Hell yeah, and use a tech boot in one and a normal boot in the other.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lindahl
Printable View
Hell yeah, and use a tech boot in one and a normal boot in the other.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lindahl
^^He was talking tech toe and DIN heel on one foot; DIN toe and tech heel on the other foot. Theoretically would work if you have a boot with swappable soles...except it won't actually work cuz of forward pressure.
Hence a recipe for fucking you up - perhaps screw in the heel and use the pins after you settle into the binding. Just don't fall?Quote:
Originally Posted by auvgeek
Mounted my own skis for the first time last night - radicals on the new lotus 120s. Damn, it took a lot longer than expected - was up until 2am. Used jondrums deluxe install kit. Worked well, but I might by a used drill press (found a few on Craigslist for $75 last night) to speed up the process and ensure the holes are vertical. ***side note: anyone know anything about drill presses? What to look for in a used one? Prices? Etc? )
One question - not sure how well I got the epoxy into the hole. Got a good amount on the screw threads but don't know how much, if any, I got in the hole. Not a serious issue in this instance as I will be remounting with BF inserts in a couple weeks, but which is more important - epoxy in the hole or on the threads? Or are both equally important?
Another reason for the interest in the drill press is that I think it will allow me to slightly alter hole locations if necessary when remounting (I read inserts have less tolerance for location accuracy, which makes sense) and I'm not positive the paper template is 100% accurate - I got one hole, same hole on each binding - that was slightly off on the template compared to the bindings (rear left was approx 1-2mm too far outside). Anyone else have this issue? All the other holes were spot on.
Epoxy in either holes OR on screws not both, IMO in holes is neater (you can hold your cardboard with epoxy right next to the hole and use something sharp to drip it in - teriyaki skewers are great). I apply the epoxy before I place the binding over the holes. It's liquid, so it will flow to cover the screw heads as long as you get a decent amount in. I usually turn the ski upside down to let it cure.Quote:
Originally Posted by shafty85
Jondrums' templates work just as well as a jig if used properly (use something very small and sharp to make your marks - like an icepick - before your whack it with a centerpunch). Jigs have some room for error as well, probably .5mm in any direction, plus hinges are subject to wear and rubber feet fall off or get flipped the wrong way, etc.
I cut the end off a cotton swab and use the tip to put epoxy in the holes and coat the upper threads of inserts.
I wouldn't use a drill press, too easy to fuck up and drill too deep, off center etc... plus you have to support the ends of the ski while doing so and deal with the curved top sheet surface etc... Best use for a drill press is to make a guide block with a hole through it as others have done.
The trick I use for getting the holes in exactly the right spot is to pound a divot in the top sheet with a small nail, right through the paper template. I do a test fit of the bindings over that to see if it looks right. If all is good, then I chuck a small 1/8" bit into my dremel and widen the divot just a bit. That way when the time comes for the big drill, it won't walk around all over the place and goes exactly where it needs to. I also use the dremel and a cone shaped grinding bit to remove any volcanos so the binding sits flush.
If I have wood core skis I like to put thin CA (crazy glue with the consistency of water) into the holes AFTER tapping so that it seeps into the wood threads and fibers around the hole and wood thread to make it stronger. (balsa wood model airplane building trick.) As for putting epoxy and how much and where, less is more.
I like to use slow cure waterproof marine epoxy, mix is opaque black and white paste, mixes grey. I don't like to get the glue anywhere near the insert because it is to easy to get it IN the insert and that will ruin your day. So I put it in the ski and brush it into the wood threads with a toothpick. A good rule of thumb so far is that a little bit of it comes out when the insert screws in. (Immediately wipe away from insert with isopropyl alcohol.)
I let it cure in a warm environment for several days with the bindings installed loosely, just enough so they don't fall off. No loctite yet.
I've put in 100+ inserts so far and I've only had one spinner due to not enough glue/too much torque which was easily fixed in the field.
I install bindings with a small power screwdriver with a slipping clutch conservatively set and I blue loctite the screws in.
My issue is not with bit 'walking' or 'wandering' - I'm not a dummy with tools (though no professional). I noticed the error with the templates prior to drilling and did my best to compensate when tapping with the tap from jondrums (pretty fine tap - no nail, but not a fat tap).
Fortunately, I am going to ski the skis for a few days before installing inserts so these installs are basically a practice run, after my other practice runs. My issue is one screw noticeably went in at an angle, though i was able to compensate for the perceived inaccuracy on the other mount, but i could tell on the second it was off, so I will have to adjust that entire hole centre to match up with the bindings true location. Not a big deal, I can do this with or without a drill press - a drill press would just make the issues of being 'vertical' a non-issue - but am more wondering about the accuracy of the template.
