To Vaccinate or Not---The Rat Flu Odyssey Continues

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Originally Posted by wooley12

FK, you are annoying.

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True, but his sig is awesome

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Originally Posted by The AD

How are we ever going to know whether it's the thoughts or the prayers that are working better if we always use both of them?

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Let me pray on that a bit & I’ll get back to you

Skidog is asking questions about something that hasn’t been implemented by OSHA yet. AFAIK- there is only a request from the President that they use their rule making authority to issue rules for vaccination or testing.

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Originally Posted by The AD

I'm curious how they knew that they were "false positives?"

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they were tested like 2 or 3 times subsequently, 2 rapid and another PCR all negative...

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Originally Posted by old_newguy

Skidog is asking questions about something that hasn’t been implemented by OSHA yet. AFAIK- there is only a request from the President that they use their rule making authority to issue rules for vaccination or testing.

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I wondered if there was some written part of that OSHA req and how it would apply here. I understand that the mandate isn't in place yet, but we have some details, just wondered if the TGR think tank had something more...If not I can wait, I was just wondering is all..doesnt apply to me personally so, I guess i fall in the "fuck em" camp???

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Originally Posted by The AD

How are we ever going to know whether it's the thoughts or the prayers that are working better if we always use both of them?

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Testing is the answer

But whatever we do…keep doing both

The answers are in history:

Leper colonies!!

No Vax Containment Camps!!

Negative rapid tests gets you a day pass out to work.


Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

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Originally Posted by Skidog

they were tested like 2 or 3 times subsequently, 2 rapid and another PCR all negative...

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But isn't the vaccine supposed to decrease the duration of the infection? Maybe they were true positives, but cleared quickly? I don't know enough about the testing to know if this makes sense or not.

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Originally Posted by The AD

But isn't the vaccine supposed to decrease the duration of the infection? Maybe they were true positives, but cleared quickly? I don't know enough about the testing to know if this makes sense or not.

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nor do i....just what i had seen in the "news". I despise those cackling crows.

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Originally Posted by Kinnikinnick

The answers are in history:

Leper colonies!!

No Vax Containment Camps!!

Negative rapid tests gets you a day pass out to work.


Sent from my iPhone using TGR Forums

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Arent the Red states kinda doing this themselves? LOL

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Originally Posted by old_newguy

AFAIK, There is no exception to vaccination for federal employees, federal contractors or healthcare workers that work for an organization that takes Medicare.

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this^^^ is also my understanding.


of course, the other thing I saw last night was reports of lawsuits being filed to block the mandate -

... expect there to be significant pressure for expedited court action, but this is likely to take weeks to months ( to years ) ...


skiJ

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Originally Posted by The AD

How are we ever going to know whether it's the thoughts or the prayers that are working better if we always use both of them?

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And how do we know that either of them is safe? I mean if I accidentally pray to Shiva the destroyer?

Or if I think of Hitler?

Attachment 387260

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/202...ee1721aecd.jpg

^^^ I saw that yesterday and thought about this thread

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Originally Posted by skiJ

this^^^ is also my understanding.


of course, the other thing I saw last night was reports of lawsuits being filed to block the mandate -

... expect there to be significant pressure for expedited court action, but this is likely to take weeks to months ( to years ) ...


skiJ

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I’m not sure that SCOTUS will touch this. Amy Coney Island already dismissed one such lawsuit without even commenting.


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Pickleball old lady and her whole vaxxed household had some breakthroughs.

She was back out playing today, good as new. Makes me happy.

There should be a special acronym for the supreme court republicans of the united states.

SCROTUS

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Originally Posted by old_newguy

AFAIK, There is no exception to vaccination for federal employees, federal contractors or healthcare workers that work for an organization that takes Medicare.

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It was an executive order which only affects executive branch employees. The majority of federal government employees get an exemption under the latest executive order, including all of Congress + staff.

Funny that the last sentence gets pushed under the rug considering the significance.

Rules for thee, but not for me.

https://www.natlawreview.com/article...al-contractors
https://www.natlawreview.com/article...al-contractors

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Originally Posted by old goat

Thanks



A lot of semantics. Why is J and J's second dose called a booster in the article? Instead of the second of two doses like mRNAs. I realize that booster is being applied to doses beyond the initial Phase 3 trial regimen, but why is it so hard to understand that the ideal regimen might change over time. Booster has become a dirty word for some people.

