low volume boot suggestions?

I am thinking about changing from my beloved flexons to a different boot. I love how the flexons ski, but I have lost toenails for 3 consecutive seasons, even after blowing out the shell repeatedly, and the next shell size up is too big. I am tired of having fucked up toes all summer, so I want to make a change. What I'm looking for are some suggestions as to what lower volume boots I should try, as I've been on flexons for 6 years now and don't really know what's out there. I tried on the kryptons last year, but they didn't seem to fit right. Gracias.

Natty, try out the Salomon Pro Model SC. I switched from 5 seasons on Flexons to that boot last season and it is a freakin great boot. I can still flex it how I want to, but it's definitely stiffer than my old Flexons and made me realize that I'd gotten into the habit of overflexing the Flexons (heh) and getting too much over the toe of the boot. I now have a much more centered, powerful stance with the Pro Models. Oh and I have a super narrow foot and they fit great.

try the Lange Comp 120 Low Fit

Kryptons with custom liners.

doberman 130s....

although i just picked up a pair of XWave10s from www.untracked.com

the price was right.

Thanks for the suggestions. I'll report back when I try some, although the bummer with new boots is that trying them in the shop means very little...

My pick has been the Dobie 150 and then softening it. Now my foot was always too narrow/low volume for even the Flexon and I used to loose toes with a super downsized Lange with Zip Fit's, but the Dobies have hooked me up now for 3 seasons and I won't be changing anytime soon. Way better edge hold, super powerfull, and the most comfy boot I have owned. You will have to spend considerable time with a boot fitter to get them dialed... They don't work for most, but if your foot is truly narrow give them a go. The best liners out there for sure.

I had a pair of the matte black Dobie 150's for a couple seasons as a secondary boot to my atomic race 10:50's that had a custom liner. The dobies were great once I ground them out to my feet but were a little too much of a chore getting in and out of them with that plastic so they never fully replaced my atomics. This year I am replacing the atomics with the nordica hot rod or the Dobie 130 if I can't get the hot rod. I'll also do a full surefoot foam and thotic.

Like someone else mentioned, also try the 120 low fit or the 130.

The race stock dobermann is the narrowest boot, lowest volume boot out there, but it's long (compared to a Lange or Salomon). It's by far the best boot I've ever skied in (Raichle, Lange, Salomon). The retail stock boot (130) is good, but it's definitely a higher-volume fit.
It does have the best liner- leather baby.
Getting them off and on is a pain, but I can flex the boot and I'm 155lbs. The last is very anatomical- expect to do a little grinding somewhere though.
It's really nice to have the extra leverage when you're on big boards in powder- you can push the ski around more. I have to admit they make my knees ache on hard snow- but hard snow sucks anyway.
Seriously, if you could ski in raichles without grinding the shit out of the shell, then the WC Dobermann is probably the best choice out there.
my 2cents (i work for a shop that specializes in bootfitting).

Maybe try calling Jim Mates, Custom Boot Service, in Seattle. He helped me with my somewhat low volume X-Wave 10s. He seemed to know quite a bit about the various boots on the market. I was also very impressed with his knowledge of human biomechanics. I don't think he sells boots, but I bet he can steer you towards the best boots for you. Finally, I think that he does excellent boot-fitting. He'll check you for your level of flexibility/agility/ability before doing anything else.

6500 4th Ave. NW
Seattle, Washington 98117
Phone: 206.297-9298

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Originally Posted by Particle

Natty, try out the Salomon Pro Model SC. I switched from 5 seasons on Flexons to that boot last season and it is a freakin great boot. I can still flex it how I want to, but it's definitely stiffer than my old Flexons and made me realize that I'd gotten into the habit of overflexing the Flexons (heh) and getting too much over the toe of the boot. I now have a much more centered, powerful stance with the Pro Models. Oh and I have a super narrow foot and they fit great.

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another vote here for the Salomon, had flexons the past 4 years....justed picked up the SC's. nice flex, narrow fit, and a bit of a higher cuff too which felt sweet. give them a shot.

heh, i said "justed"

just curious.....anyone ever try a thermo-flex liner in their salomon sc's?

