Tell me about flat pedals

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Originally Posted by Wes Mantooth

Ok for those of you like me who didn't want to buy flat pedal specific shoes as you tried out flats - just shut up and do it. I started to get the hang of flats with my chambers sans cleats but yesterday tried a pair of 510 freeriders and had my mind blown. The grip literally felt like I was in clips again if not better. The chambers had decent grip on the pins but nothing compared to 510s, and mainly the softer sole on the 510s allowed me to feel the pedal way more and grab the pedals with my feet. Main advantage areas were bunny hopping and jumping since I felt like I could pop the bike and hold it in the air, even adjust direction in the air. My feet also got knocked out of position less especially when climbing techy sections. Honestly from my experience flats with good shoes and pedals don't feel that different from clips. Still not sure which one I like better but the fact that I'm already asking that after only 2 weeks on flats tells me something

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Yeah, I bought some 5/10s and I cannot believe the grip. I was practicing manuals and went over backward. The damn shoes didn't release! If I had been clipped in I would have released. Honestly, it freaked me out. That millisecond of realizing my foot is still stuck to the peddle at a 90 degree angle was not fun. I changed out the pedal studs (is that what they're called?) to a shorter version.

Rode our tech area with the dogs to see how I'd fair and was thoroughly impressed with the grip.

Yeah... that's what we've been trying to tell people dipping their toe in the flat pedal water. ;) The pedal is only half the system... good flat pedals with shitty hard rubber shoes will feel like garbage.

Not flat pedal specific, but I’ve been using Boreal Bambas for a few years on flats and they’re really great. Sticky rubber, leather upper with toe bumper. Great protection and grip.


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Originally Posted by Andeh

Yeah... that's what we've been trying to tell people dipping their toe in the flat pedal water. ;) The pedal is only half the system... good flat pedals with shitty hard rubber shoes will feel like garbage.

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Totally. You guys said it all along I just needed to experience it for myself. But I do think the time I spent getting used to flats with really stiff soled shoes helped rip the bandaid off since it forced good gripping technique

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Originally Posted by Andeh

Yeah... that's what we've been trying to tell people dipping their toe in the flat pedal water. ;) The pedal is only half the system... good flat pedals with shitty hard rubber shoes will feel like garbage.

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Originally Posted by MagnificentUnicorn

Not flat pedal specific, but I’ve been using Boreal Bambas for a few years on flats and they’re really great. Sticky rubber, leather upper with toe bumper. Great protection and grip.


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Originally Posted by Wes Mantooth

Totally. You guys said it all along I just needed to experience it for myself. But I do think the time I spent getting used to flats with really stiff soled shoes helped rip the bandaid off since it forced good gripping technique

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5tens are great. Impacts only for me. Freeriders are too flexy and the others dont have the pedal coverage of the impacts. Still, 5tens are adidas and their quality/durability has slipped a bit. Good news is this year specialed and ride concepts rubber is on par with 5ten stealth rubber. Ive been on flats for quite a few years now so i can usually adapt to harder or grippier rubber, to a point, but i still need something with a good design and relatively sticky. My 2 year old ride concepts have been awesome. Most comfortable flat shoe ive had and great styling. The d30 insoles are super cush and i'd imagine some safety benefit. Im holding off on a new pair atm but theyre near the top of the list. I think the new ride concepts with the new rubber will be the complete package. Not sure if the sale is still on but buy a pair and get a pair of their sandals for free(nice sandals). Ill see if i can find the ad

https://rideconcepts.com/?utm_source...aXZlLmNhIn0%3D

Id buy another livewire but i wouldnt mind some powerline's. 50% more $'s though seems a bit steep on the jump for an inside ankle guard. No problem with the livewire thus far. Ive worn them a lot, everywhere, all day

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Originally Posted by grinch

5tens are great. Impacts only for me. Freeriders are too flexy and the others dont have the pedal coverage of the impacts. Still, 5tens are adidas and their quality/durability has slipped a bit.

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Yeah the freeriders don't seem like particularly high quality shoes and the soles are a lot softer than I expected, but I got a pair used twice for like $30 so no complaints here. The shoe-pedal connection feels like velcro. If I stick with flats I may consider the specialized ones or RC

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Originally Posted by Wes Mantooth

Yeah the freeriders don't seem like particularly high quality shoes and the soles are a lot softer than I expected, but I got a pair used twice for like $30 so no complaints here. The shoe-pedal connection feels like velcro. If I stick with flats I may consider the specialized ones or RC

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Friends did that. They stick but they also realized the error in short order. They went through them relatively quick and got something else. They didnt pay $30 though. They work pretty good, my friends just had impacts previously so they had something to compare them too.I hear the dirt jumpers like the freeriders

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Originally Posted by Wes Mantooth

The shoe-pedal connection feels like velcro.

