G3 ION tech binding

Has anyone here received one of these yet? I have one on order from a local retailer to go along with my new skis, and they got them in stock a couple of weeks ago. They haven't shipped them out to me yet however because they say there is something missing in the boxes; a plate that's supposed to go under the binding to protect the spring mechanism from snow and ice. They say they're awaiting an answer from G3. I'm wondering if this is global, or just something that has affected one shipment of bindings. It's really damn annoying either way.

Maybe this is in this thread somewhere...but does anyone know how much travel the "forward pressure" spring has on the ion? 10mm? It looks like the dynafit radical 2.0 is also mounted with basically no tech gap and has 10mm travel in the heal unit. Wondering how the Ion compares.

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Originally Posted by garuda

Maybe this is in this thread somewhere...but does anyone know how much travel the "forward pressure" spring has on the ion? 10mm? It looks like the dynafit radical 2.0 is also mounted with basically no tech gap and has 10mm travel in the heal unit. Wondering how the Ion compares.

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Wildsnow said the Ion spring was 6mm.

I wonder if the boot stop guide things can be removed. It would be nice to lighten these up a little.

I'm pretty much sold on these. Mainly for the snow clearing channel under the toe. That's my one major gripe with my verticals. having a little 'elasticity' doesn't sound bad either.

IONs have a flatter ramp angle as well, don't they (thanks to the clearing channel under the springs?)

anyone have a comparison of Ion max heel lifter height vs dynafit vertical or radical? i have 29.0 boots and that's been one of my complaints w/ the dynafits...the heel elevators are seemingly designed for small european feet.

Just an FYI, B & D makes heel lift extensions for verts and rads

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Originally Posted by neck beard

IONs have a flatter ramp angle as well, don't they (thanks to the clearing channel under the springs?)

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Correct

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Originally Posted by XXX-er

Just an FYI, B & D makes heel lift extensions for verts and rads

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Yep aware of that option...need to buy a new topplate to go w/ the tall volcano though for the Verticals. Was just curious on the G3 Ion elevator height since it doesn't seem to get mentioned by reviewers AFAIK

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Originally Posted by frorider

Yep aware of that option...need to buy a new topplate to go w/ the tall volcano though for the Verticals. Was just curious on the G3 Ion elevator height since it doesn't seem to get mentioned by reviewers AFAIK

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From the G3 Digital Catalog:

https://www.tetongravity.com/images/..._am__forum.png

To help with accuracy and confirmation of this G3 Template, from those who have mounted and tested G3 IONs, please provide:

-BSL (measured horizontally, NOT what's marked on the boot)? ________
-Distance from BSC to Pin Line? ________
-Distance from BSC to closest screw line for heel piece? ________
-Approximate location of heel relative to center of heel adjustment area? ________

http://www.slidewright.com/Bindings/G3_ION_Template.jpg

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Originally Posted by Alpinord

From the G3 Digital Catalog:

https://www.tetongravity.com/images/..._am__forum.png

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Measured ramp by WildSnow is 13mm so maybe not so neutral ramp after all? The specs are a bit misleading if this is correct.

Oh - and anybody know if it can be used with the Beast heel fitting?

Ion pin delta is pretty high:
http://skimo.co/pin-heights
About the same as the final generations of the Speed/Classic, although less than all the current Dynafit touring models.

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Originally Posted by Jonathan S.

Ion pin delta is pretty high:
http://skimo.co/pin-heights
About the same as the final generations of the Speed/Classic, although less than all the current Dynafit touring models.

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thx for the link to the table. generally speaking it seems most people (incl me) are happy with a 5 mm shim under the toepiece of the dynafits on that table that have an inherent delta of 15-16 mm. i.e. a pin delta of 10-11 mm feels about 'neutral' and similar to the mild ramp of a typical alpine setup. so I think the g3 Ion pin delta of 11 mm probably support their claim of "3 degrees (or 'neutral'), matches ski boot mfgers intended angle".

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Originally Posted by superdigg

Measured ramp by WildSnow is 13mm so maybe not so neutral ramp after all? The specs are a bit misleading if this is correct.

Oh - and anybody know if it can be used with the Beast heel fitting?

