Teton Conditions, 07/08...no noise.

**sar13** · 01-02-2008, 01:14 PM

Watch out for rapid warming today. SAR was called out twice yesterday. We flew over the Pyramid slide and the Cody Pk slide with our long range transceiver just in case. Lots of action out there. Fortunately everyone was OK in both cases.

Later in the day a guy was swept through the cliffs in unskiabowl and suffered a fractured pelvis and ruptured spleen. He, his two buddies and five SAR team members spent a very long cold night out there and were flown out this a.m.

Everything seemed pretty stable when I skied yesterday a.m. but rapid warming yesterday loosened up the pack and could do it again today. Be careful.

**homemadesalsa** · 01-02-2008, 11:05 PM

We touring out north and saw the huge cornice that busted in Unskiabowl. That must have been a terrifying ride- the debris went pretty far and there were nasty looking cliffs getting there.

High winds have made for some variable hard slab. I found 2 distinct layers that failed with moderate to hard strength. The top, at 15 cm down from the surface, had Q2-3 and seemed to be at a density break. The second failure was 30 cm down where we dug (around 9800', N facing, about 40• steepness), and was Q1 to 2, on what felt like a very cold light layer. It looked like there may have been some surface hoar but I didn't have a lens and it may have been stellar arms. Still, classic false stable conditions: high strength, sparky on the energy scale, and scary srturcture, at least in the short term.

Also saw another SE face that had pulled out- over near the summer trail up the NE face of Taylor- just slightly around the corner from the wide east face. Looked like it went in the storm cycle- maybe half a meter thick and 100m wide. HS-N-D2.5-O

And then one more SE face avalanche crown on the South Face of Taylor- just leeward of one of the upper set of cornices after the south ridge is no longer flat in the middle. Looked like a D1.5 or 2- couldn't see a debris pile.

With continued warm temps these hard slabs/ wind slabs will settle out a bit, but as SAR 13 says, they are softening up quickly, especially up high, and things are still quite volatile. Winds like we had up to what, 90 mph?, can cause loading and wind slab in unusual places- it's time to take off our familiarity goggles for a bit and keep our eyes open.

And that is my limited read on Teton snow conditions- have barely been back i town 24 hours, but I read all the avy bulletins, talked to a bunch of avid backcountry hounds, and paid attention today- even dug a test pit.

Anyone else?

**MTslackcountry** · 01-04-2008, 11:03 AM

Thinking about heading down this weekend, Anyone know what conditions have been like in Granite Canyon? Any noteable slides YTD? Sounds like most activity is being seen on south to south west slopes. Thanks!

**panchosdad** · 01-25-2008, 03:24 PM

Bumping this thread to see what you've observed after a few days of high pressure. We saw surface hoar/near surface facets below about 8000' on a NE aspect yesterday on a park tour, not big but noticeable. North facing gully above 10000' had variable thin windslab/crust that wasn't well bonded. What'cha got? What's going to be buried in the upcoming storm cycle?

**Tye 1on** · 01-25-2008, 04:25 PM

Good question pancho. Today was the first day that all elevations have been considered to have a 'low' level of general hazard, midwinter, that me and my buddies recall seeing mid-winter in many years. Could it be that the lack of warm days is letting things bond pretty effectively? Paging Salsa...

**homemadesalsa** · 01-25-2008, 05:34 PM

Well seeing as Panchos Dad is my husband... I have been in on this discussion and right there in the middle of his obs. heehee.

I think he is trolling for anyone else out there... anyone? Shwerty? Upallnight?

I'll be working a level 2 from Sun- Thursday, can post what we find next week.

**schwerty** · 01-26-2008, 09:56 AM

I'd be happy to post my obs if I had any from this week

. Unfortunately, I haven't been out in over a week! Plans are to head to the Togwotee area early tomorrow though....crossing my fingers. I'll have obs monday, if we go.

**Tye 1on** · 01-28-2008, 10:36 AM

Originally Posted by homemadesalsa

Well seeing as Panchos Dad is my husband... I have been in on this discussion and right there in the middle of his obs. heehee.

doh!!!

Could get interesting, was slushy in town saturday, and sunday had a period of grauple between snow events...curious how it settled in up high...

**homemadesalsa** · 01-30-2008, 09:52 PM

Well my Av 2 went to the Park today- went up Wimpy's very cautiously. We put in the skin track for the first time since I don't know when. Paid close attention- a great learning/ teaching day. Stability actually seemed good- spent a lot of time investigating the new snow (since Sunday)/ old snow (crust/ facets/ some surface hoar) interface. The BT nailed it this time- at least up to 10,000 feet what I saw. It came in warm and then locked up with the cold- made for decent bonding at that interface. Medium strength (CT 15/ STM) and consistent Q2, no hard slab WHERE WE WERE. And like it has said elsewhere, the wind put loads in some places where I haven't seen it do so before. Still tiptoeing a bit, but now somewhat reassured.

over and out///

**smitchell333** · 01-30-2008, 10:33 PM

Out of town visitors on vacation - we've been out last 4 days on various tours.

Pass, Philiips, Taggert Lake

The storm snow density is inverted pretty good and the wind has loaded soft slab in areas that would be easy to trigger. N Facing test slope at 6500' failed at new/old snow interface I think on old surface facets with solid jump. I'd stay off anything either steep or windloaded as there are pockets of high danger on N/NE facing slopes on ridgelines and crossload features. We turned around from the Teton Pass summit yesterday morning and toured lower in the trees.