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Remember that velcro ski binding joke video? That's a borderline reasonable idea for bike pedals/shoes.

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Originally Posted by Dantheman

Remember that velcro ski binding joke video? That's a borderline reasonable idea for bike pedals/shoes.

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Kind of like the *gasp* magnets

Local guy uses those magnet 'clipless' pedals + five ten hellcat style clip/flat shoes for lots of riding. Far from a ripper, but see him at MTB and CX races on those, seem to work fine.

As a part time flat pedal rider, I've found the Freeriders to be perfectly fine, especially if you can find them on sale. Got mine on sale for a hideous red color a few years ago and they're holding up fine for use 1x week mostly w/ my kids (rest of my rides are clipped in).

The problem with freeriders is theyre fine until theyre not. Pedaling through technical sections, on most trails, theres always that possibility you will catch your toe or the front of your foot. The freeriders will fold in half like your foot. Clipless shoes with a solid platform and a toe cap give a lot of protection against that. A good flat pedal mtb shoe will fold a bit to be comfortable to walk in but wont revererse fold and risk breaking a foot or toe. Pedaling on flats you do catch more trail obstacles because your always pushing on the pedal to stay attached and will resist pulling , even in those tech situations. Thats the main reason i want a new pair of RC livewires. The sole has lost some of that reverse stiffness that stops them from folding. Not quite freeride reverse flex level but approaching that. Its been on my mind.

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I can’t stand that Five Ten isn’t consistent with fit/size from year to year and between models. Super annoying to order a shoe in the size you’ve been riding for years, only to have it too narrow or too short.


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5tens are a little too wide in the forefoot for me.
My older vans flat pedal shoe has been good. Nit the stickiest but not bad. Not the stiffest but stiff and have remained the same. Theyve held up really well except the sole and rand started delaming. I fust pored some crazy glue in the delam and all good. Also owned by adidas so thars probably the delam issue. I bet Cab will make a half cab mtb shoe soon. He still makes phat $ off of his shoes. Vans/adidas so they could have syealth rubberAttachment 373580

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What's out there for flat pedal shoes that hike reasonably? My 5.10s are fine to walk around in, but pushing a bike up a steep muddy hill is desperate. Something with the stick dot pattern in the middle but a lugged pattern front and rear would seem ideal.

Five Ten Trailcross

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Originally Posted by grinch

5tens are a little too wide in the forefoot for me.
My older vans flat pedal shoe has been good. Nit the stickiest but not bad. Not the stiffest but stiff and have remained the same. Theyve held up really well except the sole and rand started delaming. I fust pored some crazy glue in the delam and all good. Also owned by adidas so thars probably the delam issue. I bet Cab will make a half cab mtb shoe soon. He still makes phat $ off of his shoes. Vans/adidas so they could have syealth rubberAttachment 373580

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Shoo goo or aquaseal is yer friend

510 Freerider Pro is a significantly better shoe than the standard Freerider IMHO. Less liner/foam to absorb water. Harder material / water resistant outer / toecap...

Swapping out the laces for elastic lock laces is a clutch upgrade.


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Originally Posted by XXX-er

Shoo goo or aquaseal is yer friend

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Haaa after i posted that i immediately thought "what would xxxer use, or Thom.
3 mini tubes of crazy glue for $1 from the store by the same name for a quick fix. Left shoe has a tiny seperation again so shoo goo or aqua seal may happen yet, if my $1 three packs of the crazy glue stockpile is dried up that is

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Originally Posted by grinch

Haaa after i posted that i immediately thought "what would xxxer use, or Thom.
3 mini tubes of crazy glue for $1 from the store by the same name for a quick fix. Left shoe has a tiny seperation again so shoo goo or aqua seal may happen yet, if my $1 three packs of the crazy glue stockpile is dried up that is

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if you need to use AQS to fill an open wound like when the toe rand opens up from the shoe,

I would get some in there with a toothpick or nail of sft BUT AQS is not a contact kind of a glue so its not gona stick until its either clamped, or almost dry and almost dry would be 8-10hrs, wait 8-10 hrs and it will probably stick if you squeeze it all together

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Originally Posted by Andeh

Five Ten Trailcross

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Thanks, sounds exactly like what I'm looking for.

