Wheels that don't suck on non-dentist salary

So the E13 wheels that came on my bike are apparently made out of Play-Doh. More issues with those things in one season than in the past 20 years of riding combined. Any suggestion for something durable and somewhat affordable? I'm guessing that means I'm gonna have to go with heavy, guess that will make me stronger. 29, boost, xd, enduro type riding, mostly earning my descents, 210 lbs, lotta rock around here, I'm not exactly a finesse kinda rider. Also not too keen on stuffing pool noodles or other stuff besides Stan's sealant in there.
Hoping to score an end of season deal, seen some ok prices on Stan's and Crank Bros, not sure what else I should be looking at. Could go with a DH wheelset if it's not overkill. Am I crazy to even consider budget no-name carbon, even with a warranty? Kinda like the idea of my wheels staying round, but obviously don't want to risk having them disintegrate.

Is there anything wrong with the hubs on your E13 wheels? Maybe just relace those wheels with a nice rim.

The I9 S series wheels seem pretty hard to beat right now. $750 for a set with 101 hubs, $975 with Hydra hubs.

Been riding light bikes carbon wheels for about 4 years now. No problems, their new asymmetric AM wheels have been really good. They have Hope hubs which are fucking loud but other than that totally satisfied. I ride primarily in the Bay Area and Tahoe. I am 6'2" and 225 lbs and ride about 30-60 dirt miles a week, April to November.

In addition to toast’s question about the hubs -

How wide of tires are you typically running?
What’s your budget?

I wouldn’t be afraid of carbon on SLT glaciated/worn granite rolls and stuff, more concerned in areas with loose flying rocks that can come back around and impact the inner side of the rim. Like Xmas valley but with even bigger sharper rocks getting kicked loose. Or just plain jagged stuff sticking out of the ground. You regularly riding anywhere like that?

You can get heavier carbon layups suited for your weight no problem. It ends up the same or heavier than an Aluminum rim but with much better damping, vertical compliance, lateral stiffness than aluminum. The pint of carbon IMO isn’t weight savings, it’s the feel and response of the wheel, and also generally more durable than aluminum, save for my two types of concerns listed above. Don’t leave the rims outside in the sun, acid rain, or snow and they won’t disintegrate on you.

Also, see Seth’s post on the I9 Backcountry 360. If you run 2.6 front back I don’t know if you can get a better wheelset for the money. 36mm IW should give you pretty decent midsummer grip if you are on 2.6’s.

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Originally Posted by Redsmurfer

Been riding light bikes carbon wheels for about 4 years now. No problems, their new asymmetric AM wheels have been really good. They have Hope hubs which are fucking loud but other than that totally satisfied. I ride primarily in the Bay Area and Tahoe. I am 6'2" and 225 lbs and ride about 30-60 dirt miles a week, April to November.

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What did these cost ya? I emailed Light Bike for a quote for the same build and haven't head back yet. Did they take months to get?

If the OP wants to go budget - Colorado Cyclist and Pro Wheel Builder will lace up Hope hubs to a nice alloy rim, taped with valves shipped to you for under $600.

I got a set of Hope hubs with Race Face Arc rims for $550 shipped a couple seasons ago. Still rolling perfectly after 2 seasons of use.

Can't remember exactly the cost but was around $850 without shipping, the first set was in the $700's I believe. I have had only good customer relations with them so far, their spelling sucks in emails but hey what do you expect. Maybe chock this up to another small way Trump has fucked us all.

He asks for non-dentist wheels and you fuckers recommend i9 and carbon? Jesus.

At least you guys could recommend the sweet USED i9 wheelset poster right now on this forum.
FS: Industry Nine Backcountry 360 - $700 shipped obo https://www.tetongravity.com/forums/...d.php?t=330211

Troll EBay for something like a DT Swiss M1700. Can sometimes find for about $400.

Or, like Toast said, repurpose the hubs if they’re holding up. DT Swiss EX 471, Stan’s Flow, Spank Spike Race 33. Budget $300 for rims, spokes & labor.
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Hey, if you get the non-dentist carbon rim with the correct layup, cross section profile, and decent hubs, and it works for your terrain (no jagged and/or flying rocks) that might actually be less costly over the long haul than constantly relacing soft Al rims that flat-out or require rebending so often that you can’t get a good deal.

EX 511 rear, XM 481 front. Or 511s front and back if you ding your front rim a lot. 350s or your current hubs if you like them and don't think you'll be able to sell your current wheelset.

