used beacon: yay or nay

I am new to the backcountry and look forward to getting out there for the first time this season and am in the process of getting of all my safety gear and trying to get into the on snow class through friends of berthoud pass. Went to their meeting last week and when discussing beacons, they mentioned do not purchase a used beacon. Are they saying this simply to cover their ass as a liability or are their legitimate concerns with a beacon that is a year or two old? And before you ask, no my life is not worth saving a hundred bucks.

i wouldn't have a problem with a used beacon
but i'd probably do a local purchase where i could test it out

Google avalanche+beacon+frequency+drift

Basically, older or beat/thrashed beacons may suffer from frequency drift and should be checked out. There's information on how to check beacons in some of the articles you'll find in that Google search.

Assuming you're not getting one of the older 2.275 kHz beacons or a newer one that hasn't had the most current software update. <- pass on those.

one or 2 or 3 or 4 year old Pieps is top of the line, state of the art. I bought one on ebay for less than 70bux last summer. It was "new" only used for testing.

Get training and read and practice a lot.

I had an older tranceiver slide off the hood of my truck to concrete. I used it for the rest of the year. When I got a newer model, I disassembled my older unit (it was the old US frequency) and was shocked to see the ceramic core of an antennae which was wrapped in copper wire was fractured. The unit still seemed to work, and externally looked fine.

The problem with used gear is that you do not know its history. I would place used tranceivers in the same category as used motocross helmets. many knowledgeable people say used helmets should be viewed as junk. Is your life worth the $100+ you will save buying used safety gear with an unknown history? I've got a bunch of used climbing gear in pretty new condition which I will gladly sell for 50% of retail. PM for details

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jethro

I would place used tranceivers in the same category as used motocross helmets. many knowledgeable people say used helmets should be viewed as junk. Is your life worth the $100+ you will save buying used safety gear with an unknown history?

---

5/5 on that idea, Jethro.

Although I guess I should add that many ppl are techies that love to have the latest and greatest, and so they often trade up perfectly good gear for newer gear.

So if you don't actually know the history of the transceiver, make sure you can have it tested BEFORE you buy, as part of the deal. If there is a climbing club near you, you might have someone there to test it against their gear. Or get in touch with a backcountry ranger to see if they know anybody that might test it gratis. They are usually pretty good about this, as they would rather have ppl out there with known-to-be-working gear rather than sketchy gear. Also, many mountain towns have a BC/remote rescue division as part of their Fire/Rescue corps...see if they can test the unit for you. Same idea as the backcountry USFS ranger.

These folks write enough fatality notices, they are usually very helpful in order to write one less.

I wouldn't buy and then start using it without testing, though.

Good luck.

ortovox certainly will do a full overhaul of their beacons - others may do the same. this involves sending it away and paying some money so may not be ideal if you want to get started now. however, if you can get a beacon for cheap and it is still a good deal once you have paid for the overhaul, i'd be more than happy with that

as others have said, you don't know the history so i'd be wary of buying without testing or at least having the knowledge that the seller is cool and will refund you if you aren't happy with it in any way

Alternative point: for some folks used is all they can or want to budget for. I recently sold a couple lightly used units here giving the buyers the option to test and return if they were unhappy with them for any reason. They got good units and saved some money. Everyone is happy.

What can people do to beacons to render them so dangerous? Worrying about a used beacon seems silly, if you find a deal and its a current model or recently discontinued, enjoy it. It's not like it's a climbing rope someone left hanging from a tree all winter.

:wink:...Word to the wise,...Never use old bacon when in the back country!..:nonono2: Make sure it is fresh...:biggrin: Many Avi dogs will actually run away from the scent of old bacon, leaving you to rot with it....:eek: So, fry it fresh each day, it's the safe way to go...:rolleyes2

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JoeStrummer

What can people do to beacons to render them so dangerous? Worrying about a used beacon seems silly, if you find a deal and its a current model or recently discontinued, enjoy it. It's not like it's a climbing rope someone left hanging from a tree all winter.

---

Well, I dropped mine. It worked fine, but when I took it apart to check it out it had a cracked antennae. For the most part I am sure used ones are fine, but that is not a certainty.

When people say test the equipment before you use it I totally agree. What should go into that testing? Are there only certain people that can do it? Or is it a matter of practicing and "finding" the beacon making sure everything works?

that's a start

you could also take or send the unit to a dealer or manufacturer for proper testing and possible upgrades

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JoeStrummer

What can people do to beacons to render them so dangerous?

---

They can have no knowledge of how they can be rendered so dangerous.

As already mentioned in the thread.....

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Jethro

Well, I dropped mine. It worked fine, but when I took it apart to check it out it had a cracked antennae. For the most part I am sure used ones are fine, but that is not a certainty.

---

For something thats supposedly designed to survive avalanches, it being damaged from a 2 and a half foot drop to concrete seems pretty lame. Not saying youre wrong, just saying it doesnt seem like something like that should have any effect.



