Triple post... ugh.
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Triple post... ugh.
How many reps are you going for?Quote:
Originally Posted by Shorty_J
That was fairly well done. You get a cookie from the good job jar.Quote:
Originally Posted by old goat
Looks like 3 sets of a 1 rep max. He only got the rep on the first set though.Quote:
Originally Posted by old goat
Ive been hitting hamstrings using RDLs for the past couple months and am now acceptable strong in them. But thats just hitting them using a hip hinge movement pattern with the knee joint static... need to also hit them using knee flexion but its gonna be kinda difficult to do just using a squat rack. thinking about jerryrigging a nordic curl setup using spotter arms, and an old blanket+voile straps for padding on it. Might be able to figure out somekind of banded setup to make laying hamstring curls happen too.
Having a couple anchors for bands make noridc curls 10x better. Can go full range of motion, which is a huge bonus imo, and progress dropping band tension.
Nordic curls are awesome.
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Advice needed:
Going to gym for general strength maintenance + I enjoy it
Prefer keeping things simple and focusing on a few movements per body part
For lower body I’m doing squats and Romanian deadlifts and hip thrusters.
I don’t often do calves but guess I should.
Anything else you would add for lower body? I’m comfortable with my chest, shoulder, back, arms, and core program
You've got the big three - squats, deadlifts, hip thrusts. Just change those up with a bunch of variations.Quote:
Originally Posted by bennymac
Then add as desired:
calf raises
split squats
lunges
side lunges
leg extensions
nordics
sissy squats
good mornings (these are great for the back)
glute machine
Awesome thanks - will learn these and rotate them in
What do you want to improve? What is failing you in general strength?Quote:
Originally Posted by bennymac
You have a hinge and a squat movement. Doing which ever variation of these allows the most force output is great. You really don’t need to add much if these are working for you.
Beyond movement patterns (squat, hinge, push, pull, rotation and anti-rotation) there aren’t any exercises which are inherently good or necessary.
Maybe something which gets you moving under load in an alternate plane of movement?
Rotating the variation of hinge/squat/push/pull/rotate ever couple cycles can be a great way to identify and prevent week points.
I tended in the past to just go to the gym for upper body - for general functional strength and because when I’m unmotivated for cardio I can always find the inspiration to lift weights for a hour. Would just do the same pattern I started in high school. And my gym attendance would fluctuate depending on time of year.
Now as I age I’m looking for a more intelligent approach - more to build a foundation of full body functional strength for all activities - everything from recreational mountain bike racing to ski touring to getting that heavy box off the top shelf. Planning on making it a year round thing (strength training).
I’m not weak in any one area particularly versus other areas(that I can tell). I’m a tall ectomorph that can come off the couch and do hard long cardio events including multi day events with minimal training - but I feel an increasing tendency towards minor injuries and muscle weakness. Feeling my arms get torched from everyday chores was a motivator.
I’m not someone that needs to hit my chest from 5 different angles - I don’t have a chest that needs that - I just need to lift heavy enough weight in the main exercises.
That was rambling- hope that makes sense.
It did. But as you get older the approach of just the big moves for brute strength is less functional. For example, all those exercises I gave you below work different little muscles that are underdeveloped without the work. For example, you can be really strong in squats, but split squats or one legged squats will expose issues with muscle strength and balance. In the same way, do a legged dumbbell deadlift (RDL) - you'll find a bunch of weakness in certain places.Quote:
Originally Posted by bennymac
As you get older best to be an all-rounder.
Gotcha thanks - yes I do want to be an all-rounder. Just want to find the right balance between only doing squats versus the cover model bodybuilder who needs to target that one particular muscle fiber with some super specific isolated exercise. My desire is to tap into the experts here to find that balance. Appreciate the help!
Whatever program you choose, it needs to include:Quote:
Originally Posted by bennymac
Horizontal Pulling (barbell or cable or dbell row)
Vertical Pulling (pullups)
Horizontal Pressing (bench press)
Vertical Pressing (Overhead barbell/dumbell pressing)
Squating (backsquat, front squat, Bulgarian Split squat)
Hip Hinging (deadlift, good mornings, RDLs)
Direct core work
Make sure your routine is built around those foundational movements. The exercises can change, but the movements should should always be there. Add in whatever accessories you want like curls, or lateral raises, or leg extensions or bosuball pistol squat shoulder presses with a twist at the top. Follow a progressive overload program if you intend to gain strength, but if you are generally just trying to maintain, then no need to truly follow a program... just show up to the gym consistently, and make sure you are hitting each of those movements no more regularly than another. I like a Push-pull-legs split, or an upper-lower split. YMMV.
Also, spend 15 minutes warming up and stretching out. It will help prevent injury by generally raising your core temp, getting a feel for bending and bracing, and getting your mind invested in working out. It will also likely be the only way you actually consistently stretch, rollout, and do any prehab/rehab exercises.
Thanks for that! I feel like my upper body routine has all those in it - probably because I find it easy to think about these movements (like how a row movement is kinda the opposite of a traditional bench press).