Buy parts, borrow a jig and build them yourself, seriously it's not hard. Built mine for €400 total and would do the same again.

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Originally Posted by SchralphMacchio

Hey, if you get the non-dentist carbon rim with the correct layup, cross section profile, and decent hubs, and it works for your terrain (no jagged and/or flying rocks) that might actually be less costly over the long haul than constantly relacing soft Al rims that flat-out or require rebending so often that you can’t get a good deal.

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The big "IF" is if you read the OP comment on 210 lbs, rocky, and rides like a hack.

So yeah, aluminum rims from Dtswiss, Mavic, Stans etc plus some straight gauge spokes would apply. If you whack them you can bend back bead edge. If you taco them you replace with another cheap rim and tension. I'm on that program and it is most cost effective for us hack enduro racers.

Hubs are ok, I've never built a wheel, but figure it can't be too hard to lace it myself and bring it into a shop to make sure it's properly tensioned. Schralph, I mostly ride North Tahoe/Truckee/Dville, so ain't nothing smooth here, and I'm a smasher. Run 2.35-2.5, so looking for something around 30mm. Also, not sure I'll be able to get another ride out of my rim, and probably only have another 4-6 weeks of riding, so looking for something that can get here fast. Will look into some of the above suggestions.

non-dentist budget is a (ahem) broad range.
We Are One has their amazeballs Agent rim in the Movement wheels laced to I9 hubs for $999. With lifetime no questions smash the hell out of them replacement warranty. I bought for the warranty peace of mind. I've been on Agent rims all this yearand I've not even re-tensioned them yet. 10/10.

I also have Light Bicycle AM rims with hd layup. Bombproof for a few years now. I'd buy again in a heartbeat.

Neither option are 'cheap' but worth the cost, IMO.

edit: see here - https://www.weareonecomposites.com/s...t-wheelset-518

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Originally Posted by mmmm...pow!

Hubs are ok, I've never built a wheel, but figure it can't be too hard to lace it myself and bring it into a shop to make sure it's properly tensioned.

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Maybe not a great time for a project experiment if you're trying to eek out last bit of the season! See if your shop has time for a quick re-lace build before ordering new rims! Also check to see if they have plenty of spokes and nipples in stock in case any of yours are no bueno and/or your new rim profile has a symmetric or asymetric, or significantly lower height profile different from the current rims (I don't know shit about e13 rims).

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Originally Posted by mmmm...pow!

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North Tahoe/Truckee/Dville, so ain't nothing smooth here, and I'm a smasher. Run 2.35-2.5, so looking for something around 30mm.

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Yeah I couldn't remember north or south. Definitely way more chunder on the norf side of the lake. See my above thoughts re: plastic vs Al. rims. I'm light enough I could run plastic at Dville's outerlying trails but I don't think I'd recommend it for a Clyde, lots of loose crap on Pauley and lots of "sticking out angled right at you" shit on other trails that might crack a carbon rim with an improperly pressured/placed tire in that area.

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Originally Posted by LC

Buy parts, borrow a jig and build them yourself, seriously it's not hard. Built mine for €400 total and would do the same again.

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This. 210 lbs + rocky trails + lack of finesse = buy a truing stand and a tensionmeter. Building wheels isn't rocket science. Once you've done a couple, you can bang them out in 45 minutes or so. Assuming your hubs are good, you'll invest ~$100 on spokes (for 2 wheels), and another ~$100 per rim (for a nice aluminum). Once you have the truing stand and tensionmeter, you can throw a fresh rim on (reusing spokes) in less than a half hour, for the price of the rim.

All of that applies to carbon rims too - the rims just cost more. But carbon wheels are even easier to build, so the process is a bit quicker.

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Originally Posted by adrenalated

The I9 S series wheels seem pretty hard to beat right now. $750 for a set with 101 hubs, $975 with Hydra hubs.

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Noodles

And I'm an i9 fan generally speaking



Rather than look for something specific, I'd just look for used wheels. There is no one right answer. I live where you do. I've become a fan of aluminum rims.

How are you damaging the rim?

Assuming you are just nocking them out of true at 210 pounds for a 30mm inner rim the DT EX511's are the best alloy rim available. You may be able to get away with a 481 in the front if you are worried about weight but it weighs less for a reason. The second Best option would be DT's cheaper rim the E532.

If its dents they you either need to get beefier tires or deal with pool noodles. Try some Double Down Maxxis tires.

