MPPG:
Thanks to you, I just pulled the trigger on that Skeena Hoody
My wallet hates you!
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MPPG:
Thanks to you, I just pulled the trigger on that Skeena Hoody
My wallet hates you!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Binky
Same here. You see the 20% off code??
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Nice! Great deal with the code! Hope u guys didn't see those westcomb mirage jackets too!Quote:
Originally Posted by austriker
Sent from my DROID RAZR using TGR Forums
If anyone missed out on a skeena I may have An extra depending on how the xl fits.
Sent from my DROID RAZR using TGR Forums
Still Skeenas left yesterday when I looked. For those who havent gotten one. They even lowered the price on the red ones. I used the code. $151 out the door for a blue. It should be here tomorrow.
As far as fits:
My Vapor FX jacket is a M and fits great; although, like MPPG mentioned it is hard to hide behind the chin flap if the hood is down
I went with L vapor fx pants. They are long, but the waist is perfect for me at 34"
I also have a Specter. It is a M. It's a but tight in the chest, but it is strictly a rain jacket so no need to layer or try to fit bulk under it
I am 5'6" and 190. Short and stocky
Too bad that code expired.
Don't forget to use active junky for an extra 8 percent off.
Ok, my Skeena just arrived. My first impressions are: Sweet jacket!
I ordered a size L, since the other two Westcomb shells that I have (Vapor FX and Specter) both fit on the more athletic side. I wanted something a little roomier. Like I mentioned in an earlier post, I am 5'6 and weight 190. I am not fat, but certainly not fit or athletically built either. I have very broad shoulders and a thirty-something belly developing. The L Skeena certainly provides that extra room. I don't feel that I am swimming in it, but it is noticeably roomier than the freeride-cut M Vapor and the athletic cut M Specter. I am able to layer a micro-puff Flylow vest under it without restriction (I wore one to work this morning).
What impresses me most is the feel of the fabric. I have owned a few softshells and have never really understood their appeal. I find them stiff and not always easy to layer underneath. Last year, I bought a Flylow Clyde softshell for a ridiculously low price. I like the Clyde, but I wouldn't wear it into the backcountry. The Skeena, on the other hand, appears much more technical, and it is really stretchy and soft. I feel that it will be a better overall jacket for outdoor pursuits than the Clyde. The hood is downright massive and, hooray, I can fit my whole chin behind the flap with it fully zipped and the hood down.
The length of the jacket sits just below my waist. The arms are a bit long, and, as MPPG mentioned, one detriment is that the Skeena has elastic cuffs not closures. I find that interesting.
Hopefully, the temps will drop and the snow will fly so that I can really test this thing.
Oh! the blue color is not as depicted on theclymb or Westcomb's websites. It is, in fact, very Avatar blue with yellow zipper pulls.
Thanks for the info! I got the red so I'll see what it looks like. Mine comes soon!Quote:
Originally Posted by Binky
Sent from my Q10 using TGR Forums
Good write-up. ThanksQuote:
Originally Posted by Binky
CLYMB dropped the price down to about $169 even without code.
I ordered the XL in red and just got it in the mail. It's much better fit for me, (5'11 180# 42 chest-broad shoulders,monkeyish arms) even if the L was good in most areas, The hemline was too short, the chest was a little snug and tight under the armpits. All issues were cleared up with the XL. It'll give me more room for my skins and to layer with a lightweight puffy if needed.
So, if anyone is interested I will be selling the L avatar blue for the going rate.
As Binky stated the fabric scheme is great. the shit is so silent, I feel like a ninja! ...I like it so much I'm now in the market for a good soft shell pant
note: The clymb website has falsely labeled the soft shell material as Schoeller WB-400. It is actually Schoeller Dryskin. which is better, as the jacket would be a furnace if it had the WB-400 AND the Merino Lining
Just picked up a Skeena. I can't wait to get it. Thanks for the heads up.
Anyone checked out the Tango hoody? That breathable alpha insulation is intriguing.
The Tango looks very interesting. Similar to the Atom LT from Arcteryx. (Especially like the elastic cuffs). I think the Atom LT hoody is one of the best jackets ever made. So versatile.
Maybe more breathable than the atom though? Trigger pulled on Backcountry.com for the tango. I'll report when I get it.Quote:
Originally Posted by zeroforhire
Cool! Let us know what you think.
Second about the atom. Its amazing.Quote:
Originally Posted by zeroforhire
sent from mobile
Please do! Id be interested how it stacks against the atom ltQuote:
Originally Posted by bsavery
sent from mobile
Have only worn an atom in the store. But here's my take on the Westcomb Tango:Quote:
Originally Posted by austriker
I'm 5-9, 170 lbs. Medium fits perfectly. Grey Concrete color is very nice and wearable around town. Very soft and comfortable and light piece. I got mine last week and found myself wearing it around everywhere. Just feels nice on. Could see using this under a hard shell, or wearing uphill on the skin track and then a light shell over for downhill. I have a Westcomb Focus jacket (the eVent DVL jacket) and the Tango fits great under. Feels about as warm as a patagonia nano puff.
