Looking to head up to Berthoud Pass this week and wanted to see if anyone had 1st hand beta on snow and Avy conditions there?
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Looking to head up to Berthoud Pass this week and wanted to see if anyone had 1st hand beta on snow and Avy conditions there?
First hand conditions based on reports from many people (everyone that submits an observation plus forecaster's own observations)
https://avalanche.state.co.us/?lat=3...77328982253013
Things will change daily this week with significant snowfall.
Its a pretty classically shitty early season set up. Luckily we have one of the best avalanche centers in the world with forecasters doing everything they can to keep you safe. If you haven't been reading the forecast and discussion everyday, start with that. This summarizes what is going on:
What nobody can control is your decision making. What keeps you and your friends same over the long haul is understanding that we are are the problem. All of us are at risk of making poor choices for many reasons. The snowpack does not care how flat your brim, how much venom in your vipers or your desire to ski pow.Quote:
Avalanche conditions are dangerous. Backcountry travel requires conservative choices and careful route-finding to stay away from avalanches. This means dialing back your terrain choices, giving steep slopes more space than you might think, and paying attention to subtle changes in terrain. Do not let sunny skies or fresh powder outweigh your caution.
During the dry November period, there was widespread snow cover on northerly and easterly aspects. This layer created a weak blanket of faceted snow near the ground. Snow and wind from the past two weeks formed a thick slab resting on top of this weak foundation. Avalanches are breaking widely and running big as the slab gains cohesion. The snowpack will give you fewer warning signs of instability, like cracking and collapsing.
If you have specific questions about any of this, ask here and people can direct you to some educational resources. This is serious business.
Well said Foggy.Quote:
Originally Posted by Foggy_Goggles
https://avalanche.state.co.us/accidents/colorado
2 buried, 1 killed. RIP.
https://classic.avalanche.state.co.u...=825&accfm=rep
They will clean it up after the final report, but 4 caught, 2 buried, 1 did not survive. R2D2 is not your friend.
#shockingQuote:
four backcountry tourers were caught in a large avalanche near the summit of Berthoud Pass in an area locally known as Nitro Chute
This week is always a junk show up there: https://classic.avalanche.state.co.u...=766&accfm=inv
For better or worse, Berthoud Pass is Le Junk Show
This has been the only constant for decades. I'm pretty numb to it, but consider this. There was an avalanche fatality within a couple hundred meters of a major highway is plain view of tens of thousands of motorists. The terrain is accessible with about a 15min. boot pack. Early reports for those I know and trust on scene, both recreationalists and first responders indicate that The Plunge had can huge earlier in the day and that at some point after that but prior to the fatal slide, a solo skier had been ascending the apron below Nitro.
If you or anyone you know, could benefit from some avalanche awareness, check out https://www.berthoudpass.org/ There are some virtual classes coming up if you can't get to a classroom session.
Also please remember that while you want to stay sharp on your companion rescue and first aid skills, many avalanche burials are not survivable. If you have questions or seek mentorship, please ask.
This is a dangerous game with some risk that can not be mitigated. That said, this one hits pretty hard because it is in my backyard and in someways I could see myself in that terrain under these conditions.
The place could use some sort of professional patrol and safety management program. And I hate to say that because I'm usually against that kinda thing.
I really like FOBP’s tendency to minimize snow analysis and focus on terrain management. Our snow pack is always awful. Snow pits give little valuable information beyond the precise location where they are dug, even if you are skilled and practiced in all of the nuances of snow pits.
I saw this on CAIC yesterday and I think it is new. One page with all avalanche related deaths and a bunch of accidents since 2014.
I’m likely more conservative than most, but if the approach or decent is on this list, I don’t ski it until spring consolidation. Lots of accidents on yellow days.
https://avalanche.state.co.us/accidents/colorado
Why? What would it do? Do you hate 'murica?Quote:
Originally Posted by Name Redacted
There is an awesome ski area just down the street. They even have lifts that take you to the top.
I honestly can’t believe how many ski that area in early winter conditions. RIP.
I don't think the USFS is going to allow that.Quote:
Originally Posted by Name Redacted
I haven't seen the name of the victim. I'm wondering if he's a guy I know....
sorry to read this. 4 out of 5 caught for a ride is concerning.
