able to control drift was easier. I can't really say why I like the Nomad better at this time, but it just holds up well. I run a DHX 5.0 coil, and a Talas, so maybe they're taking up some of the slack. It also takes to the air well, and has a good center of balance for me.

Yeah I really have felt like I've been getting tossed around in the cockpit on my SL. I'll have to hit the Fox website and see what they offer up that fits that stroke size.

Are you running the stock fork right now?

[kidwoo]

Hahaha. Good one!

Yeah I really have felt like I've been getting tossed around in the cockpit on my SL. I'll have to hit the Fox website and see what they offer up that fits that stroke size.

Are you running the stock fork right now?

Yeah man.......that's completely characteristic of that crappy rear shock. I rode my buddy's last spring (guy in the vid) before buying one, and I got it for the geometry. His was new at the time and my biggest complaint to him was that it felt like both shocks just needed to be broken in. Little did I know, that's just how they felt.

My fork broke in after a while and feels much better than when new. I thought it was a little spiky out of the box. There's also something you can do to get it more plush. On the right leg, there's a cap that looks like it's a damper rod nut. It is, but it's also a cap for the spike valve pressure. Stock is something like 60-70 psi. I dropped mine to about 40 and it rides a lot smoother. I dig the fork. It's about the best stiffness to wieght setup I've ridden. Since you already plopped down the cash for one of these bikes, I'd say it's worth fiddling with.

For what it's worth, I switched bikes with my buddy a few days ago. He's ridden his AFR rear shock enough, that it actually feels much more like my RP3 now. Personally, I don't have the patience to ride it that long when there's an easy alternative to a better ride.

I'm not sure if you've ever ridden around tahoe but it's still generally one of the roughest areas I've ever ridden. No precip and lots of granite makes for some dusty, rocky terrain. I don't have time to tolerate bikes that don't react to that terrain well If you're willing to mess with your setup a bit, the SL has the geometry to be a very stable descender in the roughest of trails.

EDIT: sounds like your nomad is built up in a way that doesn't offer a fair comparison to a stock SL. With the same suspension on your SL, I think you'd be surprised.

Shock length is 7.875 x 2.25 btw. That's a standard size.

[Mike Adamson]

That's good stuff. I'm not a Spesh hater by any means, as evidenced by my yearly rotation of bikes, many of which are Specialized.

I was only able to give it 4 rides before I redeployed and I did fiddle with the suspension quite a bit, but that's a good tip on the fork. I ran mine according to the suspension set up video, and I managed to bottom that on a small eight footer.

I've done a lot of climbing around Tahoe, and skiing, and partying for that matter, but no biking whatsoever. I'm looking to remedy that this season. I've been looking at some departments in NorCal that would put me in that area. Downieville looks like a lot of non-stop fun.

[pechelman]

hmm

i wonder if you called up Push and asked them to cycle the shit out of your AFR fork on one of their dynos to break it in if that would help.
wonder what theyd charge for that

damn I miss not having access to that equipment.

[Dickeymotto]

Do you know anyone who put a 36 TALAS or Lyrik on an SL? Just wondering if the extra 10 mm of travel fucks with the geometry. Also, how do the seals hold up on the e150? I love the way that fork feels as far as plushness, but I don't really dig the dual crown.

EDIT: The e150 question is for the 2008 models, not the shitty replace your cartridge two weeks after you buy it 07's.

[kidwoo]

Do you know anyone who put a 36 TALAS or Lyrik on an SL? Just wondering if the extra 10 mm of travel fucks with the geometry. Also, how do the seals hold up on the e150? I love the way that fork feels as far as plushness, but I don't really dig the dual crown.

A buddy of mine has a lyrik on his. Considering the 'range' of axle to crown settings with the stock fork, I doubt the lyrik exceeds anything that the stock setup offers.

He's all whiny about specialized made suspension pieces and has never even ridden the stock fork though.

What's your issue with the DC? Some of the tightest roughest trails out there are ridden on dh bikes with DC forks. If you need to turn your bars a full 90 degrees, you aren't riding fast enough

That stock fork is stiff as hell.

[davep]

Probably coil up front and air in the back. Is your shock aftermarket? The '05 Enduro came stock with a 5th Element.

Long story, but I got a free upgrade to the dhx. I filled the outer air sleeve with plastic to reduce the air volume, so it doesn't bottom as easily/often as it used to. But I'm still curious to try some other options.

[kidwoo]

I filled the outer air sleeve with plastic to reduce the air volume, .

Um


What?


details please

[Mike Adamson]

What's your issue with the DC? Some of the tightest roughest trails out there are ridden on dh bikes with DC forks. If you need to turn your bars a full 90 degrees, you aren't riding fast enough

I think I'd be more worried about a hard crash denting the soft metal on the stanchions, than needing to demonstrate my X-ups. Seems like I read about that in a thread somewhere.

[davep]

Um


What?


details please

I put a couple of ptex patches in the outer sleeve:
http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?t=257438

DCG put 1 sheet of ptex in the outer sleeve - I tried that first, it helped some but it was still a bit bottomy. I stuffed a second sheet of ptex patch in mine, it's a tight fit but it goes, now it feels pretty good.

I had to carefully line up the gap in the ptex to overlap with the hole in the inner sleeve. I didn't do this the first time, and I think the ptex was trying to seal the hole from the outside so it screwed up the rebound. But the fit is so tight that if it's lined up to start, it doesn't seem to slide around.

I'm thinking about just filling that little hole with JBweld, and throwing away the outer sleeve entirely. I think it should work as long as it keeps completely smooth on the inside of the inner sleeve... Just need to check the wall thicknesses of the inner and outer sleeves first to make sure the inner can handle all the pressure without the outer sleeve backing.

[Telenater]

What are you? An engineering graduate student or something?

I put a couple of ptex patches in the outer sleeve:
http://forums.mtbr.com/showthread.php?t=257438

DCG put 1 sheet of ptex in the outer sleeve - I tried that first, it helped some but it was still a bit bottomy. I stuffed a second sheet of ptex patch in mine, it's a tight fit but it goes, now it feels pretty good.

I had to carefully line up the gap in the ptex to overlap with the hole in the inner sleeve. I didn't do this the first time, and I think the ptex was trying to seal the hole from the outside so it screwed up the rebound. But the fit is so tight that if it's lined up to start, it doesn't seem to slide around.

I'm thinking about just filling that little hole with JBweld, and throwing away the outer sleeve entirely. I think it should work as long as it keeps completely smooth on the inside of the inner sleeve... Just need to check the wall thicknesses of the inner and outer sleeves first to make sure the inner can handle all the pressure without the outer sleeve backing.

[pechelman]

What are you? An engineering graduate student or something?

since he did not mention duct tape in his modification, im going to vote no

[Dickeymotto]

A buddy of mine has a lyrik on his. Considering the 'range' of axle to crown settings with the stock fork, I doubt the lyrik exceeds anything that the stock setup offers.

He's all whiny about specialized made suspension pieces and has never even ridden the stock fork though.

What's your issue with the DC? Some of the tightest roughest trails out there are ridden on dh bikes with DC forks. If you need to turn your bars a full 90 degrees, you aren't riding fast enough

That stock fork is stiff as hell.

There are spots on technical climbs (mostly in Moab) where I've turned my bars further than a dual crown can, and even some super sketchy technical sections that require you to slowly crawl down, almost like trials. I can just see myself in that situation, turning my bar, getting stuck, and falling over.