In the trees and sheltered slopes down lower the stability was good with no cracking or significant settling on S/SE/E faces below 9000'. Skiing was excellent, carvable and powdery, although not skiing deep.

**smitchell333** · 01-31-2008, 10:38 PM

5th day.

Coal Creek

Telemark Bowl 2X

6900'

20-30" powder

Fluff

Lowering danger. Inverted almost alleviated by slow steady snowfall. Cream

8-13" tonight forecast.

**rideit** · 02-01-2008, 12:58 AM

Today i did two runs, one second/first turn, and one titmouse.
I did not encounter any signs of instability, but my lines were of the most conservative available, basically.
I was a bit spooked by cornice looking conditions looking into the gully between shivers and titmouse, but felt quite confident on the spine until I got into the woods.

Be careful out there, folks, if you haven't been around a long while...(even more so if you have) these are depths/winds/conditions that we haven't seen in at least a decade.
I don't know much, but this I know.

**smitchell333** · 02-01-2008, 08:27 PM

12" new over night

Danger definitely escalated, especially where really wind drifted.

25 Short today. There was some over the head deep stuff in the trees, almost too deep unless a bit steeper, but of course had to keep terrain to less than 30 deg.

**smitchell333** · 02-03-2008, 02:28 AM

Last report from me. 7th day in a row B/C Tetons today.

Hit Mt Ely to trees skiers right a little ways of the Claw and then Telemark Bowl. So fucking deep. Some of the deepest snow I've ever skied, any deeper and you can't go downhill. Over the head faceshots. 50+" in one week.

The NE start to the Claw was windloaded with a sticky, slightly cracky layer. Combined with a convex shape and steeper terrain we didn't feel comfortable. We inspected, then climbed back 30' to the top and back to the ridge and into the trees to the right where things were much more sheltered. Nothing down from there but deep pow.

The deep pow and the inverted/warm/wind layer from Monday rose the danger from Low/Low/Moderate to Moderate/Considerable/High, but I must say in my 7 days of touring I saw quite little in terms of signs of significant instability. No cracking, no whumphing, and not much of anything in the way of natural activity that I saw.

**homemadesalsa** · 02-04-2008, 08:49 AM

I procrastinated putting in this post yesterday- too much beer and football after a long windy tour day, waaah.

Anyway on the pass it was blowing hard from the EAST, scouring and depositing in some unusual spots. Some shooting cracks in NW loading zones, and one whumph that I tried to trigger.

Big loads, especially on a weak interface at a crust from the sun and wind on S aspects. This crust has produced a number of avalanches in the past few days (an HS-ASu-D1-O on a SE aspect around 8000' on Taylor's SE ridge, and what we think will end up being a SS-AS-D3-O, S aspect, in Mail Cabin that buried a skier)

Unusual conditions bring unusual avalanching.

salsa- off to Targhee where there is 15" of new once again.

**Tye 1on** · 02-04-2008, 09:16 AM

Was up Mail Cabin, came across the party with the buried [but not injured] skier, right when they had all gotten to the bottom and were scrambling hasty search plans. Saw one other slide path, but other skiers i talked to said it was human/deliberately cut on Friday, high up in a cliffy starting zone.

It was too deep up there for my comfort [solo]. Anything steep enough to ski was steep enough to make me nervous. Came back down the same way i went up. Awesome tour tho, and saw a number of skiers on Windy...

**schwerty** · 02-04-2008, 01:50 PM

Originally Posted by homemadesalsa

I procrastinated putting in this post yesterday- too much beer and football after a long windy tour day, waaah.

Anyway on the pass it was blowing hard from the EAST, scouring and depositing in some unusual spots. Some shooting cracks in NW loading zones, and one whumph that I tried to trigger....

Unusual conditions bring unusual avalanching.

salsa- off to Targhee where there is 15" of new once again.

We saw the evidence of the EASt winds this morning on the Pass. My group of 3 got numerous pockets of HARD slab to move on S - SW - W - NW aspects above 8000 feet. All were propagated intentionally and in safe zones where they couldn't run more than 15-20 yards. EVERYTHING ran on either the sun or wind crusts Salsa mentioned.

Sorry, didn't record any data this time around. We did see moderate, Q3 conditions in general on isolated columns but the pack seemed to be more reactive, (on most aspects), than our tests showed. Lots of surface hoar developing between 7800 - 9500 ft. Good skiing was had though! We skied S - SW slopes and stuck mostly to terrain in the 25* - 30* range.

**panchosdad** · 02-06-2008, 09:20 AM

Anybody got the skinny on the slide on Taylor yesterday (mentioned in the avy forecast but no details)? I always wonder if the BT boys have the info and just don't feel like sharing, or if they really don't know what's up.

**SherpaStyle** · 02-06-2008, 07:26 PM

They'll share the info if they get it. Usually a vague report in the avy forecast means a vague message left about the slide from the reporting party.

**homemadesalsa** · 02-07-2008, 08:58 AM

Actually I sent an email asking about the Taylor slide to the BT forecasters, and got this in reply:

"Quick question- got any more details on yesterday's slide
on Taylor? What aspect and elevation? Weak layer? Was it
the old snow surface from Jan 26 or so, that got the big
wind load from the Monday Jan 28 wind storm? Skier
triggered?"

From Bob Comey: "Just a phone message. Skier triggered in the Poop Chute on
Taylor. People tell me the Poop Chute is the main slide
path that drains down towards Coal Creek. Soft slab that
ran 1,800 to 2,000 feet to the top of the runout zone. Crown
was 3 to 3.5 feet. No other info. Got to think it ran in
the new snow on a density break. "