RIP
Brian Bunnell, science teacher @ Conifer HS. JeffCo Schools just sent out the notification to parents at Conifer HS.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hacksaw
I tend to agree with that sentiment. I view it as such until spring when it actually settles. There's that astronaut with the gun meme out there saying "Facets? it always has been" that speaks a lot more of the truth than the humor implies. Most people dig garbage snow pits on the wrong aspects of their skiing most of the time anyway.Quote:
Originally Posted by timackie
I took the Dean Cummings Steep Life class before Avy 1, and that was very terrain focused (ex. View your run from the high point ). Cool course. There are some YT videos if interested.
Stay safe mags
Re: snowpits
There are three main reasons I do know dig nor reply on data provided by snowpits around the Berthoud Pass area in normal winter conditions.
1. The CAIC is an amazing center has has done all the science for you. I read this everyday and can build a picture of the snowpack without ever been there. I don't need to perform any tests to know about basal facets, windloading and so on.
2. The normal avalanche problem (Persistent Slab and/or Deep Persistent Slab) exihibit a high level of spacial variability and, as such, are not good candidates for making go/no go decisions based on snow pit analysis.
3. I have come to understand that my safety is greatly improved under mid winter conditions by placing some pretty hard terrain restrictions on myself before I even leave the house.
Wow!! Same first name as my friend, but different guys. Whewww..... Sorry for his family.Quote:
Originally Posted by GeoMatt
https://www.inforum.com/news/fargo/f...-christmas-day
RIP - I didn't know Brian personally as he was a few years older than I, but he attended the same schools as I growing up. Wish I could have shared a chair and some turns. + vibes and prayers for his family.
Jesus fuck, his poor kids having dig him out of the snow. I can't even imagine....
All spot on.Quote:
Originally Posted by Foggy_Goggles
RIP Brian.
Fuck, I don't look forward to the report. RIP.
Yep.Quote:
Originally Posted by John_B
Full report of the nitro slide is up.
https://www.cbsnews.com/colorado/new...organizations/
"Experience bc skier, avid mtn biker" according to the news.... a science teacher, lived in the mountains, kids in freeride programs... had avalanche gear... knew he needed an avalanche class, had signed up for one...
https://classic.avalanche.state.co.u...=825&accfm=inv
I am utterly baffled as to what he was doing in that terrain that day managing a group that way with what was going on.
There could have been 4 people buried and killed in this slide, but only two were caught and one died. This was a close proximity burial and the inexperienced companions did not recognize this problem as they had not been trained which delayed the unburial of the deceased.
Tragic and sad
RIP
So much done wrong and so tragic to read.
Even an evening awareness class might have made a difference in the choices of terrain and conditions.
WTF?Quote:
Bunnell was not only an experienced backcountry rider
I hate to say it, but just because you spend a lot of time in the BC doesn't mean you know what you're doing. That report was very sad and shocking to read, so many bad decisions were made that day.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bunion 2020
When the news says "experienced backcountry rider" that could mean literally anything. Literally.
Agreed. The local news generally uses the term "experienced" very loosely.Quote:
Originally Posted by summit
The news almost always says thatQuote:
Originally Posted by summit
Agreed, but all four were caught in the slide. It’s a head scratcher for sureQuote:
Originally Posted by summit
Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums
I had a feeling this one would be a head scratcher. Sad.
I'm surprised no one yelled at the kicker-builders, given what a busy spot that is. Berthoud is a place where everyone with 5 days of experience and an Avy 1 likes to flaunt their knowledge and tell people stuff before they even ask. In this case, anyone who knew much of anything would have been well justified to say "I don't think that's a good place to be".
I'd say the big takeaway for most of us is probably this: "Searching for multiple people is always more complicated than searching for one. The chance of a close proximity burial increases if people are caught within a short distance from each other. Close proximity burials can make transceiver searches more difficult and increase the time of rescue. After the rescue, responders who assisted in the search said they wished they had practiced complex scenarios when doing rescue drills. Knowing how to use your rescue equipment in complex situations and practicing with it often increases the chance you will be about to use the equipment effectively in a real rescue."
Practice. Take the rescue course.
And regularly re-take it.Quote:
Originally Posted by goldenboy
I'm due for another.