In terms of breathability I don't find myself getting sweaty like the nano puff. Wore the Tango hoody on my bike commute to work today (45-50 degrees here in Seattle) and felt less sweaty than wearing the Focus eVent jacket. In fact almost no sweat at all. I like it. Think it will replace a nano puff in all situations.
It looks like the Skeena hoody in red medium is available again on theclymb.com. Hurry up if you missed this last time! Amazing hoody.
Zeroforhire can you add me to your "theclymb" guest list
Just sent you an in invite via PM
Ive been rocking the Skeena in seattle. Great softshell that somehow ousted my gamma mx as my go to commuting shell
Sent from my Q10 using TGR Forums
I replaced my Atom LT with the Tango. The Tango is cut a fair bit longer in the torso but tighter in the forearms.Quote:
Originally Posted by austriker
Polartec Alpha's breathability is far superior to Primaloft, I immediately noticed this on days with high air humidity. There was noticeably less condensed water on the inside.
But although indicated on Westcomb's website, mine has no internal media pocket and the hood adjustment requires two hands. I'm not certain if I did receive a sample though since I got mine already in September from Campsaver. bravery, does your Tango have an internal pocket?
Negative. I've noticed sometimes the details of their pieces are different from the catalog.Quote:
Originally Posted by rasi
Interesting. I must say i love my atom lt, in fact i have 3 of it (hooded, quarter zip pullover and vest). I might have to check out the Tango at reí or local shop. Breathing is big for me as i run hotQuote:
Originally Posted by rasi
Sent from my Q10 using TGR Forums
Everyone's raving about the breatheability of the Tango, but nobody's talking about how warm it is.
I have to say that I really don't understand those of you who want a "breathable" insulated jacket. Isn't the warmth/weight ratio far more important? What I am missing? I bought the Rab Xenon cuz it's lighter and warmer than the Atom LT. Dane raved on coldthistle about how it kinda "punched above its weight-class," and that had me sold. Sure, it's not as breatheable as the Atom, but I only wear it when I'm cold—which is mainly when I'm stopped. If I wear it while moving and start to sweat, I simply take it off. Why not just wear a softshell sans insulation if you're really that worried about breatheability?
So school me. What am I missing?
Also: I've been wearing the Skeena hoody since it came out. It works well, but it's kinda been replaced by other stuff in my closet now. I *loved* it when I got it, but I guess I'm jaded now. Seems pretty heavy for what it is. But it fits me really well and it looks nice. Nice around-town jacket, but it rarely sees any use in the mountains anymore.
I was super stoked on the Revenant bib, too, but it's lost much of its waterproofing. Even after DWR treatment, it soaks through. Haven't worn it much, either—since picking up a pair of Trewth bibs, it pretty much just sees winter touring days. Last two times I wore it, it soaked through leaving me cold and wet. Thinking I'll send it back to Westcomb and see what they say. As an aside, I love the upper pockets cuz they're perfect for storing food while touring. But the placement of one of the zippers (likely the side zips) interferes with the waistbelt of a pack (at least three different packs I've tried), and it digs in to my hips. To the point where I start to bleed. Nothing I've tried (save unbuckling the packs waist strap) actually helps. YMMV and all that, just a heads up.
I mentioned in my review above it's about as warm as a nanopuff from patagucci. Yeah it's not the warmest thing ever, but you can leave it on most of the time it seems.Quote:
Originally Posted by auvgeek
^^You're right. Sorry, I missed that sentence in your review.
My main point still stands, though. I don't understand why breatheability seems to be a main selling point (rather than warmth) in these types of jacket. I'm not saying you guys are idiots; I'm genuinely trying to understand what I'm missing. Maybe I just live in a warmer climate and run super hot so there's no way I'm wearing an insulated jacket any time I'm moving.
I guess it depends on your climate and what you use it for. If you're using it for being around camp or when you stop moving then yeah breathability isn't as big an issue. Sometimes in those situations you are still sweating from the activity.Quote:
Originally Posted by auvgeek
However if you're using this for something like skinning up on a cold day where you need a bit of warmth still while you're moving it's perfect. Or mt biking on a cold day. I'd REALLY like to see this alpha material used inside a neoshell shell for a resort jacket.
I grew up in Minnesota (dang cold). I now live in seattle (not cold at all). So i run real hot and don't really need warmth, especially if i get moving. That's why i look for breathability over warmth. Pretty much anything will be warm enough for me. Make sense?Quote:
Originally Posted by auvgeek
Sent from my Q10 using TGR Forums
Not really. If you run that hot, why are you wearing an insulated jacket?! That's the real question I'm asking.Quote:
Originally Posted by austriker
I'm really not trying to be a dick. I'm trying to learn about different layering methods and approaches. Maybe I'll pick up a Tango at some point to compare to my Rab Xenon. I'm just trying to understand why people care so much about breatheability in an insulated jacket. I want my softshells (and hardshells) to optimize waterproofing, weight, and breatheability, but I just want my insulated jackets to maximize the warmth/weight ratio. (Durability also a factor in both, obviously.)