Don't get shitty hubs.

I have 3 bikes that I ride back to back all the time. One with expensive Carbon rims, one with Stan's Al, and my road bike has Rol Race SL, (Al). Also I switched from Stan's Al to Carbon on that one mountain bike so I remember the difference. I think the hubs matter the most, then followed by feel and weight issues, but no matter what, I like Sapim Bladed CX spokes. If the rim weights are similar, they ride different, not necessarily better. I think the OP should find some used wheels as others have suggested, or build some up. I did a set, and I liked the experience.

Definitely following this thread. The DB Blanchard wheels on the wife's bike could definitely stand to be upgraded. She'd appreciate losing 1-2 lbs of rotating weight muy mucho.

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Originally Posted by toast2266

This. 210 lbs + rocky trails + lack of finesse = buy a truing stand and a tensionmeter. Building wheels isn't rocket science. Once you've done a couple, you can bang them out in 45 minutes or so. Assuming your hubs are good, you'll invest ~$100 on spokes (for 2 wheels), and another ~$100 per rim (for a nice aluminum). Once you have the truing stand and tensionmeter, you can throw a fresh rim on (reusing spokes) in less than a half hour, for the price of the rim.

All of that applies to carbon rims too - the rims just cost more. But carbon wheels are even easier to build, so the process is a bit quicker.

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First, I agree with all of this. Second, what kind of rims are on your E13 wheels - what model do you have? Sometimes factory wheels are just tensioned for shit and need to be loosened up and rebuilt - after which they are stronger and stiffer. You could also look at using beefier spokes and reusing the same rims. Do the current wheels have aluminum nipples? If so you could move to brass.

I like toast's suggestion of just rebuilding the wheels, maybe using new rims.

If you do, buy Jobst Brandt's book on wheelbuilding. Excellent. I don't use a tensionometer, but that is certainly a good idea.

1. Take the wheels to your LBS and ask them to buy rims/spokes/nipples and rebuild them for you. You’ll still come out of it for <$400
2. Find a good deal on rims and buy them, then trust the manufacturers ERD and buy spokes from DansComp or BikeHubStore. Take to LBS and ask them to build up for you. Save a few bucks vs #1
3. Buy Roger Musson's eBook for $12 https://www.wheelpro.co.uk/wheelbuilding/book.php build a stand out of scraps and hardware store parts for $30, and get a tension meter for $70. Buy rims and spokes as in #2 (or wait to get the rims, then figure out ERD on your own, as Musson suggests). Same price as #1, but you invest in yourself. Budget 5-10 hours your first time. Improvement with each wheel.
4. Better yet, borrow a truing stand and tension meter and follow #3. Shave some time off #3. A nice stand really is time efficient. Though a tension meter can make an OCD person waaaay more obsessive.
Note: don't try lacing a new rim with the old spokes unles it's the exact same model of rim. The ERD will almost guaranteed be different and you'll just be wasting time.
Note: I doubt the LBS will want you to try lacing it up first and then asking them to finish the job. Lacing is the quick/easy part of wheelbuilding. LBS will cringe when you give it to them saying you figured it'd "help" while they wonder if you fucked up the lacing, picking the spoke lengths or added threadlock. And they'll cringe again when you ask for a discount on wheelbuilding because you already did "most of the work"
Note: Seriously, Musson's book should be called "The Idiot's Guide To Wheelbuilding"! He debunks the old idea that wheelbuilding is an art. Get the lacing right, get the dish right, don't let the spokes wind up, and balance spoke tension. Bob's Your Uncle. Nothing in home wrenching will leave you feeling so accomplished. It's addictive.

Realiable and affordable = DT Swiss. XM481 or EX511

Hope hubs or DT Swiss 350

I just had an XM481 built by Colorado Cyclist and they were quick and easy to deal with.

I went the chinese carbon route a couple years ago and broke my rear rim. Went back to aluminum and really don't notice much difference.

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Originally Posted by funkendrenchman

R
I went the chinese carbon route a couple years ago and broke my rear rim. Went back to aluminum and really don't notice much difference.

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From mine and my friends experiences: You fix carbon rims/wheels when you have to. You fix alloy rims/wheels when you decide to or finally get around to it. Carbon breaks, alloy bends.
I've got a buddy who absolutely hammers on gear and got a set of those e13 wheels on his YT DH bike. By the end of the season the rear rim looked like fusilli pasta, but he used the OG ghetto tubeless technique of a split 24" tube and it held for the last month of riding. Even broke 2 spokes the last weekend, but the thing kept turning and the tire kept rolling. We'll replace the rim sometime this winter when it's convenient.