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Originally Posted by H-wood

The race stock dobermann is the narrowest boot, lowest volume boot out there, but it's long (compared to a Lange or Salomon). It's by far the best boot I've ever skied in (Raichle, Lange, Salomon). The retail stock boot (130) is good, but it's definitely a higher-volume fit.
It does have the best liner- leather baby.
Getting them off and on is a pain, but I can flex the boot and I'm 155lbs. The last is very anatomical- expect to do a little grinding somewhere though.
It's really nice to have the extra leverage when you're on big boards in powder- you can push the ski around more. I have to admit they make my knees ache on hard snow- but hard snow sucks anyway.
Seriously, if you could ski in raichles without grinding the shit out of the shell, then the WC Dobermann is probably the best choice out there.
my 2cents (i work for a shop that specializes in bootfitting).

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H-Wood,
Where do you work? I agree with everything he said. I liked the fact that it was a little long as that is what has saved my toes, yet since they are soo low volume they are super tight everywhere else.

Natty (or anyone else)
If they fit ya I have some new head RD (consumer plug boot) in 25 and 28, and the head 103 boot in 25.
$250/pair

The Salomon boot mentioned will still be quite a bit more volume than the Flexon. The Lange would be closer but more volume again but maybe more toebox room.

You should take a serious look at the Atomic RT cs (consumer plug) boot. Lower volume heel than the lange or Salomon and lower mid foot as well especially than the Solly. Big bonus is an amazing amount of big toe length. That is always the bain of ski boots for me ... the right size and volume to hold my snug but enough toe room for my mutant long first toe. I've done some ungodly punches to accomodate it. The Atomic needed nor work on the toe and is tighter than my langes ever were. The boot has the very stiff race lower but he soft or extra soft upper. Amazing control with stiff lower but still good flex in the upper for varied terrain. Stiffer than a flexon but as soft or softer than a lange 130 and maybe even the 120.

Some of the heads are low volume but clearly so is the flexon and you still lost nails, I'm not sure how the toe room is in the heads.

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Originally Posted by comish

H-Wood,
Where do you work? I agree with everything he said. I liked the fact that it was a little long as that is what has saved my toes, yet since they are soo low volume they are super tight everywhere else.

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I work for Footloose in Mammoth.
I haven't skied the other plug boots, but I bet the Head is worthy and narrow too.
I think the extra length helps, but I bet what's really saved your toes is the fact that your foot can't slide forward when your heel/ankle is locked in a vice. Black toe usually comes from boots that are too big.

heretic.

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Originally Posted by Buster Highmen

heretic.

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:o :(

I was waiting for that from you busta. :D

Clip your danged toenails. Besides, chicks dig the mangled nails, right?

I ski the doberman 130. It is a very low volume boot and has worked good for me so far and is the best fitting boot I have owned to this point.

Only complaint is that it is a bitch to get on and off, especially when it is real cold out (like below 0).

Just tried on a few boots and I'm amazed at the changes in boot design since I started skiing flexons 6 years ago. It seems the big change is that most boot companies are offering their higher quality, tighter fitting race shells to consumers now. Having tried a few boots, I think you guys were right on with doberman 130 suggestion--it fit almost perfectly, with a locked heel and plently of room around the big toe. I'm torn right now between that and the technica diablo 130--I like the feel of the flex better than the dobie, prolly due to the positon of the hinge attaching the cuff to the lower part of the boot--super smoov flex. Quality wise, both boots look and feel bomber, no rivets, burly buckles--no more blown out raichle buckles!!
Stoked that there were some good choices out there.

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Originally Posted by natty dread

Just tried on a few boots and I'm amazed at the changes in boot design since I started skiing flexons 6 years ago. It seems the big change is that most boot companies are offering their higher quality, tighter fitting race shells to consumers now. Having tried a few boots, I think you guys were right on with doberman 130 suggestion--it fit almost perfectly, with a locked heel and plently of room around the big toe. I'm torn right now between that and the technica diablo 130--I like the feel of the flex better than the dobie, prolly due to the positon of the hinge attaching the cuff to the lower part of the boot--super smoov flex. Quality wise, both boots look and feel bomber, no rivets, burly buckles--no more blown out raichle buckles!!
Stoked that there were some good choices out there.

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IF you can find a dealer maybe try the Dalbello Krypton Pro, which incorporates the flexon buckle. Dalbello boots are roomy in the toe area too. They even come with additional set of softer tongues and shock absorbing "boot boards".