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The 13mm is the difference in pin heights on the pre-production model, that seems to be different than the pin heights listed in the skimo link that Jonathan provided. While comparing the Radical ST vs. the ION(production version for sale) the flatter ramp of the ION is easy to visualize without measuring and looks to be minimal like the specifications from G3 posted above.

Interestingly that's quite different to the 5mm pin delta of the Onyx. Which I thought was pretty perfect.

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Originally Posted by frorider

generally speaking it seems most people (incl me) are happy with a 5 mm shim under the toepiece of the dynafits on that table that have an inherent delta of 15-16 mm. i.e. a pin delta of 10-11 mm feels about 'neutral' and similar to the mild ramp of a typical alpine setup.

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Perhaps, but that still means most skiers don't know how much better they might ski with nearly zero pin delta (especially since that still imparts some binding delta because of the interface placement on the boot).

I would be nice to have an essentially flat pintech touring binding other that the Beast. I might shim the ION if I buy a pair, 5-6 mm would give a flat Delta I think.

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Originally Posted by Knut

Interestingly that's quite different to the 5mm pin delta of the Onyx. Which I thought was pretty perfect.

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Wild snow measured the Onyx pins as 12mm height difference.

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Originally Posted by Jonathan S.

Perhaps, but that still means most skiers don't know how much better they might ski with nearly zero pin delta (especially since that still imparts some binding delta because of the interface placement on the boot).

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Its easy to change delta with a toe shim but on many boots its not always easy to change forward lean but the change in delta changes the forward lean SO is it about the delta or the change in forward lean ?

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Originally Posted by XXX-er

Its easy to change delta with a toe shim but on many boots its not always easy to change forward lean but the change in delta changes the forward lean SO is it about the delta or the change in forward lean ?

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They're all different.
They interact with other of course, but ideally you want each one set, well, ideally.

I agree with you 100% ... ideally ;)

Would be cool if there was a program that you could put in your vital information (guessing leg bone length, foot size), the way you like to ski and the boot you have and it would spit out a ramp delta that works best. Myself I have been moving towards less cuff lean and less delta in my bindings over the last 5 or 6 years as I try to find a more neutral/relaxed/upright skiing posture. Just kind of guessing at things and how I want my skiing style to feel. Since changes often happen between seasons it is a bit difficult to tell the impact on my skiing. The other problem is that the gear has improved so much (big part of the reason for changing body posture) that that as well makes comparisons difficult.

Thread drift I know, but since doing yoga I pay more attention to these things and it all seems a bit vague in terms of real information.

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Originally Posted by cat in january

Would be cool if there was a program that you could put in your vital information (guessing leg bone length, foot size), the way you like to ski and the boot you have and it would spit out a ramp delta that works best. Myself I have been moving towards less cuff lean and less delta in my bindings over the last 5 or 6 years as I try to find a more neutral/relaxed/upright skiing posture. Just kind of guessing at things and how I want my skiing style to feel. Since changes often happen between seasons it is a bit difficult to tell the impact on my skiing. The other problem is that the gear has improved so much (big part of the reason for changing body posture) that that as well makes comparisons difficult.

Thread drift I know, but since doing yoga I pay more attention to these things and it all seems a bit vague in terms of real information.

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I think starting with a flat delta angle would benefit most people and that should be the starting point. I think one of the reasons that STH/FFG and LOOK/Rossi(some) are popular is that they have flatter delta angles and they "feel" more natural when skiing.

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Originally Posted by AaronWright

Wild snow measured the Onyx pins as 12mm height difference.

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My bad, I confused PIN delta with ramp angle (with the latter being the only valuable information for the user, imo)

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Originally Posted by wildsnow

Hence, it [the ONYX] has things like a modern (near neutral) ramp angle (4 mm positive, same as Fritschi)

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Originally Posted by AaronWright

I think starting with a flat delta angle would benefit most people and that should be the starting point.

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Delta of the boot soles front-to-heel: yes!

Delta of the pins: no!
(the toe pins are considerably lower in the boot than the heel pins. A zero pin delta would result in a negative sole ramp. --Which would probably still result in a positive foot ramp, given that most ski boots have a considerable sole ramp angle in the inner sole themselves. But that's alright and what we generally want.)

A pin delta of around 10 mm is in my eyes optimal and results in just a minimal sole ramp like most alpine binders have it. The beast with 8 mm pin delta results basically in a flat shoe position on the ski.