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Originally Posted by meter-man

Thanks for the advice y'all. Settled on DMR Vaults. Found some for 35% off at chain reaction cycles. Will report back.

Contacts look really good too...and I would still like to try some of that convex bullshit out...someday.

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Originally Posted by Summit

Most sensible comment on the subject, ever

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Originally Posted by jm2e

Because some people will literally believe any bullshit.

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Originally Posted by slowroastin

To match the natural concave of a human foot.


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After using DMR Vaults for a couple years and a rebuild that left something to be desired, decided to give the Canfield Crampon Mountains a try (the convex bullshit). Short story: the Crampons have WAY better grip. I was really surprised. It might just be the longer pins, or maybe my shoe (Ride Concepts Powerline) is soft enough to take advantage of the convexity, or what, but I much preferred them to my Vaults.

Can't say I have noticed the thinner leading edge (presumably fewer pedal strikes), but I have noticed they do pedal more smoothly than my Vaults (possibly due to my rebuild or not).

I was worried about cramping, as cydwhit mentioned, since I have cramping/nerve problems underfoot from SPDs/clipless. I noticed the increased pressure under-arch from the Crampons on my first ride, but no cramping. But I can't report any problems on that front yet.

Will report back after 1000 miles or so on durability.

Here's some more flat pedal spew for anyone in the hunt for new pedals:

Last week, I landed a little table kinda funny, such that one of my Tenet Occults hit the dirt pretty hard. Immediately after there was clicking. I pulled it apart to service, and sure enough, a couple of those tiny little outer bearings had cracked open. I spent a good hour trying to pull the outer races out before aborting, and emailed the company. They replied promptly and directed me to their free service program (just $8 for shipping). I got tracking number for the pedals on their way back already. So, pretty damn good service. It looks like from their website that they might actually be getting stock again soon, and from a recent email teaser might be starting to make their stuff in Bellingham soon instead of sourcing from Asia.

In the meantime, I've been riding Burgtec Mk5s. They're pretty. And lighter. But the grip isn't as mindblowing as the Occults. My biggest complaint is that there's no pins next to the axle, and the bulge there combined with the slippery machined finish makes it feel slippery. It also seems like that by pure chance, their pin positions seem to not align well with the dots on my size 9.5 Five Tens, so that my feet always seem to drift outward from my preferred location. But if I plant my foot a bit further forward (spindle closer to midfoot as opposed to lined up with ball of foot), they don't budge at all. I think I'm going to unload these as soon as the Occults get back.

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Originally Posted by meter-man

After using DMR Vaults for a couple years and a rebuild that left something to be desired, decided to give the Canfield Crampon Mountains a try (the convex bullshit). Short story: the Crampons have WAY better grip. I was really surprised. It might just be the longer pins, or maybe my shoe (Ride Concepts Powerline) is soft enough to take advantage of the convexity, or what, but I much preferred them to my Vaults.

Can't say I have noticed the thinner leading edge (presumably fewer pedal strikes), but I have noticed they do pedal more smoothly than my Vaults (possibly due to my rebuild or not).

I was worried about cramping, as cydwhit mentioned, since I have cramping/nerve problems underfoot from SPDs/clipless. I noticed the increased pressure under-arch from the Crampons on my first ride, but no cramping. But I can't report any problems on that front yet.

Will report back after 1000 miles or so on durability.

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I have canfield mt crampons on both bikes now. Just rebuilt the older pair. I ride flats a little more to the center of the foot so convex fits well. One of the thinnest pedals too and its hard to go thicker after having something as thin. More stable, less pedal roll , planted when theyre thin
. Slight convex shape, longish pins and thin ftw. Ez rebuild too after i ground the 6mm(i think its 6) on my Y wrench into a thin walled 6mm to fit in the pedal to get the axle/bearing locking nut off/on. Changed bushing/bearings in about a half hr

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+1 on the crampons. Those things are legit shin wreckers but they stick so well my shins are usually just fine.

Im not going to make any claims on being super tuned to flats, so i dont jinx my self, but so far so good but i really hope i dont catch a pedsl to the shin. That definitely crosses my mind. Exploded my rear der earlier today and did a couple chainless laps. Forgot i was chainless and went for some quick pedal strokes to make a gap. Close csll as i spun my feet off and somehow i didnt get stung. Suspension was working great though, even though i think i blew my dvo jade as well

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I’m gonna piggyback a question to this thread. I haven’t read the entire thread but I’m a recent flat convert and have been riding on Five Ten’s. They have incredible sticktion but after 2 months the rubber sole is already delaminating in several areas. Are they the only show in town? Any recommendations for something more durable but still grippy? Lighter weight would be a plus as well.

fix em with shoo goo

arent the 5 10 soles just soft rubber which is gona break down ?

