I couldn't find one - is there one?
If not - what's the best airbag out there that is big enough to fit avie gear, puffy jacket, first aid kit, etc?
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I couldn't find one - is there one?
If not - what's the best airbag out there that is big enough to fit avie gear, puffy jacket, first aid kit, etc?
Theres a bag thread somewhere. I like the Mammut Pro 35. Avy gear pocket in the front, pull out helmet net, a-frame and diagonal straps for carrying skis. Light enough, doesn't chafe.
Fan of my Scott Patrol 40 E1
I'm a fan of the capacitor bags, currently use an Osprey Soelden 32 for a good balance of size, weight, downhill performance. I also have an older Mammut canister bag and used the original Black Diamond battery bags. The Alpride capacitor system seems awesome for the weight/functionality. Luckily I have never had to deploy any in the field.
Second on Scott 40 e1. Fan. Enough space - have minimalist hut tripped with it. Works well as a pack - hugs close.
I have and like the mammut light 30, now tour 30. It’s light, carries well, and held up to a lot of use. About 27l of usable volume so on the smaller side. I’ll use a helmet sling if I’m also bring crampons or other bulky stuff. The outdoor gear lab review of airbag packs offers a pretty decent comparison of several models.
i have the jetforce pro tour. bought for my wife for hut trips and makes me feels better that she has it. priority was having one with a battery so could do multiple pulls on one charge (have gotten up to 10). space isnt that great but helmet carry is decent, and i got it used with all the bag sizes so can be 15, 25 or 35 L (though -7/8L in each case for practical packability). so far been a fan though the break zipper thing can sometimes start to open while touring if not repacked well (easy to rezip in this case).
i still dont use it when im going out without her no matter conditions which is weird; i think thats mostly ego thing. i think to myself "it will be really dumb to get caught and have had an avy pack sitting in the gear room..."
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Also pretty happy with it after a couple of seasons. Have the 30L as well I swap to sometimes, but 40L is the better design.Quote:
Originally Posted by summit
New BCA E2 bag is pretty nice from handling and wearing for a day.
This answer confused me.Quote:
Originally Posted by ktoor
its a good pack imo but my experience is limited (only a few tours).Quote:
Originally Posted by PNWbrit
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I think it was your second paragraph that was confusing.
I had the Mammut 35L pro - didn’t really like it from a pack usability standpoint and I found it heavy.
Switched to the Scott Patrol 40. Feels lighter. Better design. I still think it leaves me wanting in the usability department but I all airbags are gonna be a compromise with regards to interior space and access to that space in the field.
I’m planning on making some minor modifications this fall. I’ve no regrets as I think it’s probably the best if what’s available. The Arcteryx one will be interesting to see once it gets released and tested by early adopters.
The question that popped up to me is, why do you need 10 pulls on 1 charge?Quote:
Originally Posted by ktoor
Like... you take a ride, and then climb back up for 9 more rides before deciding it's not safe anymore, but mostly because your battery is dead?
Does not compute with my risk tolerance.
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The first one too.Quote:
Originally Posted by cat in january
Yep.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shorty_J
Kinda skimmed it, that first paragraph is a bit confusing too
If I had to deploy my airbag I’d probably tuck tail and head home.
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By the time you've needed to use an airbag in anger 10 times it's way beyond time to find a new hobby. Or in this case a new husband.Quote:
Originally Posted by MagnificentUnicorn
Avoidable airbag failure to activates often come from users not being hard wired to pull and wait and miss the trigger or the opportunity. Gotta grab quick before you get pummeled.
Huge deal for fan bags is semi-regular practice pulls to build muscle memory, instinct, and zero hesitancy to activate. Biggest reason to have multiple activations is so that you are very disposed to pulling early rather than trying to be "sure" with a single use cannister. But 10 times... I figured that was at normal temps on a battery system so you'd have 3 or 4 pulls at stupid cold.
Trying to figure out a hypothetical for 4...
Maybe you clutz it and accidently activate.
Maybe you then actually use it.
Then maybe you are shaken up and accidently activate it again trying to get out.
Well you got one more just in case.
Capacitor E1 can do 3+ and is not affected by cold.
^^so skiing terrain that you have no confidence in regarding your decision making?
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I meant 10 times in a lifetime of skiing.Quote:
Originally Posted by summit
Yea man. Totally exactly precisely what I was saying.Quote:
Originally Posted by MagnificentUnicorn
Just like your personal motto: Be confident! That way you don't need a beacon or an airbag!
Hey, maybe we could use all that battery juice in the BD pack to rig up an e-touring ski setup to get more laps in? It could power a tow rope!
Got it.Quote:
Originally Posted by PNWbrit
I think 10 slides and you are probably getting hurt even with a bag unless you are a pro-rider straight lining AK faces.
10 needed pulls? Well, there are riders out there who can afford that many new pairs of ski pants...