But where I’m not so sure is my lower body - as mentioned above I’m doing squats with a barbell on my upper back, Romanian dead lifts, and hip thrusts. Just want to make sure I’m including all the right movements below the waist. Thanks for the help!
I like to add in hamstring curls (or nordic curls) as hamstring strength from knee contraction is kinda meh with the hip hinge pattern. Personally, i like to keep a fairly high base strength level in squats and deadlifts and then i rely on MTB and skiing for the volume portion of my leg training. Id rather blow my legs up pedaling up 3k, or skiing 20k of mogul runs than spend 45 mins in the gym getting extra leg volume in.Quote:
Originally Posted by bennymac
FWIW I 100% agree with this. I've gravitated toward heavier weight, lower reps with my lower body as I've found the opposite starts to get in the way or recovery from skiing, biking, running, soccer, bball, etc.Quote:
Originally Posted by californiagrown
If you're not used to working your lower body (as I have not been) I'd recommend starting small. Check your pride at the door... but straining something is just a big setback.Quote:
Originally Posted by bennymac
Work up to it.
Yes thanks for including that. I’m definitely paranoid about injuring myself - especially given my lack of familiarity with lower body exercises. My RDLs feel super easy right now but I’m ok with that. I’m being patient and working on form and balance. I’m not looking to be Superman by Xmas. Thanks for mentioning that though - seems super important to think about. Fortunately I’ve had to check my pride at the gym door since starting in high school - I’m well accustomed to selecting light weights already 😆
Ive started wearing a belt on my heaviest set of squats. It helps keep my form in check down in the hole, and allows me to move heavier weight more safely. Really no downside. Also, my wife will divorce me if it hurt my back again and cannot pick-up or help out with our newborn son. After all, you should never get hurt training or exercising... you should get hurt doing the thing you are training for. And damn is it easy to pull/strain/twist/jam/piss off random body parts as you get older, so a little extra protection to reduce chances of injury become more and more worth it.Quote:
Originally Posted by Shorty_J
Goblet squats with a kettlebell are good for rom and cleaning up your squat technique.
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After a lot of minor lower back injuries over the years (work and training related, tall guy etc) I've quit back squats and standard DLs.
I feel that I get what I need from a mix of front squats, hex DLs, and split squats, lunges, nordics and pistols. Yeah, hex DLs are kinda lame, but they let med work on my speed / power, and I really need that as 40 is very close.
Belts are hip and allow for increased core activation aka not a cruch.
Hex/trap deads are cool! You can be the boss of your mechanics and they can hit the quads nice for skiing.
Leg extension are also cool, they train the rectus femoris(which doesn’t get hit much when you bend your knee and hip at the same time ie squats) and also bias training of the quads in a fully shortened position which is probably good to not fully ignore.
Hex/trap bar DLs are generally a better exercise for anyone not competing in a strength sport with a tested DL. It’s easier to train, harder to fuck up and you can focus more time and effort into getting strong than fucking around learning technique. More gyms should have them.
Generally adding technical difficulty to a movement pattern which requires you to reduce weight isn’t going to help you get better at anything other than that technique/movement. I’m a big fan of training unilateral movements but it needs to be done for the right reason and generally won’t be done at the cost of high output training. A lot of the people who push parlor tricks like pistols are using some gymnastic movement with minimal carryover to anything as a ‘gotcha’ to keep clients trying without having to make them actually strong or big or better at their sport.
Basically don’t make your movements more difficult just for the sake of ‘identifying weeknsss.’ once you have identified a weakness through sport/performance/etc purposely address it with exercise selection. There are no ‘key exercises’ you ‘need’ to be proficient in. Find the ones which work for you. The reason’s can be vast. For example I swapped out split squats and walking lunges for squats to give my back a rest when it was getting constantly taxed from work. Yeah, I couldn’t provide quite the same stimulus, but I made up for it (kinda) by being able to train more often. It wasn’t done with the intent of improving balance or movement patterns or any other bullshit people come up with to avoid actually putting weight on the bar.
anything you do in 45 minutes is a measure of v02 max and stamina, not endurance.Quote:
Originally Posted by californiagrown
i might have to look into grabbing one of these for the home gym. i'm constantly wondering if my DLs have good/proper form or not. i've watched vids and video'd myself but still question my technique every time. prob need an "expert" to come critique me but that's not happening.Quote:
Originally Posted by XavierD
that said, i feel the same way about my back squats now that i'm lifting some heavier weight. feel like i'm rocking forward a little too much on the squat. may be overcompensating for not wanting to fall backward. i'm also going deep squat and am wondering if i shouldn't w the heavier weight (doing 3 sets of 6-sih now after a couple warm ups).
This would be a great example of identifying a weak spot and adjusting exercise choice to address it. Adding in front squats or SSB squats (adjust current squat volume appropriately) will help train you to engage the glutes sooner, strengthen your upper back and help prevent the round over you feel.Quote:
Originally Posted by criscam
DebatableQuote:
Originally Posted by leroy jenkins
Doesn't stamina imply short bursts at near max output vs endurance which is the maximum length of time at less than near max output?
