Have you handled/packed the new Arc bag? It can swallow everything my Descentionist 40L can (basically a big 40L tube). Significantly more than 40L Scott E1 I currently use. I agree that most airbags feel very small volume vs stated; the new Arc is the first one that feels maybe just 2-3L short of stated volume.Quote:
Originally Posted by concierge
Have you handled/packed the new Arc bag? It can swallow everything my Descentionist 40L can (basically a big 40L tube). Significantly more than 40L Scott E1 I currently use. I agree that most airbags feel very small volume vs stated -- typically like 7-9L less. ; the new Arc is the first one that feels maybe just 2-3L short of stated volume.Quote:
Originally Posted by concierge
I haven't yet, but I am excited to. I wasn't trying to knock it, I think they did a great job and I'm glad to hear the 40L has space that should make it really compelling to the guide crowd as well. I measure all of our pack volumes myself at the factory. You pour tiny balls in the pack and then dump them into a container with volume markings so I think I have become decent at sussing out pack volumes and the last version of the descentionist 40L is closer to 30L pack that they maybe justified calling a 40L by measuring with the rolltop fully expanded. It is a nice clean pack though.Quote:
Originally Posted by doebedoe
Oh, I'm on the OG version of the descentionist 40L which feels about honest. Pretty much pulled out from one and into the other. Context I was handling it was among a bunch of bc professionals who needed more volume than their current bags.
The Arc bag is worth a buy so you can figure out how to make an even better Raide version.
Can you confirm that the pack straps are set narrower on the updated versions (mentioned on pg 5 of this thread)?
I wasn't considering a Raide pack this season due to the aforementioned fit issues (for me) on the 1st gen LF40 and lack of an airbag option, but am reconsidering given the Safeback integration.
Yep, the shoulder straps are set narrower on all the packs this season! Let me know if you have any other questions.Quote:
Originally Posted by North
Updates look great. In the updated LF40, is the avy tool compartment still open to the main compartment in the same way as V1? Have to admit, it kind of drove me crazy, would love to see a completely separate avy tool compartment. . Just made it a little more cumbersome IMO to use the main compartment, had to sometimes push that avy tool divider out of the way.
The tool pockets are open at the top, but the opening in the middle of the divider for the shovel throat is no longer there and it’s completely closed. That was one of the drivers for the new avalanche carry where I solved the problem of increasing the space efficiency of the avy tools by putting them on separate panels instead of the hole in the avy tools divider.Quote:
Originally Posted by kw_cap
Really like the blade sitting flat vs conventional designs that put the probe and handle "under" the blade, which creates meaningful dead air space and the blade bows the back of the pack out. The new design should be more sleek and should pack better as you can benefit for the brade's curve to fit main compartment equipment against.
Liking having the zippers for burial tools away from the main compartment zippers. Certainly will have to get used to the access point, but that is solved with a couple reps before pow season arrives for muscle memory training.
Nice out of the box thinking, Concierge.
Awesome, that's an improvement for me, I have the shovel throat hole taped up in my V1. Honestly, I'd love to see a totally separated avy tool comparment but not a deal breaker. Stoked on the v2. Thanks!Quote:
Originally Posted by concierge
I gotta say, having downward facing zippers seems like a recipe for disaster. Your shovel or probe could literally just fall out of the bottom due to forgetfulness, or some snag (your zippers are smooth operating).
This is just my opinion, but you're kind of in the ultra hardcore market, with $400 packs. I just don't know if slick and "designy" pockets are as appealing for this market, as say people who want an Osprey pack. Once again, my opinion, it's your company. What appealed to me was having something like an Alpha FL with a slightly fuller feature set. I want bare minimum zippers.
The whole idea of having a quick draw pocket for your probe doesn't really make sense as we aren't really coming across avis on a regular basis (hopefully). So this is a quick draw pocket that I will have forgotten how to quick draw from by the time a real emergency presents itself. Then the pack comes off anyway.
I guess it's spreads the risk, so likely only one item at a time will fall out of the bottom of my pack.
I can see how these type of pockets are useful for running pole type constant switchovers, but I'm not convinced for mission critical safety gear. Best of luck, but I'm going to sit out this round.
Anyone buying a Raide pack getting rid of a M/L Cirque 4[emoji641]?
Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums
I appreciate the feedback. I know it is not for everyone. I did get a lot of feedback to improve the avalanche tool access, which was the hardest pocket to access on the last version, and that should not be the case. I will say forgetting to close a pocket and losing stuff can be said about any pack, especially packs like the BCA packs or skimo packs with zippered/velcro stash pockets, but I have never heard of it being an issue for anyone. The shovel pocket opens from the top so you'd have to have the whole thing unzipped and an empty pack to lose your shovel blade, because the tension inside the pack keeps the shovel in. The probe zipper is right against your body, it would be almost impossible to snag it in a way that would open the zipper, the the zipper puller is housed in a zipper garage and the zipper is not smooth enough that it just opens by itself. Myself and a few other athletes tested this all season with no issues. Again, I know it is super different and I can appreciate the move away from minimalism not being for everyone, but having your stuff fall out should not be a concern with the design.Quote:
Originally Posted by JRainey
Many folks use a probe for a bunch more than searching an avalanche which makes the quick draw pocket more valuable. Quick way to validate snow depths across terrain or feel for significant layers (and their depths) while skinning along.
I had typed up a similar response and realized you said the same thing better than I had. Probing for snow depth and layers is a skill all advanced backcountry skiers should learn. It's a super quick way to verify things. Expecting 200cm snow depth? but the slope you are skinning on is only a 100cm? Maybe it got stripped earlier this season and it might be worth digging a bit to check. I have always used my pole to probe for layers and snow height, but being able to access my probe quicker would mean I might use it for that purpose instead, which leads to more accurate data. It's also super useful for glacier travel if you are into that sort of thing.Quote:
Originally Posted by doebedoe
Yeah, maybe just a location thing too, cuz I'm in the Alps, not the San Juans, so our snowpack is (in general) much more "known". How? You my ask. Because it rained all the way to the mountain tops, then froze hard, or something like that. A pole, hand, pole grip gets me to where I need to be, or just by stepping on it.
Thanks for the answer, I'll just let you do your thing.
Quick probing can be useful on glaciers with a fresh, wind-blown coat of snow to probe for hidden crevasses
Does anyone using v2 of the LF 30 or LF 40 this season have an update? I was in Hokkaido in January and it seemed like about half of the North American ski tourers were using these packs. The sample may be biased as if you can afford a trip to Japan, theres a better chance that you can afford a $400 pack.
V2 LF40 is a great pack and very well thought out. It’s an upgrade over the V1 due to the little details getting better (ex. buckles, top zipper, and probe zipper which is actually pretty sweet). The additional sizes are a huge plus if you’re on the larger or smaller end of back length like me.
Marketing aside (and Raide has been effective in that department) I think these are some of the best packs on the market right now and would purchase again.
IMO the 40 shines on long day tours and routes where you need to carry mountaineering kit. On lighter tours where the pack isn’t full, it still skis and carries great.
The 40 has enough room for 4-days of hut food and supplies when expanded, but it does get overwhelmed relative to other packs with that amount of weight due to the thin waist/shoulder straps and light frame.
Gripes are that I’d like more organization in the form of one more small pocket that’s easy to access. Also, the small front pocket gets compressed if the pack is loaded up so fishing out sunnies is harder than it could be.
After a bunch of use this season the fabric has no issues. My biggest question is about long term zipper durability. The closures are pretty small/light relative to what I’ve seen on my most durable packs.
I have been using V2 of the Raide 40L pack this season. Not a ton of days with it (maybe 20ish), but I can give some initial impressions. Overall, I really like it and I am happy with the purchase. It is quite light and it has held up well. It barely looks used. I would agree the fabric is burly. The diagonal ski carry works great and I love the helmet carry. It carries a load comfortably. This is my first pack with back panel access which is very convenient (all of my past packs just had a side zipper plus top panel access). I like the feature set.
Most of my skiing is in CA, not on glaciers or continental snowpacks, so I am not busting out my probe on the move. And I do not dig a ton of pits. The updated avy tool storage is a whatever for me. I have not had any issues. The zippers have stayed put and I have not had an issues with security. I guess if I had my druthers I would prefer a standard single zip pocket for the avy tools, but I have not had any issues with the current design.
My biggest nitpick is the sternum strap. It is one of those plastic sliders on a rail. The dyneema fabric makes the rail slippery and it has moved around on me some. It is not a big deal, but a minor complaint. I have broken these type of plastic clips in the past (not on this pack to be clear). I would prefer it be updated to a burlier sewn strap with a sliding buckle or a daisy chain type rail for the sternum strap. And I would agree the zippers seem a bit small compared to other common ski packs. I get it in the name of weight. We will see how they hold up. But I have not had any issues so far and the company seems like a stand up outfit in my dealings with them, so I am not too worried about it.
Sorta interested in the SB 40L. As a tall guy I wish it came in sizes rather than one size fits all, which guarantees it’s short for me. At this price point I generally expect two sizes at least. I haven’t seen this pack in person but the orientation of the zipper on the probe pocket bottom seems backwards to me i.e. if it were reversed, then even it it works its way halfway open the probe is unlikely to fall out. But perhaps both zipper orientations were tried in the prototypes?