That's genius, but I should have never read this. The OCD voices in my head will be on my ass next time I mount without doing this...Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivan Oder
Actually I kind of do the same thing already by swabbing epoxy into all of the tapped holes and letting it soak for a minute before adding a bit more epoxy just before putting in the inserts.
Time to pull the trigger on some inserts and bits and such. I've got 4 pair of skis that could use 'em. 2 old and 2 "new". I'll start with the 2 that are already drilled, then move on to the freshies.
Thanks for all the tips y'all!
Mounted two more fucking pairs of skis this week, and will have 2 or 3 more Fucking pairs to do next week (friends know I mount skis).
So easy... Just do it!
Sent from my SGH-I717D using TGR Forums
I've found the templates to be accurate and so have others, so I am surprised that they would be off. Then again I've only drilled for FKS/Pivot, DynaFit Radical and Large first gen Dukes, so it's possible. I check all new templates on a 2x4 scrap first. (FKS is sort of a bitch.)Quote:
Originally Posted by shafty85
The templates are sort of 'low resolution' with thick lines so it's easy to get errors if you don't line things up exactly or goof on making the ski center line. I use digital calipers to double check hole spacing, edge to hole spacing and all that before drilling.
Don't you love that? At first my friends were like 'Dude, you'll fuck it up, take it to a shop!'Quote:
Originally Posted by Shorty_J
On the hill they are like 'did you rip your binding out yet?'
A week later they are at your door with their new shit and a case of beer.
Same goes for waxing and edges.
(I race tuned my JONG friend's snowboard for shits and giggles and first run he eats shit because he's not used to dragless sliding and edges that work.)
I'm sure you'll be fine. :) I'm sure we've all seen the pull out test of these things and they're not going to come out unless you go all Hulk on tightening the screws and twist the thing. (Like I did... once.)Quote:
Originally Posted by 1000-oaks
I fill the holes up with CA like a little cup and I come back and install the insert when it's all absorbed into the wood.
CA=cyanoacrylate ?
Doese't it dry quicly? How would the wood absorb it? How is it better than epoxy?
Try printing another template, maybe using a different printer - could be due to uneven printer feed or crap on the rubber rollers. I just printed out a new one to check, and the hole spacing on the two sets of toe holes seems identical (29.98mm center-to-center, but guessing on the centers as the crosshairs are pretty thick).Quote:
Originally Posted by shafty85
The point is not to replace epoxy with CA, you still need epoxy. The strength of the epoxy bond is only as good as the wood threads that its screwed into.Quote:
Originally Posted by daught
Wood is a porous material that absorbs liquids. By absorbing thin CA in to the pores and fibers and then having the CA cure in the wood, it reinforces and hardens the wood threads.
It's done for balsa wood models all the time where strength is needed when a screw is needed to bolt something to the wood. (Balsa wood is very soft.) Usually where a servo controlled lever screws into a wing surface.
Here's the stuff, it has the consistency of water so it penetrates deep:
http://hobbylinc.com/cgi-bin/s8.cgi?...GC&tag1_i=1073
I should add that you do not want to do this with foam core skis and CA can dissolve foam.
Will use this opportunity to recommend the drill block Jon sells. Really easy to use, and feel like I get better mounts with it. The couple I did before I got it were fine, never had any actual problems, but I do notice slight angles in the screws when switching bindings. Since picking up the tap block things are nice and straight.Quote:
Originally Posted by shafty85
Yuppppp. I can't drill straight for shit, the guide block plus the stepped bits easily halved my time. Tried using a drill press when I had access to my dad's tools still, but it's just not very good, found freehand was better. Bit can wander in any direction with equal ease, and it gives you no feedback when it does, have to readjust your depth to account for the changing core thickness, etc. The guide block with bits will run you a lot less money and give you much better and faster results.Quote:
Originally Posted by NatEE
Ha ha!Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivan Oder
Sent from my SGH-I717D using TGR Forums
You're supposed to clamp down the ski when you use a drill press.Quote:
Originally Posted by angrysasquatch
This is fascinating. Thanks for sharing.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivan Oder
Just finished fucking mounting my fucking protests. Used Jondrums template for plum guide and found it accurate. Might have over torqued, but no spinners. Time will tell; fingers crossed.
I don't really trust a drill press depth adjustment. I rather use a shoulder on the bit.
That's what I do, but those fuckers have a tendency to move up the bit / loosen the more you drill, especially if the set screw isn't super tight. (Use loctite!)Quote:
Originally Posted by daught
One other poster here suggested using thick block and sliding the bit back into it and the chuck so that only that depth which is needed is exposed, which is a good idea.
