Another quiver rounding thread (190 Gotama and ?)

My quiver will consist of a 190 Gotama and one or two other skis. I am 6’ 180 lbs and ski primarily at Kirkwood and other Sierra spots. Honestly the Gotama works great all the time, but something more suited to hard snow and/or beer drinking days would be nice.

Here is what I have owned recently:
190 Gotama : My favorite ski of all time.
190 Explosive : Liked it, but Gotama is more fun
186 Legend Pro: Absolute Tanks. However, I have decided that I don’t want to be in battle all the time (coming soon to ski swap)
185 Mad Trix Mojos: Way too much shape. Scared the hell out of me.
179 Public Enemys: Fun, good, but a little skinny (80mm)
185 B3: Too soft

I am thinking either:
(a) 190 Gotama, 184 Mantra
(b) 190 Gotama, 185 Karma
(d) 190 Gotama, 184 Mantra, 177 Karma
(d) 190 Gotama, ??

There are a crap load of new skis this year so maybe I should look beyond Volkl? But then again, they have treated me right in the past.

190 Gotama and my lightly used G4....Otherwise do the 185 Karma

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Originally Posted by milkman

190 Gotama and my lightly used G4....Otherwise do the 185 Karma

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I'd agree with the above statement.

179 Seth Vicious. Easy and fun to ski, wide enough for pow and perfect for the park.

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Originally Posted by robokill1981

179 Seth Vicious. Easy and fun to ski, wide enough for pow and perfect for the park.

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Not a bad idea, but is this a good groomer ski? May be a bit wide for the quiver rounding task, but I really liked my Publics.

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Originally Posted by descender

Not a bad idea, but is this a good groomer ski? May be a bit wide for the quiver rounding task, but I really liked my Publics.

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It's a great park ski if thats what you'll be doing. If you're staying out of the park I would go with a 184 Mantra. I owned the Karma and would not recommend them, they did everything ok and nothing that good besides park.

If you want a groomer ski, look for somethin 85 or less in the waist. A mantra or any seth will not be a good groomer ski. You've already got the goat, go for something skinnier....

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Originally Posted by robokill1981

It's a great park ski if thats what you'll be doing. If you're staying out of the park I would go with a 184 Mantra. I owned the Karma and would not recommend them, they did everything ok and nothing that good besides park.

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Hmm.... so the Karma’s are a bit mediocre and boring?

I really want a skinner version of the Gotama. Same exact shape, consutrction, tail, flex, everything, but about 10-15mm thinner throughout. The Matra is close, but it may be more of an ass-kicker in the tail like the explosive is/was.

Any 85-90mm straight-ish, medium flex, wood core, semi-twin, all mountain skis out there?

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Originally Posted by descender

Hmm.... so the Karma’s are a bit mediocre and boring?

I really want a skinner version of the Gotama. Same exact shape, consutrction, tail, flex, everything, but about 10-15mm thinner throughout. The Matra is close, but it may be more of an ass-kicker in the tail like the explosive is/was.

Any 85-90mm straight-ish, medium flex, wood core, semi-twin, all mountain skis out there?

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I wouldn't write off the Karma based on one review. Tons of people love the Karma. From what I hear it's a softer more friendly G4. Try to demo a pair. I'm sure you'll like them just fine...

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Originally Posted by descender

Any 85-90mm straight-ish, medium flex, wood core, semi-twin, all mountain skis out there?

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This is the karma. I'm 185lbs, and love the 177cm version. From what I read the 185s didnt gain you much stability. They do everything well, but not one thing extremely well...which is what you would want to fill your gap. I'm in the oposite situation you are. Own 177 karmas, just bought 190 goats. 177 karmas dive to easily for me - but i didnt buy them for powder, I had PR's and now goats and bros for that.

The 177 karmas might be a little flexy, but the dampness of them makes up for it. They have a speed limit, but do not get floppy or chatter - they just dont have the edge length you need for control at super speeds. My sisters 172 v-carvers have the same running length. The 185 might be better for that. They kick ass for an all mountain everyday ski though - except bumps - they are much stiffer than I prefer for a bump ski. If you keep your edges in shape they can do really well on hardpack / ice - they're no 6 stars, but good enough for the occational ice patch.