Again defining budget would help here.

The Hunt Trail Wide look to be pretty quality for the money and reviews are great. https://www.huntbikewheels.cc/produc...16900586963042

Also make an Enduro Wide if you need something more, you know, enduro....

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Jesus, $400 shipped from UK for a hand built DH wheelset?
Please someone buy these and report back to us.

^^^ Right?!? They’re on my radar for sure for next year.


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I keep reading about Hunt when the affordable wheel topic comes up. seem like a good option.

From a low budget $560/pr for burly aluminum with the house brand hub to $800 with Hydras to 1350+ for carbon these guys have it going on https://www.dirtcomponents.com/29-36-1mm-rc-1 Everything is hand built to order, 100+ color choices for graphics on the carbons. Use the code TH10 for 10% off everything they've got.

Ibis S35 Aluminum wheels are $500 shipped, uses Ibis Logo hubs.

Pretty hard to beat that price for a reputable made 35mm IW brand new wheelset. But the rims are so new I haven’t seen much in durability feedback or ride reports.

Light Bike quoted me Hope hubs laced to 29 mm carbon rims for $880 shipped........tempting......

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Originally Posted by SchralphMacchio

Ibis S35 Aluminum wheels are $500 shipped, uses Ibis Logo hubs.

Pretty hard to beat that price for a reputable made 35mm IW brand new wheelset. But the rims are so new I haven’t seen much in durability feedback or ride reports.

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Goddam clown-sized wheels. :mad: :D

Hey, for moon dust midsummer conditions in Tahoe, if you can’t cram a plus tire in your frame/fork then at least you can run 2.35-2.6” tires on that rim and have a higher traction setup than on a 23-28mm IW rim, at least according to teh Interwebz experts and bike industry marketing materials!

For me, I’m building a hardtail that can handle up to 29 x 2.6 in the rear so I wanted 35 IW to run higher volume / lower pressure and take some bite off my ass. I was one click away from buying those Ibis S35s as a wheelset but I found a ridiculous deal on Velomine.com for 35 IW Fratelli rims laced with DT Swiss spokes & nipples to SRAM 900 Boost hubs for $335 shipped. Even if the Fratelli rim falls apart (which it won’t because I now live in Western Oregon and I weigh about as much as a pile of wet leaves) I’ll be able to relace to Ibis S35 rims or what not down the line, but have hubs with tighter engagement than the Ibis Logos. Can also rebuild those as 27+ down the line if I ever get baby fat bi-curious.

Score!

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Originally Posted by SchralphMacchio

Hey, for moon dust midsummer conditions in Tahoe, if you can’t cram a plus tire in your frame/fork then at least you can run 2.35-2.6” tires on that rim and have a higher traction setup than on a 23-28mm IW rim, at least according to teh Interwebz experts and bike industry marketing materials!

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Or, you know... you could just put a Wild Rock'R2 on a normal width rim on the damn bike. :tongue:

That too, sure.

But then you rule out the possibility of ever getting it on with a chubby girl, and you know how they are in the sack ...

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Originally Posted by SchralphMacchio

That too, sure.

But then you rule out the possibility of ever getting it on with a chubby girl, and you know how they are in the sack ...

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No.

No I don't.

FTS.

The wheel hasn't been round since a few rides in, so I'm just gonna do some more hammering and bending and try to get it to hold air for the next few weeks. I like the idea of building up my own wheels, but hoping I can put it off until winter. This kinda gives me an idea of what to look for. Thanks y'all.

I wasn't particularly impressed with the E13 hubs that came on my Sentinel. I sold the complete wheelset pronto, to someone who was only going to use them as backups. I thought they were very draggy, even after fresh lube, not to mention noisy as fuck. Back on DT 350s and happy now.

I've also noticed that my 2 carbon wheelsets (LB, We Are One) need a lot less frequent truing than any alloy wheelsets I've had.

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Originally Posted by Andeh

<snip>
I've also noticed that my 2 carbon wheelsets (LB, We Are One) need a lot less frequent truing than any alloy wheelsets I've had.

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This was one of the things that amazed me about the carbon wheels I've run. Even with *multiple* broken spokes, those damn things stay true. Black magic, I tell ya...