My gym does not have one. I'm pretty confident in my traditional barbell form. But I used one at a gym while traveling and really like it. Debating buying my own since I already carry all my own handles and ropes.Quote:
Originally Posted by XavierD
Yes.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hopeless Sinner
Got to 8 sets of blasters yesterday with about 5 more training sessions to make the full 10 before the wheels turn on Thanksgiving. I can't wait to be done with blasters until next fall. Besides plenty of other fitness stuff to work on like Turkish get-ups.
Ok so 45 minutes works your endurance if you have horrible endurance.Quote:
Originally Posted by Hopeless Sinner
The thresholds for real endurance are metabolic, 2 hours burns the sugar in your blood. 4 hours is where endurance really starts, do that often enough and your body will get used to burning fat for fuel, thereby increasing your endurance, sure your muscles and cardio get stronger, but I think your metabolism needs to catch up or you'll be handicapped by that.
45 minutes isn't going to do that much for real endurance unless its fasted, or 2 or 3 times a day.
However, obviously, having a higher v02 max isn't going to hurt your endurance, all else being the same.
Quote:
Originally Posted by leroy jenkins
Not arguing w anyone in this thread(LOL), just trying to learn is all. And make sure I understood the difference btwn stamina and endurance.
In your opinion is an 18 hour fast followed by a strenuous workout enough to build endurance? And how many times per week would you suggest?
Update- Got through 10 sets of full blasters at the end of my reg work out. I'll prob keep doing them till the lifts turn on Thanksgiving. 1 goal met, dozens more lie ahead.
Love TGU'sQuote:
Originally Posted by Hopeless Sinner
Quote:
Originally Posted by iriponsnow
Threw those in starting last week. Haven't done them in years, but the funny thing is I think the blasters may have given a little more ROM in my hips so they seem a LOT easier than I remember.
Marathons are no longer an endurance event?Quote:
Originally Posted by leroy jenkins
Edit to add, do you have a source that defines endurance as being a metabolic definition? Most of the literature breaks endurance down to either muscular or cardiovascular endurance but neither definition appears to directly consider the metabolic state other than that cardiovascular endurance is aerobic. If the definition of endurance is strictly those events that require your body to burn fat what do you call a mile swim, marathon or half marathon, etc.? https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/20432193/ Scientific literature, even on this subject of metabolic conditioning, repeatedly refer to efforts of 45 minutes as “endurance”.
Also, if an athlete performs a task for more than 4 hours but does so by fueling primarily with carbohydrate intake does that mean it is not an endurance event? You seem to be making up your own definition of endurance.
I use hex / trap bar deadlifts as a staple of my program and really like it. I think it is a better lift for athletes because it allows you to put the weight in a more natural position. I would note that I think a hex DL is actually more similar in muscle activation to a back squat than a deadlift though because the deadlift weight position. I recall some studies using muscle activation sensors that supported this, but don’t have a link handy.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sessiøn
For single leg work I use single leg squats (not a pistol) with the working leg elevated (standing on a 6” step) so it makes it easier to clear the non-working leg. This prevents you from having to crank on your hip flexor to lift the non-working leg. For skiers I believe this is one of the best exercises you can do. First it mimics the torsional force on the lower back like skiing does and second it is very good for developing strong and healthy knees.
Rear foot elevated split squats.
Single leg deadlifts.
I agree with trap bar DLs mimicking squats. Which is why I do regular bar DLs. Trying to isolate hamstrings. Back squats are a bit to close to trap DLs to do both - at least for me.
I could see them combining well with front squats. But you’d still need to go after hammies.
All these movements are good. It’s simply a question of how you are putting together the whole movement package to hit everything.
The whole discussion above about endurance vs stamina also sounds odd to me, and is certainly not based on any consensus among the sports science community. I wonder where these strange definitions of those terms came from. (Crossfit seems like a likely suspect.)Quote:
Originally Posted by neufox47
What there is consensus on is that the whole adapting oneself to be more "fat burning" trend can yield at best small results. As we've covered in abundant detail in the Sprockets training thread, carbs are the primary fuel at any intensity beyond a walking pace. I won't relitigate it all here, but suffice to say that the athlete who is actually competitive at an endurance sport and who routinely fasts or does long workouts without fuel is pretty rare. Only in ultra running is it somewhat more common, but that's because getting enough fuel is such a challenge for most people's guts that they accept decreased performance to get through their events. If they could tolerate 80+g of carbs an hour, there is zero doubt that they would be able to perform better.
Here's the link for those who haven't followed the Sprockets thread. There is a ton of great info in it that is transferable to any endurance activity. Very serious science guys have made great contributions there.
https://www.tetongravity.com/forums/...d.php?t=341124
Official Sprocket Rockets Training Thread
You ever do Nordic curls or slide board leg curls? Recently they have been getting a lot of attention in S&C and are being heavily used to train athletes with repeated hamstring “pulls” or injuries.Quote:
Originally Posted by EWG
https://youtu.be/2ohYYgsZUG0
Single leg deadlifts are another that I really like. I think many single leg exercises work the groin and lower back more than the bilateral version. Lower back and groin are usually the areas most sore after my first tours and lift served skiing, which is especially noticed when I haven’t been working out as much as I should.
https://youtu.be/hCKwxFm7gzc