This guy. I really enjoy the ramp angle on my ft 12s mounted on my viciks. Maybe I am a total hack and need the ramp to keep me forward, whatever's it is I actually enjoyed skiing them all say in bounds on soft bumps.
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This guy. I really enjoy the ramp angle on my ft 12s mounted on my viciks. Maybe I am a total hack and need the ramp to keep me forward, whatever's it is I actually enjoyed skiing them all say in bounds on soft bumps.
I have no problem adapting to it.
Yes, I do.
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I don't even notice it.
Edited to add that I thought I didn't notice it, turns out I do.
Adding 6mm under my radical toe is the best thing I ever did!
actually a high ramp angle will put you in the back seat.your tibia shill be inclined forward, so in order to maintain the balance over the middle of your foot, you will need to stick your butt out.
Try skiing a few laps with the dynafits, then switch to an alpine binding, and you will notice that you will be way in the back seat for a few turns. Thats because your body remembers the butt out position.
I try to match the ramp angle and the forward lean of the
Boots between my alpine and my bc setups.
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Subjective issue. Go with what works for ya. Speed Classic (my favorite touring binding) with 3mm shim is just right for me. Comfort and Vertical ramp angle is too much so I use a thicker (6mm-9mm) toe shim for those. I hear the Radical is a bit less than Comfort/Vert but more than Speed Classic so I would likely shim the toe on Radicals. FTR I have a big (30MP) boot.
Not a fan - too much angle makes the tails wash out.
But it's a godsend in another way - I have worn cartilage in my patellofemoral joint which hurts like a bitch on my alpine setup which has a more upright alignment. But when on my Dynafits the angle puts me out of the pain 'hot spot' so even though I ski like shit on them, it doesn't hurt.
Hate it. Switched from fks to ft12 on one ski and it totally transformed it for the worse, to the point that I hated using that setup afterwards. Constantly having to ski in the back seat to compensate.
Maybe I'm just not sensitive to these things but I never really notice.
Interesting. So I do have a problem with my hips back on my alpine setup maybe the ramp makes my poor position feel natural??? I messed with trying to keep my hips forward more last week but it caused me to not be able to absorb bumps with my knees. It's real counter intuitive for me, the athletic position for squats is hips back and natural arch in the back.
Doesn't bother me, but I wouldn't say I "love it." I switch back and forth between Dukes, STH's, Comforts and Plum Guides and seem to ski OK on any of them. Radical ST/FT have a 17mm ramp (same as Vertical/Comfort), Speed Radical has 15mm (same as Plum Guide), Speed Superlight is 3mm.
I tour for pow, so I'm generally only skiing Dynafits in soft conditions, and I don't notice ramp angle much then.
I haven't tried measuring, but: are the tech fittings mounted in the boots such that they compensate some for the binding's ramp angle? In other words, when a Dynafit-compatible boot is clicked into a Dynafit binding, is the sole of the boot elevated the same height for toe + heel?
Don't like it. It really fucked me up when I first tried it and put me on the crapper to compensate. I run shims under the toes and they feel much better, easier to pressure the tips and also to remain neutral in softer snow.
I don't notice a difference moving between Radicals and alpine bindings (Tyrolia or Look PX) - I did ski the dukes for a season (with alpine boots), and hated them. I felt like they put me in the back seat all the time.
YMMV.
That's a really good question, and I haven't figured out how to accurately measure this without cutting the boot in half. Ramp measurements for tech bindings are usually given as center of heel pins to ski deck/center of toe pins to ski deck, but I'm sure there's a variation in interior sole/zeppa angle and tech fitting placement. The thickness of the Vulcan/Mercury/One soles look normal, but standing around in them the heel feels low compared to other tech compatible boots. Anyone have any data on this?Quote:
Originally Posted by El Chupacabra
Wildsnow commented something similar in one of their Mecury/Vulcan write-ups, figuring that was intentional to partly counteract most Dynafit bindings' ramp.Quote:
Originally Posted by gregL
Personally I ski Bodacious in alpine and Plum bindings, and shim the toes with Sollyfit plates to bring the net ramp more or less in line with my alpine setups.
^^^ I think that i might try a shim undertoe, as I felt a bit in the backseat on my set-up with Plums + RS vs. STH + alpine boot.
when i finally admonished myself : "HANDS FORWARD, BITCH!!!" turns became much easier.
Me no likey. But the things tour so damn well I sure ain't going back to my old silvrettas. Part of my adjustment has been skiing my boots in walk mode! Suppose I'll get with the program & shim the toes.
made some shims for the toes. much better.
Just got some radical fts and had the first day on them yesterday. Definitely felt the ramp compared to my fks, and wasn't a fan. Less of an issue on steeper terrain, but anything more mellow and it felt awkward. How much are people shimming the toes, and with what?
What is the “alpine binding” delta that so many posters mention? I have measured a wide range of deltas on alpine downhill bindings, even from the same company, and even on models that share the same toe and heel pieces.