My shoes has a squiggley pattern of ribs that the pins fit into that seem to last

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Originally Posted by XXX-er

fix em with shoo goo

arent the 5 10 soles just soft rubber which is gona break down ?

My shoes has a squiggley pattern of ribs that the pins fit into that seem to last

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I've got 5.10 Impacts that I'm still running that I bought in 2016. Soles are roughed up pretty good, but no delam issues.

I'd personally return them for warranty, since they are so new...

Recently picked up a pair of Ride Concepts Hellcats and could not be happier with them.

Had been looking for something similar to the old 661 SPDs and the hellcats fit the bill.

The main reason for not going with free rides is because I knew they were going to fall apart in short order. The Ride Concepts construction seems bomber so far. They are also stiff soled and very supportive. A+ from me

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Originally Posted by east or bust

Recently picked up a pair of Ride Concepts Hellcats and could not be happier with them.

Had been looking for something similar to the old 661 SPDs and the hellcats fit the bill.

The main reason for not going with free rides is because I knew they were going to fall apart in short order. The Ride Concepts construction seems bomber so far. They are also stiff soled and very supportive. A+ from me

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Please provide update in 3 years. :D

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Originally Posted by skaredshtles

Please provide update in 3 years. :D

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Five Ten quality and durability has reportedly gone downhill since Adidas acquired them.

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Originally Posted by Dantheman

Five Ten quality and durability has reportedly gone downhill since Adidas acquired them.

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I, too, have heard this. All the more reason to warranty them bishes. Just keep making 'em give you new shoes if they fall apart. :D

Ride concepts are great. 3 yrs on mine as my main shoe. Still going but need a replacement. Picked up the new etnies culvert mtb shoe. Working very well. If they last like the ride concepts theyll be as good. Nice features on the etnies

https://etnies.com/collections/mens/...mid-black-lime

Sign up for the newsletter and get 20% off and free shipping. Pretty sick deal actually

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Just got in line for a set of Tenet Occult flats. Says sometime in October. Not sure why I latched on to these, but why fucking not. TMACs are selling for $180 now, which is outrageous, but they do seem to be the best flat out there. Pricey enough to drive me to try other options.

PSA: Ride Concepts has the Powerline marked-down 30%, and they are red.

The ride concepts don’t fit my feet well. I picked up some new 5.10s I can walk around in too. They don’t have the Uber sticky rubber, but are no slouch and are holding up really well. Sample size
Me.


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Bought some Ride Concepts women's (<- don't tell him) Livewire for my 10 y/o son for $30 on REI Outlet. Seem to be pretty good quality and a maybe bit stickier rubber than my daughters 5.10 Freerider Youth w/ Stealth Marathon which is a bit different than normal Freerider stealth I think. We'll see how they hold up, but one ride so far so good.

I think I'm taking a hiatus from flat pedal riding myself, have been doing it on my hardtail, mostly w/ kids and to work on some bike skills. This morning tagged chainring/chain on a big rock on an ill-timed bunny-hop and is likely gonna cost me a new chain, which as we all know is either price gouged or impossible to find. Hopefully I can find the link and swap w/a quicklink instead.

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Originally Posted by VTskibum

Bought some Ride Concepts women's (<- don't tell him) Livewire for my 10 y/o son for $30 on REI Outlet. Seem to be pretty good quality and a maybe bit stickier rubber than my daughters 5.10 Freerider Youth w/ Stealth Marathon which is a bit different than normal Freerider stealth I think. We'll see how they hold up, but one ride so far so good.

I think I'm taking a hiatus from flat pedal riding myself, have been doing it on my hardtail, mostly w/ kids and to work on some bike skills. This morning tagged chainring/chain on a big rock on an ill-timed bunny-hop and is likely gonna cost me a new chain, which as we all know is either price gouged or impossible to find. Hopefully I can find the link and swap w/a quicklink instead.

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sounds like you need a bash guard and not new shoes ;)

Ha while that’s true, I don’t have a bash guard but do own multiple pair of spd pedals and shoes. So problem solved.

Root cause was flats are really dumb, kinda fun and useful for some skill development, but are definitely dumb. Won’t be my last go w flats, but going fast = clipless.


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