My favorite TGR alias of the past. Pretty insightful watch, Papa was more complex, and dark, than the womanizing drunk we all know. Well worth the watch.
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My favorite TGR alias of the past. Pretty insightful watch, Papa was more complex, and dark, than the womanizing drunk we all know. Well worth the watch.
+1. I’ve only watched the first one, and it sent down the rabbit hole. I got fascinated by the stuff about Paris, and I picked up The Sun Also Rises for some re-reading. I read it before I was 20, and it’s kind of interesting how time and experience affects my perspective on it.
That said, I knew he was a dick, and the first episode pretty much confirmed that. Poor Hadley.
Wait until you get to the end. He was a supreme dick, with a ton of head injuries. Amazing how fucked up he looked in his forties and early fifties. The double plane crash in Africa is quite the story. Got to read his own obituary. I'm assuming that was a closed casket service at the real end.
Is it online?
Salon did not seem to like it. An interesting write up nonetheless. I had no idea on some of this stuff.
https://www.salon.com/2021/04/11/ken...tist-politics/
I will watch it regardless. Hemingway, King and Twain were my first true “loves”.
That's an eye opening read. It's still worth watching, for sure. To tell you the truth, I really wish I didn't know everything I just learned about the man. Just the books and essays, please.
Burns fucked up with Baseball, so, my shit detector is always on when watching him. Country Music was pretty good, though.
Ted Williams was an asshole, but I still admire the guy. I can’t understand what was going on in their era so apart from mortal sins, I will focus on the good stuff.
Love reading Hemingway. No could tell a more interesting and gripping story of adventure. That is all I care about.
I put him in a very limited group of people who include Andy Warhol, George Plimpton, Bette Davis and certain Impressionistic painters. Just phenomenal
That guy makes some points, but all he cares about is politics and such. I strongly doubt he’d make a more balanced piece about Papa.Quote:
Originally Posted by SkiBall
Burns doesn’t get everything right, but I really like his pacing, production values, and styling. His stuff is fun to watch, and a lot of it is thought provoking. And he always seems to have great historical imagery and footage, so there’s that.
It is very strange to actually hear Hemingway talk. Not much, but, there's that.
This thread is clearly a coming out trap for Ernest himself.
He’s been keeping a low profile lately it seems.
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And at the end of the day, isn’t that really what is important? Zone out with some fun content.Quote:
Originally Posted by Meadow Skipper
Right? It’s tv, not a comprehensive seminar.Quote:
Originally Posted by SkiBall
Watch another comic book movie if you don’t want to think or be challenged. Ken burns is a talented mo’fo, in his own way, but his movies are boring Boomer spoon fed mush.Quote:
Originally Posted by SkiBall
Back in the womb to finish cooking for you. Don’t think so hard.Quote:
Originally Posted by muted reborn
What’s this? An angry millennial? Hey, when you’ve settled down a little, can you show me how to use AirDrop on my iPhone? And say hi to your mom for me.Quote:
Originally Posted by muted reborn
Watched the episodes and liked it. It’s good to see a more in-depth story than many others would tell and not a fluff piece. I’ve heard many of the stories before but I enjoyed the chronological order of it all and lining it all up with his romantic interests.
A kind of interesting short interview with Ken Burns about the documentary.
https://www.insidehook.com/article/a...-hemingway-pbs
And Burns seems to pretty much agree with my own POV that Hemingway’s crowning achievements are his short stories, rather than his novels and non-fiction.Quote:
I don’t think there is a final judgment that you can make. We live in a society that seems to think there is a big on and off switch; there is not. Hemingway is a hard man to get to know, a hard man to reject and also a hard man to accept. But his literary work stands on its own.
My Mom is too old for you, find someone yer own age.Quote:
Originally Posted by Meadow Skipper
Burns is a talented storyteller but visually he’s vanilla. He’s appealing to people who pays his bills: boomers who donate to PBS. He is a boring old school filmmaker.
If he’s making movies to ‘zone out to’, that is a red flag right there. Good long form documentaries should be challenging, especially PBS ones.
She wasn’t back when I knew her. I appreciated her experience. Ask her about that night after the concert.Quote:
Originally Posted by muted reborn
BTW, have you seen the show we’re talking about...or read any Hemingway?
Dang, I struck a nerve!Quote:
Originally Posted by Meadow Skipper
I was hesitant to rip on a show I haven’t seen but there is a zero percent chance Burns did anything different with Hemingway this late in his career.
Yes, I’ve read a lot of Hemingway although it’s been awhile. I’m a fan. So I’ll probably have to watch his show out of morbid curiosity.
Oh? How’s that?Quote:
Originally Posted by muted reborn
So, you have no idea what you’re going on about. Quelle surprendre. Should have paid attention when you were hesitant.Quote:
I was hesitant to rip on a show I haven’t seen but there is a zero percent chance Burns did anything different with Hemingway this late in his career.
I know exactly the type of movies Burns has made for the past 40 years. So do most people. I doubt I’m far off.Quote:
Originally Posted by Meadow Skipper
God, please let me be wrong...PLEASE. Let Burns do something different for once! That would be nice honestly.
^ You’re kind of a fucking idiot. Do us a favor and split, kook.
Oh, fuck off. I don’t like his style and would rather watch docs that are more unique and more creative. It’s subjective, no one is an idiot for having different taste. And you know that.Quote:
Originally Posted by Meadow Skipper
If all the money Burns got for films went instead to young and up and coming doc filmmakers the world would be a better place. Fuck Ken Burns. He ain’t awful, but he’s not what the world needs right now.