Delta also varies widely across different Tech bindings, and even Dynafit bindings run a wide range (~15mm).
On my own setups, to achieve nearly zero delta, I have to shim all of my alpine downhill bindings, although some of the shims are trivial (once again, depending on the model).
For Tech bindings, the race and near-race bindings have almost no delta since the heel units don’t have to accommodate a brake. The Comfort, Vertical, and Radical designs all have much more delta, and their heel units are also all designed around a brake (although the Speed Radical is brakeless). Although those designs also add a toe shim, it’s not thick enough to fully offset the additional delta from the higher heel unit. Given the wide range in Dynafit delta, I doubt that they started increasing the heel unit stand height more in order to compensate (and if so, in a flawed manner) for some supposed tendency in AT boot geometries.
But anyway, adding a custom LDPE shim (from SmallParts.com) is pretty easy, although you have to scrounge around a bit for the correct longer screws (Slidewright.com is very helpful for that), and you’ll have to increase the post height on your ski crampons to maintain the snow penetration.
I prefer it to duke/baron/tour - which I feel forces me to focus too much on pushing the knees forward/getting the weight forward in order to get the ski tips to hold the edge. With the dynafit I can ski relaxed with a slightly lower stance than what I use when casually skiing my race (sl/GS) equipment - which suits me fine as the surface isn't as even, and the speed is probably half of what I have in a GS race. Also my rando shoes collaps/deform if I push them too hard...
The important thing is that I don't need to to use the back of my boots for support.
Skied them again today and they felt better. I think I'll need a few days to adjust to them. Though I do wonder how my alpine setup will feel when I go back
I'm glad people are talking about this. I'll be new to a Dynafit setup in a week or so, I'm really trying to figure out how or if I'll need to fuck around with shims to achieve the same ramp angle as my FKS. I never thought about how the tech insert placement on a boot will affect things either. Once I get my Mercury/ST12 setup, I'm really wondering what the ramp difference will be between each.
I had the same experience. Currently, I run a 7mm toe shim under my TLT Speed Classic toes with Titan boots.Quote:
Originally Posted by D(C)
Really didn't like it with the original TLT-5P forward lean... shimmed my toe piece significantly to compensate. Curious for those who have made their own shims: do you just use it as a spacer, or mount the shim to ski and binding to shim? I shimmed my speed radical toe piece to try and replicate the ramp of the Sportiva RT bindings I started with on my Hi-5s, which had about 4mm difference between toe and heel pins (light and adjustable bindings... until they break; and they all break). I was concerned that the loads on the long screws would be too large with this thickness shim, opting instead to mount the shim to the ski with a different hole pattern, then mounting the binding into the shim. This also requires the use of UHMW plastic, as I don't think LDPE is robust enough to be mounted to directly. So while they're damn secure, it does add a touch of extra weight. Are lots of people successfully using thick-ish shims with long screws? I figured an extra two ounces of hardware was reasonable to guarantee the binding won't rip out in a no-fall zone, but perhaps I'm just over-engineering in paranoid fashion...
Shim is usually just a spacer with longer screws running through clearance holes in the shim. B&D do a 6.25mm shim set with suitably longer screws which can also be ordered separately. For thicker shims/longer screws the easiest thing to do is use BF/QK inserts using the M5 machine screws which are readily available in any length.Quote:
Originally Posted by andybrnr
The toe pincers, or some other part?Quote:
Originally Posted by andybrnr
(Kind of a moot point since Sportiva has stopped rebranding the ATK RT ... although if the reason was breakage, then I'm really confused as to why Sportiva continues to rebrand almost exactly the same toe in the form of the RSR?)
On which Dynafit model are you trying to replicated the RT 2mm delta?Quote:
Originally Posted by andybrnr
With the Speed at 13mm and the Vertical ST/FT at 17mm, that is indeed a mighty thick shim!
(More numbers at the 4th & 5th tabs of the spreadsheet linked from the beginning of the fourth paragraph here: http://avycourse.blogspot.com/2010/0...uirements.html)
The thickest I've ever used is 6.35mm (i.e., 1/4" LDPE from SmallParts.com).
I have seen even longer screws used for OEM alpine downhill binding shim direct mounts, but I've wondering about those too.
And I agree that LDPE seems like a poor choice for two-part mounting.
Jonathan,
Toe pin failure. The two pairs I had both failed this way, and I believe Silas's RTs failed this way, as well. Not sure about the manufacturing process, but it looked like some form of stamping was used to create the flange on the back of the pins that "secures" (hah) them in the toe piece wings. In both of my cases, the flange deformed or cracked over time, allowing the pin to begin wiggling and further fatigue/deform the flange. After the second pair, I got my money back and remounted with Dynafit speed radicals. Bought a chunk of 3/8" (9.5mm) thick black Delrin from TAP plastics, jigsawed out two rounded rectangles a bit larger than the speed radical toe, and then did the two part mount. Delrin has excellent dimensional stability vs temp and generally good mechanical properties; so far I've had no problems. Added weight is about 2oz per ski.