Just curious, does anyone know of an incident in which a beacon was rendered inoperable due to trauma during an accident? What I mean is didanyone ever get in an avy or fall off a cliff, and their partners were unable to use the beacon signal to find them due to it no longer transmitting as a direct result of the accident that necessitated its use? I've never heard of such a situation, although I'm not saying it hasnt happened. Youd think if a couple foot fall can damage one, being swept over cliffs by an avy would of broken one sooner or later.

there was an accident in Jackson some years ago where a beacon was rendered inoperable. a beacon is attached to you in an accident, you are more fragile than it.

yeah, beacons drift over time, blah blah blah but the odds of you buying a 5 year old inoperable are n't that high

My take

The digitals are worked out enough for me to upgrade so i did, they are at the point where with the barry vox element or the Ortovox 3+ you get a good basic digital for the same price as you would have paid for a good analog 10yrs ago so its a good time to upgrade from analog to digital so I think you will see many 10yr old beacons on the used market

but try both, if you are a newb you will find the practise beacon way faster with a digital vs analog, people have found /saved aviy victims after literally pulling the beacon out of the box with no instruction, yes a guide/aviy course instructor with an analog can find the beacon as fast or faster than a digital because he is a pro and he practises but if you are new you don't know shit about using a beacon and you likely won't practise

And from what I have read in a multiple burial some of the new beacons pick up other digitals before they pick up an old analog so you get dug up last ... beacon wise you are a 2nd class citizen

so if you are really broke a used F1 is better than touring with no beacon but if you can at all afford it spring for one of the new digitals cuz it works better

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by XXX-er

yes a guide/aviy course instructor with an analog

---

If you find a guide or aivy(sic) course instructor who is still using an analog beacon.

You need to find a different, better one.

Well of course all the pros have long gone digital for a reason but I think its possible the guides I know could still pick up an F1 and find the hidden beacon faster than I can with a digital ... its their job

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by XXX-er

Well of course all the pros have long gone digital for a reason

---

For the same reason you shouldn't be advising a newb to get an old cheap analog?

I'd argue that an OG BCA Tracker DTS is a better choice for a bargain basement beacon. They're digital, dual antenna and simple to use. Some of my buddies run F1s and it makes me quite nervous to rely on them.

ya but you know in real life people take short cuts/ they cheap out/ they don't buy snow tires/ they have unprotected sex/ they drink smoke eat too much in spite of people telling them not to

and they buy 10 yr old avalanche beacons which is still better than no beacon, I did VERY strongly suggest he should buy new technology and gave good reasons why ... now its up to him

i didnt recommend an analog beacon, I recommended a digital and that "A beacon" is better than no beacon

In order for someone to buy a 10 yr old beacon someone has to sell a 10 r old beacon so who has sold off their 10yr old beacon isn't that like selling crack or used underwear should it not be frowned upon by the BC community,

along with outdated ski bindings shouldn't used beacons be refused at ski swaps ?

I kept my F1 for practise/spare/loaner it will never be for sale and while I do loan it from time to time, the borrower gets the "buy digital" sermon when they pick it up

I do not recommend buying "used" transceivers. If you do buy one, I'd use it only as a training transceiver (i.e., in a Nerfball).

More important for the new user is don't buy a beacon with a single antenna and avoid 2-antenna beacons if you can. Don't buy a beacon that does not have a visual display.

Buy a used 3-antenna beacon and be happy.

http://www.wildsnow.com/6031/older-beacon-test-how-to/

Sent from my ADR6300 using TGR Forums

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by 1000-oaks

The ceramic is likely just an insulator to keep the windings in place (so they have something to wrap the wire around), so a few cracks probably wouldn't hurt anything as long as the wires stay intact and in position.

---

The ceramic is a ferrite rod and is needed intact for the antenna to work properly. It will probably still pick up a signal with a broken ferrite rod, but the range could be badly affected (both transmit and receive). If it is broken it NEEDS a service.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by nickinbc

The ceramic is a ferrite rod and is needed intact for the antenna to work properly. It will probably still pick up a signal with a broken ferrite rod, but the range could be badly affected (both transmit and receive).

---

^ This.

Never trust a dropped beacon unless you've followed Jonathan's testing protocol. Or sent it back for manufacturer to test on the oscilloscope for a bill of good health.

Deleted my post, clearly I have no idea about how the antennas work in these things.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by XXX-er

In order for someone to buy a 10 yr old beacon someone has to sell a 10 r old beacon so who has sold off their 10yr old beacon isn't that like selling crack or used underwear should it not be frowned upon by the BC community,

along with outdated ski bindings shouldn't used beacons be refused at ski swaps ?

I kept my F1 for practise/spare/loaner it will never be for sale and while I do loan it from time to time, the borrower gets the "buy digital" sermon when they pick it up

---

I have an old anolog that I loan out - but more accurately if I am going with, I loan out my brand spankin new one and I carry the oldy.
My thought here is that - I can actually find people with the analog (not as fast as the digital) but I will find them and more importantly if I am buried I want my partners to have the best tech they can get.

Usually after we do a little practice run with the two units, the loanee can't wait to purchase a brand new one as they know exactly how much longer it will take me to find them with the analog.

I also think that if you wish to cheap out on a beacon - your buddies should have the right to trade you as it is their life you are putting at risk as much if not more than your own.

good point ^^ counselor

What about a used stud finder?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by irul&ublo

What about a used stud finder?

---

pm rontele