If only there was something we could do...

Answers (not to be misconstrued as a defense or an endorsemnt) to some of the questions above:

- A small community of 16,000 has a SWAT team, armed school resource officers, Incident Command, etc., because the United States spends billions of dollars every year militarizing its police.

- The effort to ‘Harden’ campuses is now a $3 billion school security industry. It includes: Kevlar backpack inserts for children, bulletproof whiteboards, impact-resistant film for classroom windows, “ballistic attack resistant” door shields, armored saferooms, surveillance cameras and facial-recognition systems, software to monitor potential threats, gunshot and “aggression detector” microphones, even smoke cannons to disrupt an active shooter in progress.

- Local police and feds say they waited outside the door because two police were already shot by the shooter using the door as cover and because the shooter continued shoot at them from behind the classroom door. They believed the shooter barricaded himself inside intent on shooting more police. They now openly admit they fcked up.

- After the feds finally breached the door the shooter was hiding in a closet "and began firing when US Border Patrol agents entered the room more than an hour after the shooter began his rampage." The gunman is believed to have waited for the agents to enter the room, then kicked open the closet door and began shooting.

- Bobby is in fact winning so 'Get your crying done now' because Republicans are not passing shit. ← hat tip The Onion.

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Originally Posted by schuss

I just see an immature slap fight. It's not even entertaining.
To no one's shock, the answers given at the NRA convention (especially during the periods firearms are banned) are "more guns".
Why people keep electing these fucking douchenozzles is beyond me.

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This shouldn’t be entertaining. Posters like Bobby are the epitome of our stupid gun culture, posting pictures of his blinged out “toys”. It’s disgusting, it’s not really the guns that are the problem it’s the fetish of people playing with these instruments of death like they’re toys. Bobby said he doesn’t hunt, why does he need military style weapons exactly?


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Just to clarify, Multi-,
I read Alvarde has a school district police force. if that's just the school resource officers - "meh" I did not encounter a school police force until I was at a University with 50,000 students...

'Incident Command' is just chain of command - it sure should Not have been set-up inside the invaded school ( while law enforcement was outside tazing parents ) ;

Thank you for your insight regarding the school defense industry. tj

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Originally Posted by MagnificentUnicorn

This shouldn’t be entertaining. Posters like Bobby are the epitome of our stupid gun culture, posting pictures of his blinged out “toys”. It’s disgusting, it’s not really the guns that are the problem it’s the fetish of people playing with these instruments of death like they’re toys. Bobby said he doesn’t hunt, why does he need military style weapons exactly?


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The military doesn't use a 300blk SBR.

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Originally Posted by huckbucket

Love this analogy. Airplane manufacturers can be and are sued for deaths related to crashes, cigarette makers are liable for death related to smoking (based on hiding the link between smoking and cancer). But for some reason, suits against gun manufacturers hasn't put a big enough dent into sales, marketing and regulation. If that changes, at least manufacturers would have an incentive to get tougher on who owns and doesn't own a weapon.

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Gun manufacturers can’t be sued if their guns are used in a crime thanks to the Protection of Lawful Commerce in Arms Act. Really limits the cost for them. They can flood the market with lethal weapons essentially without consequences.

The Sandy Hook families got Remington by suing for their marketing campaign. Sure seems like the same law could be used against Daniels but Texas probably has even more protections for gun manufacturers.

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A small community of 16,000 has a SWAT team, armed school resource officers, Incident Command, etc., because the United States spends billions of dollars every year militarizing its police.

- The effort to ‘Harden’ campuses is now a $3 billion school security industry. It includes: Kevlar backpack inserts for children, bulletproof whiteboards, impact-resistant film for classroom windows, “ballistic attack resistant” door shields, armored saferooms, surveillance cameras and facial-recognition systems, software to monitor potential threats, gunshot and “aggression detector” microphones, even smoke cannons to disrupt an active shooter in progress.

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Fear sells, but all the play acting in the world doesn't mean shit when you have cornered a heavily armed shooter who wants to die. How many times had the Alvarde SWAT team deployed and dealt with a live active shooter?