I'm curious if there is a similar history of failures with the ATK toe pieces in the Euro market... tried to research it but didn't find anything, perhaps if I googled in French or German I'd have better luck. The weird thing is that the toe wings themselves seemed fine... merely the mechanical retention of the steel toe pin within the Al part. This seems like a very fixable manufacturing bug, but no such luck. Either they had a bad batch of steel that made it into a lot of the parts that were imported to the US, or they failed the materials science game.
Yes, that is my recollection of how Sir Si's RT failed. And now I realize that you told me about your RT failure in the Hyak parking lot! (Hard to keep straight TGR user names, email addresses, and actual real world people...)
Interesting that ATK is kind of upping the ante on the RT with the new Raider 12 version this season:
http://www.atkrace.it/raider-12.html
Delrin seems like it would be a good material, based on its use in the Plum heel units.
I vaguely recall that custom two-part mount setups were popular among tele skiers back when their direct-mounted bindings were always ripping out of skis. I can't remember what kind of plastic they used, although then again, following their lead on something like that probably wouldn't be all that wise in general...
(... with apologies for thread poaching ...) I'll be on my second year with ATK and wondered if you have any advice for preventing or avoiding the toe pin failure. I'd also sure appreciate any advice for how to attach safety straps to the ATK/LaSportiva bindings. FWIW, I'm 150 lbs and using these with Movement Bond-Xs, which I think is a fantastic lightweight (< 6 lbs) setup for routine backcountry and hut trips. I'm using them with TLT5's and will not use them for anything heavy-duty.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jonathan S.
The safety strap issue is really a big deal. I'm afraid of putting something through the hole in the end of the lever (too much torque on the thin lever), but I really don't see anywhere else to attach a cable. I looked one farther back, but it can slip off. These can be tricky to get on and I already had one ski take and unaccompanied trip down a glacier - luckily it caught air off a bump and speared into the snow only a few hundred feet down.
I have the same concern so I use these, screwed into the ski one inch or so in front of the toe fixture.Quote:
Originally Posted by johngfc
http://framewareinc.com/store/media/...file_15_14.jpg
Cross your fingers? I dunno, I did ski the resort a fair bit with them, but no big drops and I think I only ejected twice over the lifespan of the bindings. Silas is not particularly rough on his gear, and if they let go for him, I think they'd let go on anybody... again, I wouldn't be hugely surprised if this turned out to be a bad batch of toe pins that made it into the supply chain, but the lack of official communication is unfortunate. I remember a Wildsnow thread where Colin Lantz, the manager for Sportiva's ski line, said returns had not been above normal in response to someone else's complaint of toe pin failure, but they pulled the RTs out of their product offerings for some reason...
Thanks - I'll try the D-ring. I considered this, but worried that it wouldn't be strong enough in the event of a fall and would pull out. On second thought, maybe that takes care of the need for a safety link. I have ATKs that I got from Telemark Pyrenees (i.e. European version) so if it's a bad batch issue maybe I've dodged the bullet.
Note that I use B&D coil leashes so if I lose a ski the energy is dissipated a bunch before the D-ring screw is loaded.
I seem to recall seeing Silas's bad ATK toe. Was it a jiggly toe pincer, not a broken wing?
Angle Threw me off. I used shims and problem solved. Alternatively sollyfit/ dynalook toe piece is burley works very well.
Yah, jiggly toe pincer, which is the only failure mode I've seen on all the broken ones.Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Steve
A few years ago, after switching from Fritchis to Dynafits, I welcomed the ramp angle compared to the heel -low feeling of the Fritchi. I have no problem going from a Look binding to my Dynafits. I have had FT12's and Radical FTs, which I believe have some of the higher ramp angles.
For people who have always shimmed, do you believe mounting at the higher stack height with longer screws has caused increased stress in the toe piece that could or has manifested itself as slop or breakage? There is recent discussion of this in a Wildsnow thread about the B&D shims (Andybrnr I believe you may have posted your concerns there as well). One guy comments that his toe piece ended up basically spinning, which he believed was the result of additional leverage caused by the shim.
http://www.wildsnow.com/11304/instal...speed-radical/
http://www.bndskigear.com/dynafitcustom.html
Longer screws mounted through a shim put more leverage on the screw-ski interface and there is an extra place for a little slop. Then once a screw gets a bit loose, the interface will go to pieces quickly.
AFAIK, the Superloop telemark binding with long screws that went through a 10mm riser had problems and pull-outs once people started using big plastic boots on it (this is before my time but I can see how it would happen). The cure is to use a double mount, binding to riser, riser to ski.
People on telemarktips used cutting board material for that, which is usually LDPE, and would probably work fine. If you were worried about failure of the screw threads in the LDPE, you could always T-nut it and use machine screws. This is a bit harder to do with a thin shim. For that you might use HDPE or UHMW from a plastics shop.