Did you think they are worth that much?Quote:
Originally Posted by XavierD
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Did you think they are worth that much?Quote:
Originally Posted by XavierD
The difference between the Scout and the Pro is just in the cuff.
Scout is a Grilamid cuff
Pro is a Grilamid/Carbon resin cuff. Stiffer and a little lighter.
Tour is a PU lower with Triax cuff I think. Also has a slightly thicker liner that weighs a little more.
So it's a typo on the Tecnica site that lists the Scout cuff as PU?
Yup. If it was PU the difference would be much more than 30 or so grams. It’s Grilamid.Quote:
Originally Posted by 1000-oaks
^ Wow, had I known that, I would have definitely considered the Scout before pulling the trigger on the Pro. No biggie though.
Ditto. Still do as of 2 years ago. Wtf zipfits are 220? Old ass ones?Quote:
Originally Posted by XavierD
Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums
Why? If you don’t mind me asking? 30g is 30g regardless of what it’s made out of right? Was weight or something else the deciding factor in going one vs the other?Quote:
Originally Posted by 1000-oaks
Pro is definitely stiffer than the Scout.
Didn't actually notice it was only 40g difference, just saw PU, assumed it was heavier, jumped over to the Tour Pro info, and never gave the Scout another thought. For my weight I'm fine with 120 or 130 flex, DD boot is 2017 Cochise 120.
Other lighter guys who are good with 120 flex could save a little coin with the Scout, unless that 40g is worth another $100 to them.
Take a look at skibartlett in the UK. Seem like brand new modelsQuote:
Originally Posted by margotron
Ok trying to figure out which shell I should get for this guy.
Tried on a 26.5 of last year's ZeroG Guide Pro and it was definitely a performance fit, heel hold felt really solid, except for too much pressure on the instep (always the bane of fitting for me). Would it be not bad to get more space there since it's easier to get instep space with the overlap construction + grillamid (correct me if I'm wrong) + boot board grind? Plus a couple mm more space in the toes would be nice in that fit. No footbeds in the boot for that fit.
Then tried on a 27.5 of 18-19 Chochise 120 (closest equivalent 27.5 they had in stock). And that felt comfy with still having good heel hold, plenty of room for my toes, and no instep pressure. But not too much room left on the instep buckle for when the liner packs out, but again didn't bring any footbeds with me. But the liner in the Chochise felt thicker/ plusher than the ZeroG.
Armchair advice? (yes I know you can't give 100% advice without seeing my foot)
You positive on that? Multiple places are listing the scout as grilamid lower, pu upper. Not saying you're wrong - you're just the only one I've seen saying the upper is grilamid.Quote:
Originally Posted by couchsending
I didn't try on last years, but I had some instep pressure with this years, though not as much as with the Hawx 130 XTD.
I fit with extra foam padding on the instep areas and it worked out well.
Now I need to address this medial malleolus pain on the right side...
Boots ski well!
Straight from tecnica's siteQuote:
Originally Posted by toast2266
SPECIFICS
Sizes: 24.5-30.5 (1/2 sizes only)
Shell: C.A.S. GRILAMID SHELL
Cuff: PU CUFF
... which says the upper is PU. Which is what everywhere else on the internet says too. Except Couchsending is saying that's a typo and that the cuff is actually Grilamid.Quote:
Originally Posted by NorCalNomad
Did anyone's liners come with laces? Mine came with no laces or even the normal stock foam foot bed (no problem as they were going to be replaced anyways)
Mine did. Dealer said they'd help in tour mode to keep the heel locked in. Not much use on the down. Skinned for an hour and half and walked for another 30 minutes without the laces and, while my heels slipped a bit, no blisters or hot spots.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jtlange
First tour with them I had no problems but the second tour my heels slipped and i got a blister so I need to pick some laces up I think.Quote:
Originally Posted by hafjell
Keep us posted on the results.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jtlange
Yup y’all are right. I work for Tecnica. I swear we were told last winter the cuffs on the scouts were Grilamid. Which would make sense cause the weight difference between Pro and Scout is not much. For instance biggest difference between Cochise 120 and 130 is the cuff in 130 is PE, cuff on 120 is Triax. Weight difference is in the neighborhood of 150-200 grams. I checked my pre production Scout samples and the cuffs at definitely stamped PU.Quote:
Originally Posted by toast2266
Product guys will be over here in two weeks so I’ll discuss more cause the close weight doesn’t make sense to me.
My bad
^ The Cochise 120 is lighter than the 130, so Triax probably only a little heavier than Grilamid.