What did you mean?Quote:
Originally Posted by summit
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I discussed the rationale to have an air bag capable of multiple activations without going to the store or paying a refill cost. The point being then people would be practiced and wouldn't delay activation out of unfamiliarity or hesitance over "using up" their one airbag deployment.Quote:
Originally Posted by MagnificentUnicorn
I then poked fun at the overkill of 10 activations on a charge and tried to come up with a reasonable hypothetical use case for 4, of which one would be a needed activation.
I struggle with how you reached your reply... I assume you used a million dollar invention like so?
Attachment 471665
Ive got the Osprey Sopris Pro E2 30. It is definitely the most comfortable airbag pack ive tried. Its well made, durable, and lightweight. Good volume for full day touring in midwinter. The only thing that I dont like about it is the metal clasps used to fasten the hip belt, and the adjustability of them is very difficult, nearly impossible while keeping your gloves on. I have seen where folks are swapping those out, I might consider that.
welllll if we go back to the source material (although agreed it was a bit stream of consciousness) i only said i wanted multiple pulls on a charge and that i had gotten up to 10. never did i say i needed 10 so take a breath everyone.
first reason i want multiple pulls is for the reason stated above; some of the sparse research presented on wildsnow talks about not pulling in time due lack of to muscle memory or, for canister bags, hesitating as you know youll have to go through the hoopla of a new canister. so wanted to avoid that and be able to practice.
second was that on hut trips or multi-day outings, if recharging options are limited (and you dont want to carry the charging cord), id rather know i can use the bag for a week and even do practice pulls in the field on the one charge. this bag was great for this.
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The ability to practice was a primary reason I went with a battery bag. Just seemed simpler.
The secondary was ease of travel, although I haven't actually traveled with it.
I have the Osprey and really like it. Not a ton of space, but one of the most comfortable packs I have ever owned.
It is also holding up very well - 3 or so seasons of me learning to sled and it has almost no visible wear.
Thanks everyone. I had no idea packs have gone to batteries - I thought it was all canisters still. Looks like the Scott and Osprey are the best, I'll have to try them on soon.
When traveling, budget time for security. My fan pack has confounded security in Denver, Seattle, Calgary - like, had never seen or heard of
Yes, my pack came with some paperwork stating that it is TSA compliant. It might have sorta helped getting through...they were still puzzled.Quote:
Originally Posted by tang
Hopefully as they become more prevalent TSA will become more familiar with them.
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That’s a $.50 invention at best. Thanks for the explanation.Quote:
Originally Posted by summit
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Yeah I can totally see the merit in having multiple pulls available... I think 3 or 4 seems reasonable... but practice doesn't seem like a good reason if it's just electricity and you can recharge it to practice again.
I was just taken aback at the humble brag at getting 10 pulls on 1 charge. Seemed a bit ridiculous.
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Me too although I sometimes wish it were a bit larger to fit my kitchen sink.Quote:
Originally Posted by summit
If you need 3-4 pulls on one charge and apply a standard 10x margin of safety then you would be aiming for 30-40 in ideal conditions (100% SoX). My guess is that they airbag engine developer was aiming for a 10x margin with 1 inflation being mandatory at all times in all conditions. That's how I would have approached it at least.
I would prefer to have a pack that can be repacked in the field and popped a second time. If I've found myself in terrain where an airbag could make a difference and I've been caught in a slide then there's a good chance of similar conditions being present on the exit route. My next airbag will be electric and preferably with the ability to deflate itself after the avalanche has stopped.
I've accidentally pulled my bag at the bottom of a run while transitioning. Quickly repacked it and gone for another lap.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason4
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I printed off the necessary info for airport security and put that paper in a ziploc and put it at the bottom of my pack so I’ll hopefully never find myself in a security check 30min from boarding a flight and have somebody try to say I can’t take it through and be left fighting them about it.
It’s not 100% foolproof - but it prevents me from forgetting it at home and avoids me having to dig that info up on the internet and show them on a small phone screen.
I swear to god the Canuck TSA at Calgary are absolutely bottom of the barrel individuals for their complete and utter lack of brains or logical thinking. I've been called out on so much dumb shit there.Quote:
Originally Posted by tang
Only familiar with my abs pack, but I am not sure how many times I would want to cycle the bags and the rip fabric coupled with repacking. I practice the pull with a dead trigger to build muscle memory.
I lost a pierced canister at tsa. Tried to persuade them it was safe because of piercing, but no go as hole is small and can’t see inside. I had flown with a pierced tank many times before. Since I have made arrangements to rent canister and trigger where I go. ABS has been problematic to find sometimes.
I believe the Alpride E1 airbag system is rated for 50 inflations by the manufacturer, minus damage from an actual slide.
ETA from the engineer: "The E1 is certified for 50 inflations. We have to make 100 inflations for certify 50, thus proving a good engineering safety margin. Better, we have a sample of the E1 system in testing for months and have done 10,000 inflations (without backpack) without any problems or undue wear, unbelievable."