It’s TV. It’s for entertainment purposes, so I keep my expectations pretty limited. They regurgitate a lot of he same stuff, so something on Ernie is something I haven’t seen. Reading Hemingway was the good part.Quote:
Originally Posted by muted reborn
Dont feed the trolls y'all
Watched it with my parents ( in their 70s,) 3 nights in a row, It was on when I was visiting for the first time in over a year. my dad was insistent to watch it each night.
Thought it was good and i learned a lot, man was definitely a nracisistic misogynist and a great writer. The end was particularly bad for him as he descended into madness. Your boy at SLate has one particular view and the idea of Hemochrtosis is ludicrous a his liver would have shut down ( my buddy had it and needed a liver transplant at 43 and didnt drink near as much as Papa)
I think it was insightful but not the final or total word, much like i view much of Burns series, or any history I encounter honestly. Like the chronological nature as we as consumers and students ( most of us had at least some Hemingway in school) in the late 20th & early 21st century jump all lover with his major works. I did like the oft repeated message that he changed writing, at least in the US. there is definitely pre and post Hemingway in literature.
Imagine HST without Papa?!?
I watched Burns' Baseball a few years ago when I (kinda) got back into paying attention to baseball. Enjoyed it. Clearly a lot of material to cover, so I'm curious, what in your estimation was wrong and/or lacking with Baseball?Quote:
Originally Posted by Benny Profane
Been a while since I read it, but I recall particularly liking Hemingway's short story Cross Country Snow. Might have to track that collection down and give it another go.
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...nd%2C_1927.jpg
This collection might be better suited to the tough crowd here...
Men Without Women
Baseball was godfawful just for his choices of talking heads. I wanted to Elvis my TV set when Dolores Kearns Goodwin was there telling me how she used to go to Brooklyn Dodgers games with daddy for the fifth time. What the fuck? What did she have to do with anything? Christ, look behind the podium every summer at the HOF induction speech, and there's maybe thirty players who are the best of the best in the sport. Interview them, for gods sake, not her. Or, owners and even locker room managers who are still alive. So much history they could tell. But, we got Billy Crystal, Stephen Jay Gould, fucking George Will (who made this guy an expert on baseball?), and Arthur Ashe (um, wrong sport, Ken). Shit, I could have done a better interview. And there was too much black people got screwed (duh), and too little cocaine and rock and roll and speed and booze, which was seriously the day to day life for even top players for a few decades. Snooze fest.
Come to think of it, he could of found a better lineup of writers to interview for Hemingway. If Shelby Foote was still alive, he probably would have tapped him for the fifth time.
If you criticize Holy Burns on this site you most be a troll, an idiot, a kook, and also your mom is a slut too. Don’t you dare Benny. Some real doc historians on this site will set you straight.Quote:
Originally Posted by Benny Profane
https://www.tetongravity.com/forums/...ow-E-HemingwayQuote:
Originally Posted by fomofo
I just finished the third episode. Well, that was depressing. Sounds like he was a miserable sonofabitch the last 15 years or so, and he made a lot of other people miserable as well.
I hate it when someone that has done inspiring and/or admirable things - artists, athletes, leaders, etc. - turns out to be a raging asshole. I’d often rather that I don’t find that out. I know H was sick, but he was an asshole at the end.
Tell us how you really feel.Quote:
Originally Posted by Benny Profane
OK, I get it. A little too (ok, a lot too) PBS-y for ya. I do get that, but although it could have for some reason it didn't rub me that wrong way. I guess I just settled in and went along for the ride, and got completely swept away enjoying the baseball history.
Anyway, this might clean your craw out...
https://www.imdb.com/title/tt3445270
Damn good.
"There's nothing really can touch skiing, is there?" Nick said.Quote:
Originally Posted by Meadow Skipper
"The way it feels when you first drop off on a long run."
"Huh," said George. "It's too swell to talk about."
“...to know someone who thinks & feels with us, & who, though distant, is close to us in spirit, this makes the earth for us an inhabited garden.”
Cheers.
I have talked about this before. If I was rich, I'd start up an alternative Hall of Fame somewhere in upstate NY. I'd have to be rich, because I would need a legal staff to fend off the lawsuits. I was inspired after my first visit to Cooperstown, another snooze fest, although worth visiting for every fan. Mine would be a bar, of course. I would have a Hollywood model maker make a realistic Ted William's head encased in a clear container with fake dry ice smoke coming out of it, and make that the centerpiece of the bar. Maybe it would talk a little for ten bucks in a slot. Since my HOF would be near Saratoga, because I like Saratoga, a place that is 50-50 Yankee/Red Sox country, we'd have cage matches once a month between the more loyal fans of either. Of course there will be a cocaine wing, and a steroid wing. It would be fun, for sure.
Don’t forget to have a jar of greenies at the door for a buck a piece as you enter.
The further down the road I get, the less interest I have in seeing people bash each other's brains out. However I would gladly belly up to your bar and feed a ten in.Quote:
Originally Posted by Benny Profane
Perhaps to avoid legal entanglements you could just call your head "Shred Billiams" or some such, maybe give it a mustache.
I kept thinking this all the way through, werent there other writers he could of interviewed?Quote:
Originally Posted by Benny Profane
Just finished Ep3Quote:
Originally Posted by Meadow Skipper
I thought it was interesting- I knew nothing of the women in his life so that part was informative on its own
And Yep it was kinda depressing at the end. Mental illness is not pretty, esp. someone with a strong personality.
Reminded me of that thin line between genius and insanity...
The absurdity of Mario Vargas Llosa, a Nobel Prize winner, addressing the interviewer in Spanish, when he can speak fluent English, talking about one of the English language's most influential writers, and being super critical of Hemingway at times, was pretty much nuts. Why did that happen?Quote:
Originally Posted by Woodsy