I will try this too. Right now the instep pressure is the only concern with 27.5s that fit great out of the box otherwise (with stock liner). I was hoping to use my Intuition wraps in the shells, but I think the Tecnica stock liner is a much better fit, though leaves zero room for anything but a very thin sock. For those looking for a fit comparison, I ski a 28.0 Dynafit TLT-6 normally and aside from the instep pressure, the two boots feel very similar. The Zero G will take some work to dial in, but there are no red flags that suggest I'm on a road to nowhere trying to sort out the fit. BSL in the Zero g 27.5s is 313mm while the Dynafit 28s are 307mm. Biggest benefit is that I finally get to ski my Fritschi Tectons mounted to Zero G 108s using this boot - the TLT-6s do not have adequate heel ledge and were always at risk of pre-releasing with the Tectons unless using those goofy metal heel adapters.Quote:
Originally Posted by Summit
and i bet the weight delta between TLT6 and ZeroG isn't even that much. That's what blows my mindQuote:
Originally Posted by Solesides
You're exactly right, Lee. But I did put Booster straps on the TLT-6. It was when I was bolting on yet another piece of metal (the heel adapters to make them work with the Tectons) that I really started questioning my intelligence.
Tecnica Zero G pro tour weight per boot: 1,445 grams (shell, stock liner, footbed)
Dynafit TLT-6 weight per boot: 1,346 grams (shell, booster strap, Intuition powerwrap, footbed)
Finally got to try on some 27.5's Tour Scouts since someone returned some new ones to a local REI (they are only being stocked at the flagship ie Seattle REI...) and the closest in stock dealer is hundreds of miles away.
Didn't bring my insoles but threw in the stock ones and tried it both with thin and thick ski socks.
My foot (weighted on a brannock in the afternoon):
Left: 9.5 C
Right 9.25 B
Toebox: Greek shape and height in proportion to my length
Instep: HIGH but tapers off quickly. It's 28cm in semi-"circumference" if you tape measure from where the brannock's heel cup hits the baseplate on both sides with the tape over the instep. Average foot is closer to your foot's cm length measurement i.e. mondo.
Weight:155 w/o gear
Because of the instep height I normally end up in 27's and sometimes even without footbeds. Currently skiing 27.5 Dynafit Titan and BD Prime in 27.5. Tried to make a 27 TLT6 work for me...no way in hell.
I had tried on a 26.5 of last year's (can be seen at the bottom of page 10) but since I'll end up industry purchasing I didn't want to have to have a ton of work done.
The 27.5's were much better. I could still, if I wanted to, get a big red stripe of too much pressure over my instep even in thin socks. But backing that off I still had really good heal hold with loose buckles and walking (didn't try the liner laces). The bottom buckle doesn't really do much for me, if you had more width/ volume in front of my instep then it'd probably effect the fit more. Even in the 26.5 it didn't change much for me.
Length felt spot on for a 27.5. I don't need any extra room there up and down or forward and back. It's definitely a more comfort fit. I'd rather have the extra toe space for warmth since my dorsal pedal artery gets clamped down more than your average person.
Carpet forward flexing felt stiffer than my Titan's for sure, close to what I remember the regular Hoji felt like, softer than Atomic Hawk XTD's (these were the Scouts..), and more progressive than a TLT6P (well duh). Since I've come back into skiing years ago I've really just stuck to touring boots so can't really compare it to much else that'd be relevant, sorry. I was able access the flex, with booth heels on the ground at 155lbs. Now I'm just on the fence on whether or not to get the Pro vs the Scout since this will be my inbounds boot as well. Seemed like a lot of the "flex" came from deforming the clog, but maybe the carbon in the cuff helps to stop those pivots expanding laterally?
Range of motion and stride resistance is so damn good for an overlap. I'd say better than a TLT6 with the tongues in, only a little worse than no tongues.
Hopefully even my outlier of a data point will help someone :wave:
Forgot I took a picture of the accessories that come in the box.
-Thin Liners They're kinda funky in that the top sheet of them is a 2-3mm spacer mesh over the thin black foam that's molded. The silver bit isn't super hard so it's either a really thin/ soft TPU or ESS foam (ess is essentially really compressed foam used a lot for rock plates in trail runners). Maybe the idea of the spacer mesh is to promote breathability (kinda a ghetto version of gore-tex surround), since almost all footbeads are just a single layer mesh glued on top of the foam or molded parts.
-Laces
-Velcro Spoilers
Attachment 257823
I pulled the trigger on some Scouts so if anyone wants more photos I can take those in 7-10 days. Also the lower buckles and ladders are not screwed like the website shows, they're riveted.
the absolute shit Dynafit liner is always unfortunate and there is no way around that but I read about skiers who buy weak boots and add this or that so I gotta wonder if they wouldn't have been further ahead to buy a stronger boot cuz sooner or later you actualy have to ski this stuff.Quote:
Originally Posted by Solesides
yeah it was light on the scale ... but did it really work for ya on the down ?
Heh, that would be me. I ordered them off of REI.com to try out, since seems like none of the bay area stores carry touring boots. In any case, when i called into a couple local stores asking whether they carried them in stock, the standard answer i got from sales associates was to order online and return them for a full refund if i didn't like the fit.Quote:
Originally Posted by NorCalNomad
Too bad, i really did want to like these boots, but the way they taper in at the midsection of the clog just pinched the hell out of a bone (medial cuneiform?) in my arch. Ouch.
Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk
:D Thanks for the help!