Info

http://www.northernski.com/products/...20PRO%20MS.jpg

Highway Star-

If the fit of the WC last felt good, that's really the only choice for you.
You can soften up the 150 a little bit, but the lateral and rear flex will remain like cast iron. I'm skiing in the 150 (softened) and I really love the boot for skiing soft snow- the boot has so much leverage you can really power through stuff. That said, it's almost painful on bumpy hard snow- the shell is so stiff it rattles the shit out of your knees, transmitting every chatter mark directly to your cartilege. It's also really heavy.
If you're less than 165 lbs, the 100 flex might be better, especially if you ski on hard snow a lot. I wouldn't worry about the lower cuff height- the fit is the key, and all the other retail boots will most likely be too high-volume. If you're bigger and stronger you'll have to go 150 and have the inner cuff cut down to soften the flex.
ONe other option might be the narrowest Head boot- I'm not sure about their current line, but they used to have a 97mm toe boot that I think was softer than 150. The Head boot would probably also feel more like a Flexon- upright, more fluid-feeling flex.

What H-wood said.

I have a 150 flex dobie as mentioned above that has been softened to be right in between the XS and the 150. The fit ends up enabling me to ski weeks on them with no shin bang. They are also way lighter than my previous setup which was langes/zip fits. I have even toured for a week in Rogers Pass with them, although to be fair this wasn't ideal.

If you are light or a moderate skier go with the XS otherwise get the 150 and soften it.

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Originally Posted by Highway Star

Can you guys describe better how much time you spend in bumps/trees/crud/chop, and how big and agressive you are?

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No thank you.
But you should be in the 150. Ski on it and then worry about softening the boot. They're great in soft snow, just bone-rattling on hard snow. It will be easier for you to ski in any condition because it's low volume and rigid, so you're going to have better control over the ski.

I know a few people who spent last season in the Krypton Pro and were very disappointed. Word is, it doesn't share much more than the tongue style with the Flexon despite the marketing message otherwise.

I was looking at the Krypton Pro until I spoke with those people. Now I'm back to thinking about Dobie/Hotrod...

the krypton felt NOTHING like the flexon.......which is all i heard with the marketing hype. very curious now about the nordica doby mentioned on this thread; hope to slip it on for a try.

Not sure if this is helping anyone out.... too lazy to read the whole thread, but spent last two days trying on low volume boots and really liked Technica Diablo Magnesium and the Nordica Speedmachine line (a little narrower than the Hot Rod, I believe). I went with the Speedmachine 12s, 110-120 adjustable flex, which works well for me. Speedmachine 14s if you're looking for something stiffer..... Tried the Kryptons as well, but wasn't the right fit, although close.

A V was cut into the back. This has been debated in other threads. Some claim its not the correct way for Nordica, but the guys that did mine are some of the best fitters in Yurp, Footworks in Chamonix and I'm very happy with the result.

I'm 5'9" and 160lbs. If I were skiing EC with all the bumps and truly hard snow I would prolly make them softer than they are now, but that wouldn't be too hard. I'm skiing in the west. no bumps ever.

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Originally Posted by Highway Star

What was done to soften the boot, and how big are you?

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Another vote for the Hot Rod/Dob 130. I got my hot rods last season and after some work (grinding down the boot board for less zeppa, making the sadle cuts deeper and messing with the spoiler) they are my favorite boots so far. Especially after my last Atomics. This season i'm going to plane the sole down so I can attach the vibram soles off a pair of Adrenalins for some badass AT boots.

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Originally Posted by natty dread

the technica diablo 130

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[gush] WHAT A NICE FUCKING BOOT!!!!!! [/gush]


p.s. that Diablo 130 is a nice fucking boot!!!

I think fitting is a definite potential problem because it is small. My feet haven't been cold at all. In fact, definitely warmer than the Lange/Zip Fit combo I previously had, probably because my toes have so much more room. I wouldn't worry about that. With a little grinding/stretching and that primo liner your toes will be fine.

Now I do have major water leakage. Have had some duct tape/neoprene strategically placed which seems to stop the majority of it. For some reason on mine there isn't enough overlap on the lower shell so there is major gaposis under both the bottom two buckles. Sucks when I can literally feel a river of water running onto my toes...

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Originally Posted by trainnvain

[gush] WHAT A NICE FUCKING BOOT!!!!!! [/gush]


p.s. that Diablo 130 is a nice fucking boot!!!

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I agree. You have a pair? I think this is what I'm ordering this week, stoked. High school racer night at the shop--pro form baby!! :D