They are stiff enough for slush, but again at 177 lack the length to really trust them at speed it in the thick stuff. In the air, they swing well - i thinking of remounting farther forward than the suggested mark to make them more stable.

If your going to have a 2 ski quiver - go 185 or 177 karma, they are the most fun pair of skis i have owned and handle a wide variation of conditions the best.

things i ski routinely in the past 3 years:
182 volkl 6 stars
175 solly x-screams
185 pocket rockets

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Originally Posted by milkman

I wouldn't write off the Karma based on one review. Tons of people love the Karma. From what I hear it's a softer more friendly G4. Try to demo a pair. I'm sure you'll like them just fine...

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Not writting them off, but wondering why some think it "does nothing that great", which seems to be the only knock on them I can find on the interweb.

there is truth in what he said. They don't do one thing extremely well....they do everything good as opposed to some skis doing one thing really well and everything else so so...

If you want a gs ski, get a gs ski. If you want a park ski, get a park ski. If you want pow - you already have goats.

If you want all round, karma could be your ticket....depends on what you really want to do with them when your not skiing the goats.

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Originally Posted by milkman

190 Gotama and my lightly used G4....Otherwise do the 185 Karma

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This is exactly what I ski at Kookwood all year long. 190 Gotamas most days, and 188 G4s for the boilerplate days. Really, they're the only two skis you need in the Sierras. But the Spats are nice to have also. :D Unless you can find a pair of G4s, I'd get Karmas to fill that hole in the quiver.

outlaws w/o the piston plate shit

How about:
Line Chronic Wide (haven't skied them yet, but they're 86mm w/a wood core)
2006 PE's (85mm underfoot now)

I'd be interested to ski the Outlaw w/out the plate. With the plate it just didn't do it for me.

I'm looking for a replacements ski this year. Also considering the Volkl Mantra. My everyday work ski has been the Blizzar 9.2 188s - damm awesome ski but they stopped making them after one year. After tswo years and close to 150 days, they won't make it through another season. I have read some reviews on other sites about the Mantra and several guys say they do it all - little softer tail than the explosive. My question, almost everyone is reviewing the 184s. I'm 6'2" 195 fast aggressive skier at Alta. Don't think 184s will hold in steeps, Anyone tried the 191s? Any deals out there?

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Originally Posted by Altoid Brad

I'm looking for a replacements ski this year. Also considering the Volkl Mantra. My everyday work ski has been the Blizzar 9.2 188s - damm awesome ski but they stopped making them after one year. After tswo years and close to 150 days, they won't make it through another season. I have read some reviews on other sites about the Mantra and several guys say they do it all - little softer tail than the explosive. My question, almost everyone is reviewing the 184s. I'm 6'2" 195 fast aggressive skier at Alta. Don't think 184s will hold in steeps, Anyone tried the 191s? Any deals out there?

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I'm 6ft 165lbs and just ordered a 191 (without a demo). At your size a 191 is a no brainer.

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Originally Posted by descender

Hmm.... so the Karma’s are a bit mediocre and boring?

I really want a skinner version of the Gotama. Same exact shape, consutrction, tail, flex, everything, but about 10-15mm thinner throughout. The Matra is close, but it may be more of an ass-kicker in the tail like the explosive is/was.

Any 85-90mm straight-ish, medium flex, wood core, semi-twin, all mountain skis out there?

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They aren't boring, but for what I needed them for they didn't really do much for me. For versatility I really like an everday ski that's a bit wider (something I found out after buying the Karma) and in the park I'd rather have something with more park specific flex (like a vicious or PE) for ollies/butters/pipe. So for me the Karma did everything ok but it nothing exceptionally well.

If I was you I would go with the Mantra (a bit wider than your range) for an all-mountain ski. It's super fun to ski and fits all the other things you are looking for.