I don't get it either. Is it basically a fleece replacement? If so, how is it better? The only time I wear insulation going uphill is when it's very, very cold and I'm with people who are much slower than me, so I'm not sweating.Quote:
Originally Posted by auvgeek
It's common to throw on insulation when you're sweating at the end of a climb. It's never been a problem for me, but perhaps more breathable insulation would allow your base layers to dry out faster?
I appreciate breathability in a synthetic insulated jacket, but I don't know what I'm doing most of the time anyways. For me it's a replacement for both fleece and down jacket.
I have two different use cases for it:
1. After the ascent for the descent: I usually wear the light insulated jacket as an outer shell when it's dry. As I sweat a lot on my way up I appreciate if the insulated jacket does a good job getting the sweat away when I sweat a little more on my way down. Then I feel much more comfortable when my first layer is not soaked an I'm having the obligatory after tour coffee and pastry (I'm currently in Italy). Plus it is more windproof than a fleece which is nice on the descent and it takes abuse better than a lightweight dow puffy.
2. When it's friggin' cold for resort/slackcountry telemarking: as doing tele lunges gets me quite sweaty, too, I appreciate it if the insulated jacket – which now serves as a mid layer – doesn't get soaked and looses some of its warmth when wet.
On the Atom LT vs Xenon...Quote:
Originally Posted by auvgeek
Breathability, in general, means you will dry out faster. One of Twight's original selling points of the synthetic belay jacket was it is something you can throw on over your softshell/windshirt when you stop moving fast. This will then dry out your sweaty (or wet from precip) "action" layers with the moisture movement encouraged by the temperature (and humidity) gradient between your warm core and the cold air. The less blockage of that process, the faster the transportation takes place. The faster that transportation can take place, the faster you will dry out.
Of course, you still have to maintain that barrier between your core and the cold air to maintain warmth. Fleece doesn't work because it lets the air in and evaporative and convective cooling makes you cold. So it's a balance.
The atom LT is a completely different animal from the Xenon and shouldn't be used in the same way. Think of it more as an action layer like a softshell...but different. It is a combination of something like a lightweight belay jacket and fleece panels. It's pretty darn warm compared to a lightweight windshirt but will also dump a lot of heat pretty fast especially if it's windy. As such, it's not a stand alone piece for warmth but a pretty reasonable option for an action layer on a very cold day. As you noted, it's too breathable to keep you warm when you stop. However, If you throw the Xenon over the top and shut down the rapid heat loss path through the fleece side panels, now you have quite a bit of insulation (essentially 120g/m^2 synthetic insulation which should be 20% warmer than the atom SV) and minimal evaporative/convective cooling for a comparatively pretty small amount of weight in your pack (Xenon is something like 11oz and SV is over 18oz and not as warm as the LT/Xenon system). Basically, with the atom LT you can wear some of your belay jacket while you're moving but not suffer from overheating due to the extremely breathable fleece side panels.
Interesting tidbit: In talking to Steve House (uh oh, name drop!) at the Ouray ice festival, we got on this subject. I always thought of the nanopuff as a very breathable piece and any kind of membrane softshell like the knifeblade as less breathable. He noted that thickness also contributes greatly to the breathability numbers. Thus, simply by being quite thick, the nanopuff doesn't actually breath as well as the knifeblade which has, by definition, a much steeper temperature gradient between the inside and outside of the fabric (assuming it's worn somewhere close to your warm body).
^^Boom! Thanks for droppin' some knowledge on me. Really appreciate the helpful and insightful post.
I guess you confirmed my suspicions—the Atom LT or Tango makes sense if it's really cold and you can wear it without sweating. It's just not that cold where I live and I run really hot anyway. I'd be really curious to see how it would compare to a vapor barrier in those conditions.
PS. Xenon did great on my walk home from class at 33F tonight. That feeling is as close as I've gotten to being in the mountains in months...:(
Can anybody comment on the fit of the Revenant vs. the Mirage. I've got a large Mirage that is a little to tight in the mid-section area, but otherwise fits nicely.
Revenant and mirage fit should be same. Vapor fx opens up nicely
Thanks! Anybody have a L Vapor FX they're looking to sell? Probably going to be tough to find one I'm guessing.Quote:
Originally Posted by whyturn
There is this one on fleabay
http://m.ebay.com/itm/281223022804
Not mine, but I happened to see it
Large on eBay should work and price is good. I have XL but went From xxl mirage
Update:
So, I now have about 25 nordic tours on my Skeena Hoody. I don't wear it for alpine because I have a Vapor FX for that. The Skeena is probably my favorite piece of outerwear. I find that, temperature-wise, I am comfortable in a range of conditions from below-zero cold to mid-40's while skiing. During very cold days, I wear my R1 underneath and on less cold days, I wear a Cap 3 or similar. It sheds light precipitation and breathes very well. Overall, I have only one complaint. I absolutely cannot stand the elastic cuffs. While the soft fleece lining them slightly deters irritation, I find that on longer excursions, my glove cuff still manages to chafe my wrist.