To put it another way--aren't the people who say the vaccines were tested too quickly right, in one limited sense? As I recall the trials for all the US approved vaccines combined Phase II ad Phase III, but Phase II is normally where different doses are compared, isn't it? and that I don't believe was done in the trials. So now we're beginning to find out what the ideal dose might be.

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they interviewed a researcher ( I think he was from U of texas) on " quirks and quarks " a cbc science show and he said a lot of the science was already done 5 yrs previous on SARS so they downloaded the data and knocked out a spiked protein model in < an hr from existing research,

also there was none of the usual foot dragging that happens in research instead of doing one after the other they were doing phase one/ two / three all at the same time to speed things up

On another show they interviewed the prof from UBC who worked on the delivery method, when asked how long he was working on this he said 40 yrs

So the vaccine is not < 2yrs old there was a lot of previous science and i think the Covid vaccine was not spun very well

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Originally Posted by old goat

Thanks



A lot of semantics. Why is J and J's second dose called a booster in the article? Instead of the second of two doses like mRNAs. I realize that booster is being applied to doses beyond the initial Phase 3 trial regimen, but why is it so hard to understand that the ideal regimen might change over time. Booster has become a dirty word for some people.

To put it another way--aren't the people who say the vaccines were tested too quickly right, in one limited sense? As I recall the trials for all the US approved vaccines combined Phase II ad Phase III, but Phase II is normally where different doses are compared, isn't it? and that I don't believe was done in the trials. So now we're beginning to find out what the ideal dose might be.

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goat -

I will take a crack at this - and gladly delete my post If Mofro, LSL, or Multi- have better information -

Please remember these vaccines were developed as part of an (emergency) response -
that allows the Government And the Companies to streamline the development-and-approval process.
still, testing is ongoing --

Please recognize the abcnews report is based on a (J&J) press release -
thus, we are seeing a second interpretation
( for example, the report claims the second dose of J&J is 100% effective against 'severe disease'
( no one would make that claim based on science ( and testing ) ( - one would simply say, with a second dose, there were no cases of 'severe disease' in the testing ) --


regarding boosters and use of the term/word 'boosters' , I will speculate -

J&J developed a single-dose vaccine ;
I believe the press release ( - not the abcnews article - ) used the term, 'second dose' , but
the article uses the word booster, as it is commonly understood ;

my speculation is in the regulatory process, the term booster may have specific regulatory impact
( J&J may have to revise and refile their,,, ( vaccine for approval ) were they intending to alter their Approval ;

rather, with the additional testing, J&J appears to be able to move forward with their participation in the Vaccination program
( and may be later able to quietly amend their Approval., or it simply becomes a matter of 'accepted practice' for a second dose ( 'booster' ) to be administered two months to six months after the initial dose. )


regarding the idea of the term booster becoming a target of criticism ,,, I think I will say,
the testing shows Vaccination with the vaccines provides protection ( immunity for a period of time. ) and
additional testing confirms Vaccination provides protection And boosters provide additional protection ( greater immunity, And extended immunity )

If 'booster' is not the target of criticism, something else will be -


I have more, but I want to limit this post to responding to goat's post - before it is six pages buried.

thanks for ( listening) -- tj

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Originally Posted by Asspen

It was an executive order which only affects executive branch employees. The majority of federal government employees get an exemption under the latest executive order, including all of Congress + staff.

Funny that the last sentence gets pushed under the rug considering the significance.

Rules for thee, but not for me.

https://www.natlawreview.com/article...al-contractors
https://www.natlawreview.com/article...al-contractors

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Are you saying the majority of federal workers do not work for the executive branch?

I’m confused what your point is.

The only exemption is for reasons outlined by law.

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Originally Posted by The AD

But isn't the vaccine supposed to decrease the duration of the infection? Maybe they were true positives, but cleared quickly? I don't know enough about the testing to know if this makes sense or not.

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I didn’t follow this story. But they likely had additional rapid tests and also PCR confirmation tests done immediately after getting pulled off the show.

A positive rapid test on an asymptomatic person should prompt isolation of that person until a PCR test confirms they have covid. If an additional rapid test and a PCR test were done and they all came back negative it would suggest the initial rapid test was a false positive.

Smrter people in here can correct me if I got this wrong.

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Originally Posted by ill-advised strategy

SCROTUS

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we've reached a quorom.