I am so lame and indecisive -- each post changes my mind completely :confused: . Mantra... Karma.... Mantra again... o wait.... Karma.... then again.... but wait.... fack... I am gay. I guess whatever the last post recommends is what I will be riding on.

My impression of the Mantra was similar to what some people have said of the Karma, it was good everywhere but the Got is a better more fun pow ski and I thought there was too much crossover, and couldn't really think of many times where I would ski it over the Gotama. The Mantra did rip surprisingly well on firmer snow, but still would most likely use a narrower ski most of the time on hard snow.

I'm probably going to get the Stockli SS to complement the Gots, 89 waist and supposed to be good everywhere including hard snow, not much information out there about it though, so I'll probalby have to buy it based on what Stockli says and past experience with them. Was told it has a firmer tail though so might not qualify in your category.

From what I understand, you want a ski for those less than ideal days. The Mantra is not your ski. When conditions are shit at the Wood, you really want a ski for killing the groomers and for occasionally heading off piste. This is where a G4 like ski comes in. It has a great GS profile for railing the groomers at mach schnell speeds, but enough width to handle variable conditions off the beaten path without hooking up too easily. A Mantra is just a bit too wide. While I have plenty of fun pointing it down the Wall on my Gotamas, my G4s are much more suited for this. Every now and then you get off of 10 and the gaper hoard clears just long enough for you to make huge, fast gs turns down the Wall and Buckboard back to the base. Sentinel can be fun too.

Sure we'd all like to ski blower everyday, but sometime you take what you can get. For days like those, I really like my G4s.

I really see the Mantra as more of a one ski quiver. Can be skied in lots of different conditions and hold up well. But why buy only one, when you can have two that do it even better? :D

You are totally right Arty. Having the Gotama and Mantra is retarded, so retarded that it may be genius. Or, for an even more genius quiver I could go 190 and 183 Gotama, j/k, sorta.

G4s, Karmas, or the new Publics all make sense for what I am after. Maybe a total groomer/carver would be cool at some point down the road.

swapping the 186 LPs, intriguing. anybody laid dibs yet?

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Originally Posted by descender

186 Legend Pro: Absolute Tanks. However, I have decided that I don’t want to be in battle all the time (coming soon to ski swap)

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pussy :fmicon:

I will trade you the 186 LP's for AK Rockets(used 2 times) and Scream10's 186 (14din, rarely used and includes a 3rd stick). What kind of shape are the LP's in? Binders?

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Originally Posted by descender

I really want a skinner version of the Gotama. Same exact shape, consutrction, tail, flex, everything, but about 10-15mm thinner throughout.

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i was thinking this the other day as well, id love this ski.

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Originally Posted by seldon

pussy :fmicon:

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I know I know. I guess I am not as extremo as I should be. However my excuse is that I don't want the LP to terrorize for my brand new reconstructed ankle :biggrin:

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Originally Posted by flabango

I will trade you the 186 LP's for AK Rockets(used 2 times) and Scream10's 186 (14din, rarely used and includes a 3rd stick). What kind of shape are the LP's in? Binders?

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LPs are in as new shape with Look p14s. Not interested in trades. I will get pics and post to ski swap sometime before the snow falls.

Flabango: What size Rockets you looking to dump? Kind of searching for a replacement pair for the fiance. Let me know and I might be interested in taking them off your hands. Also I am in SLC so no shipping issues. Everyone else can return to their regularly scheduled quiver thread.

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Originally Posted by descender

I know I know. I guess I am not as extremo as I should be. However my excuse is that I don't want the LP to terrorize for my brand new reconstructed ankle :biggrin:

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<-- LPs == 1 ski quiver. i get my ass kicked after lunch, when i get tired, when i feel like slowing down. but hooooooly shit they're fun sometimes.

I have to cast a "no" vote on the Karma. It all comes down to what type of skier you are and what you want from the ski (duh), but the Karma doesn't do it for me. I'm about your same height and weight and since you're on a pair of 190 Gotamas I assume you can turn your boards.