Now the question is, did REI sell it on a discount because it was a return? Or did they still ask full price?Quote:
Originally Posted by NorCalNomad
Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk
Day 1 touring in the Scout, Pro's slightly softer (120) brother: Definitely softer flex than advertised, but very progressive and definitely serviceable. Walk mode range is $$ and friction-free. The powerstrap weirdness noted by blister is avoided by using as intended: there's a slide-link before the buckle to unhook the whole deal. Actually pretty slick. TBD whether it holds up riding in-bounds
I didn't buy that one, just used to check fit so I wouldn't have to go to Tahoe before putting in my order.Quote:
Originally Posted by sierra_cement
I was going to PM you but the collective might want to know:Quote:
Originally Posted by couchsending
Zero G Guide Pros from last year I found soft at room temp but got mighty stiff in the cold. Which of this years' Zero G would be slightly less stiff in the cold? (Trying on ski boots at indoor temps is :rolleyes2.)
Thanks.
They’re both Grilamid plastic so the properties are pretty similar. I’ve only got one run in my new ones and at 220 they were darn stiff in the cold. Wouldn’t want much more. I have incredibly skinny calves though so there’s a lot of plastic overlapping in the front of the boot which tends to stiffen them up.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim S
Grilamid should be less temperature sensitive than PU??
For me they fit much better especially around the lower leg than the old ones. The old mold was a Cochise mold that was designed around a much thicker liner. This new mold is it’s own so the liner fits much better in the shell and the boot itself is much lower volume for my skinny lower leg.
My calves have never impressed anybody in a positive way.Quote:
Originally Posted by couchsending
Thanks. I may sell last year's and try this years softer greenTour Scout or white-orangeTour instead of the Tour Pro.
Picked up some of this year's scouts (the green ones, sz 26.5) and have 4 decent days in them.
Me: slightly narrow feet that are getting wider with age. Narrowish heel with bony ankles. High arch. Skinny calf. 160lbs without gear. Previous boots were vulcans that were just slightly too big for me. Historically, I've opted for heavier, stiffer touring boots because I don't like the sacrifices that come with lightweight touring gear. In particular, I can't handle the lower cuff heights. And while I don't need a super stiff boot, a lot of the lighter boots are just a bit too soft, and the stiffer ones often have a terrible, run into a brick wall type of flex.
Boot mods, so far: heated the liners with a toe cap and some foam to create space over my instep. Punched around the front of the big toe and side of pinky toe on both boots. Added a bunch of foam around ankles to improve the heel pocket and keep my ankle bones off the shell. The ankle / heel area is still a work in progress. I'm also running custom insoles.
On my scale the boots weigh just shy of 1500g with my insoles and fitting foam installed. Probably a bit over 1400g without that stuff.
They walk well - I'd say better than the vulcans. At the limits of the range of motion, there's noticeable resistance, but they're quite smooth through the middle of the stride.
So far, I like the buckles and power strap, although I wish the strap had just a little bit of elasticity built into it to help keep it snug against the boot. Overall, I find the buckles less fiddly than the dynafit system.
On the way down, they ski impressively well. The 120 flex rating is pretty bullshitty, at least compared to a real alpine boot, but they're not floppy noodles, and the flex feels smooth and moderately progressive. I haven't had them out in a particularly cold day yet, but so far I haven't found the flex to get weirdly stiff in the cold. Given that I'm only touring on these and they'll only see resort use if it's on the way to sidecountry laps, I'm pretty happy with how they ski. Definitely not as damp as a heavier boot, but quite smooth for their weight, and they walk well.
Downsides: if I lace up the liner, I have to put my foot into the liner before I put it in the boot, and reverse that process to get the boot off. The boot is also really good at untying the knots in the liner laces while I'm walking. Happens even if I double knot them. Some sort of boa system might be nice here. Other than fit issues that I'm still dialing in for my foot, that's about all I've got for the moment.
Short story shorter: as someone who's struggled a bit to find a touring boot that I liked, these are treating me better than anything I've tried in the past.
This was my beef with the previous ZeroG, way too much space from the ankle upwards. All fixed with a custom foam injection liner though, albeit at a considerable weight penalty (and massive skiing improvement). For weight and ROM improvement, i am tempted by the new one. Does it really ski as well as the old one?Quote:
Originally Posted by couchsending
It skis better imoQuote:
Originally Posted by smooth operator
If memory serves, the first year yellow Guide Pro was all Triax, and the second year was Grilamid. The only visual difference was the sophomore version said "Grilamid" in small text on the side of the shell. If yours stiffened up a lot in the cold, is there a chance you had the Triax (Pebax) one?Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim S
I'm no boot expert, but I'd expect the Triax one to change with temperature more, and the Grilamid one to be stiffer all the time (same mold with stiffer material) but less temp sensitive.
Still dialing in the fit and the strap, but am otherwise impressed. I do have pretty serious pain under the second buckle up from the toe. Have been skinning and skiing with it unbuckled to alleviate the pain. The performance on the down is acceptable. Will take them back to my local to see what they can do. Anyone else have this?
Got one alpine day in these so far, pretty impressed overall. First thouhgts? WOW these are light, like unbelievably light. The flex feels as stiff as my older 2013 cochise 120s with powerwraps but far more even. They ski much better. The toe box is perfect for me, heel cup nice and tight. Things are pretty tight on the instep though, going to have to figure that one out.