I have a scrap 2x4 chunk hat has a hole of the exact depth (measured with calipers) so I just stick the bit in there and slide the collar down and lock it. I check it in this hole before every drill to make sure it hasn't wandered.
The tools sold for the mounts are a good purchase too if you plan on doing more than one mount, which you will when you see how awesome it is. Some stuff can be hard to find locally.
I mounted some marker griffon's last night and everything went well. Just wanted to give anyone else trying to mount griffon/jesters a heads up that the template is a little off. I moved the rearmost holes on the heel back about 2mm on my template. Everything came out perfect after figuring out the pattern had changed slightly.
This was my first mount; next up, some rossi axial2's on my wifes new skis.
Mounted my own fucking skis with LightRanger. Sollyfits on 183 bros (AK made) and inserts for sth 16 and plums on Bibbys. First time mounting. Learned a ton and had a lot of fun too. I also learned that mounting inserts IS difficult...
Attachment 145042
Mounted 2 fuckin pairs tonight. The girl grom got some century's and ffg's and I get some BG's and Guardians! First sets ever.... Went pretty smooth. Waited till I was done to have a drink though. ;)
Interesting. Would it be better to just use helicoil OR BF inserts to increase the strength of the threads? Been thinking about ways to strengthen the threads for my tech toes which i'm going to shim up on longer screws.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivan Oder
Are people using loctite in addition to Epoxy in a standard mount (no insert), or do you just mean loctite for use in inserts? Using Ivans method, you would apply 3 chemicals in the process (if I understand correctly):Quote:
Originally Posted by Ivan Oder
CA filling hole until absorbed ---> Small Amount of Epoxy in Hole ---> Loctite to Screw
Second, question: is it still beneficial to countersink if you tap the screw hole, or is tapping alone sufficient? Thanks.
DO NOT USE LOCTITE. Definitely do not use loctite to adhere inserts to the wood core of a ski. Definitely do not use loctite to adhere binding screws to the wood core of a ski. An appropriate glue or epoxy should be used in both of these circumstances.Quote:
Originally Posted by Driver
The only acceptable use for loctite is to use blue (NOT RED) loctite to make sure screws don't rattle out of inserts. Mostly snowboarders do this because all snowboards have inserts. Some tele skis come with inserts from the factory. And a few TGR geeks have added inserts to their skis. But Loctite exists to make screws stick to metal. You shouldn't be putting Loctite anywhere near your wood core.
But again - DO NOT USE LOCTITE for two reasons: 1) it's really not necessary for plates or inserts etc, and you're better off just inspecting your gear after each use to make sure stuff is tight, and 2) Loctite will react with the plastic in your bindings and can damage your gear. Instead, use Vibratite which (reportedly) doesn't damage your plastic bindings.
A little common sense, a good eye and a paper template and a monkey could mount skis.
I think the blue loctite very sparingly is fine, but yes, check your gear (duh). And really I've only used slow set epoxy on inserts, hardmans blue is best.
No need to countersink. Especially for skis with a metal top sheet, that top sheet lends structural integrity to the ski. Leave as much intact as possible.Quote:
Originally Posted by Driver
That's what I figure thanks. Also makes sense on the Loctite.Quote:
Originally Posted by skimaxpower
Anyone else with thoughts on using inserts or helicoil purely to strengthen the mount? I know Big Steve is in favor of helicoil. The CA idea is very interesting as well.
this threads good
For the past year ive been mounting for a primarly e comerce shop
mounted more binders last year than a dozen years techin @ sillytude
last cybermonday mounted from 8 in the morn till 2am
we ran shifts all weeknd so shouldn't as clusterfucish today
Sure anyone ought to be able to mount a pair of skis
aint rockket science
but like anything in life hell of a difference tween doing something once or twice or a few dozen, at your leiusure
and being able to crank that shit out all day the next day......
so if youve never mismounted a pair of skis it's not cause your all that good it's just that you aint been in a position where you do it enough to fuck up yet.
thread is incomplete without this:
Play me some mountin' music
Just want to give props to everyone giving advice, templates and good vibes for those who mount their own fucking skis. Mounted up some Dukes (bought from a Mag) on Praxis 9D8's yesterday, went smooth. Gotta love this fucking place!
Attachment 145741
Fucking mounted my 186 Rens with SollyFit plates. Mounted my fucking Moment Tahoes last week, as well.
So easy, a beater can do it.
This is true. I've made a couple of mounting errors, but the great thing about doing it myself is it doesn't get hidden, and I can address and fix it myself.Quote:
Originally Posted by skifishbum
Jesus smiles when you mount your own.
So far I've done 5 dynafit, 2 with inserts. 3 more waiting in the pattern.