I was looking for a G4 replacement and the Karma is NOT the ski. The 185 Karmas will scare the shit out of you in high speed crud situations. Since they are a full twin, the ski feels really short-I feel like I'm on a pair of snowblades. Unlike the G4, this ski has a speed limit, and it isn't that fast. High speed chop skiing is asshole puckering with the Karma, whereas the G4 feels bomber stable.

Just my $0.02.

I'd have a look at the Mantis 777 from Elan - They're 87 underfoot but still slay the groomers, are nice and damp, and have full-sidewall.

Maybe in a 184?

I agree. I've owned the 192 Elan M777 for 2 seasons and they're AWESOME. Explosiv-style construction, but more forgiving-like driving a cadillac. Ski wider than they are due to their softness and dampness, but their high lateral stifness makes them an awesome straightliner ski that still rails and is fast edge to edge. VERY stable landing too. Can't say enough about them. Unfortunately I'm selling mine this year for a sled and getting some Gotamas :( Still don't want to say goodbye to them, but I spend 120 days backcountry and 2 days resort. The G4s are also awesome, but more of a handful when you're tired.

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Originally Posted by addict

I spend 120 days backcountry and 2 days resort. The G4s are also awesome, but more of a handful when you're tired.

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120 days backcoutry? How the hell do you pull that off? Do you work as a guide or something?

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Originally Posted by descender

Hmm.... so the Karma’s are a bit mediocre and boring?

I really want a skinner version of the Gotama. Same exact shape, consutrction, tail, flex, everything, but about 10-15mm thinner throughout. The Matra is close, but it may be more of an ass-kicker in the tail like the explosive is/was.

Any 85-90mm straight-ish, medium flex, wood core, semi-twin, all mountain skis out there?

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going through old threads thinkin about skis this year, is the mojo 90 this ski, or closer than the karma is? this years PE?

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Originally Posted by Altoid Brad

My everyday work ski has been the Blizzar 9.2 188s - damm awesome ski but they stopped making them after one year.

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Blizzard Titan Nine - 188cm, 92 waist, heavier & stiffer than before - added a layer of metal and a beefier core this year - they run a limited quiver of molds so 181 has an 82 waist (weird)!!
Seriously, iM85...186cm...mmmm luscious....get 'em!!

becaseu someone mentioned the Elan M777, i though i'd copy/paste from my other post:

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Originally Posted by ncsears

in case you are sitll looking:

i've got about 20 days on the M777 184(?)

All at Alta, but during a bit of a dry spell last year (believe it or not). soft good playful snow, but we didn't get a big dumping. Just enough to keep things fresh.

I am 5'11" and weigh 165-170.

i am a strong fast skier, and when i don't like the terrain, I tend to speed up, sit back and blow through it rather than pick my way through.

the ski is a bit flexy (lest say low medium flex) and crushes the chopped powder. I mean you can rail turns in the bowls. this is certainly where the ski shines. High speed, off piste, chopped snow. not too much to say here, except it's very very fun to ski on.

the tail of the ski is long and it's pretty flat back there, so in the trees, it;s not great, but nothing a little work won't solve.

on piste, the ski works very well for being 84mm. At first, you willl feel that the ski doesn't hold an edge too well, but learn to apply a little more than usual pressure on the inside front edge and the ski will suddenly grab... even on hard pack. basically the sweet spot of the ski is not directly under foot, but a bit forward. this works very well off piste when there is alot of snow push around.

You certainly won't be pulling any super sharp and quick edge to edge turns though.

even at very very high speeds, the ski is stable. it has a bit of chatter up front, but adapt by edging a bit more and skiing off the balls of you feet and in will be great. if you are looking for a ski to rip off piste and then get you back to lift with no problem, this is a great choice. Certainly has no maximum speed like so many mid-fats. you can haul if you find the sweet spot.

of the skis i have recently been on, it's the best by far. (G3, Seth Pistols, M777)

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I have been skiing the 182 salomon scrambler..super versatile 88 under foot 118 up front..also have a Lab swallowtail and of course, Spats!