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it’s the fetish of people playing with these instruments of death like they’re toys. why do they need military style weapons exactly?

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It is fantasy land and all these guys with their fucking AR platforms and rail systems and the tactical gear are little different that Civil War re-enactors.

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Originally Posted by Bunion 2020

It is fantasy land and all these guys with their fucking AR platforms and rail systems and the tactical gear are little different that Civil War re-enactors.

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Not really. But if you want to label it that then go right ahead.

Just say anyone that has an AR15 is racist. Might be easier for you.

I'm sure there's a range of motivations and use cases but I'd bet good money that the vast majority are a lot closer to Civil War re-enactors (i.e. people who like to dress up and pretend they're soldiers) than they are to SWAT team members.

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Originally Posted by Bunion 2020

How many times had the Alvarde SWAT team deployed and dealt with a live active shooter?

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I don't know the answer but I suspect mostly routine drug interdictions, nothing serious. For a small town it's probably more of a jobs program, a daycare for grown men.

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Originally Posted by ötzi

I'm sure there's a range of motivations and use cases but I'd bet good money that the vast majority are a lot closer to Civil War re-enanctors than they are to SWAT team members.

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Considering what we have seen out of the most recent SWAT team, that's nothing to aspire to.

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Originally Posted by MagnificentUnicorn

This shouldn’t be entertaining. Posters like Bobby are the epitome of our stupid gun culture, posting pictures of his blinged out “toys”. It’s disgusting, it’s not really the guns that are the problem it’s the fetish of people playing with these instruments of death like they’re toys. Bobby said he doesn’t hunt, why does he need military style weapons exactly?


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Bobby is a rich boy playing with toys. As a well schooled rich boy, he'll basically always get to. It's a distraction, especially given a significant portion is likely client relations as a seller of luxury goods in the gun mad south.
His kids don't go to public school. He doesn't have to care.
That's why it's a distraction. Sure, he's a person, but his resources etc. Are the far minority.
It's about everyone else getting together and pushing for meaningful change. That won't happen if you let yourself get hung up in the weeds.

Thanks Schuss. I appreciate that.

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Originally Posted by Bobby Stainless

Thanks Schuss. I appreciate that.

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Whatever man, just vote for the change when it comes.

Hillsboro dad goes viral for surrendering guns; here’s how to get rid of yours https://www.oregonlive.com/pacific-n...-of-yours.html

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“Today I’m turning in my weapons to the Hillsboro Police Department in Oregon,” Beers said in his video. “Both my AR-15 and my 9-mill handgun. I no longer want them.”

“I know this will not change legislation or anything to do with gun culture in America, but hopefully it’ll be a form of symbolism and hopefully America can wake up because no other country has the problems that we do with gun culture and ideation and gun violence like we do.”

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Originally Posted by ex-powderbroker

i wasn’t telling you to eat a dick, but i guess you don’t like considering other opinions. here’s how stupid you sound:


Attachment 417556

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Whoosh


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Originally Posted by Bobby Stainless

The military doesn't use a 300blk SBR.

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No shit Sherlock, I posted military style, which is what a 300BLK SBR is modeled after. Like every other AR platform weapon.


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Ah ok. My bad.

My wife has been a teacher her entire adult life.

Doors have always been locked. Again, it's a deterrent but will absolutely not stop anyone from getting in.

The resource officer at one school made it perfectly clear multiple times to many teachers that he was going home at the end of the day no matter what.

The issue is the guns. Americans and their guns.

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Originally Posted by Flounder

Gun manufacturers can’t be sued if their guns are used in a crime thanks to the Protection of Lawful Commerce in Arms Act. Really limits the cost for them. They can flood the market with lethal weapons essentially without consequences.

The Sandy Hook families got Remington by suing for their marketing campaign. Sure seems like the same law could be used against Daniels but Texas probably has even more protections for gun manufacturers.

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Are the ammosexuals good with big pharm getting the same protection for slinging opioids? They're already much more highly regulated/controlled than guns.. Yet Purdue Pharma is getting gutted by the settlements coming due. Oxy doesn't take itself..

The thought of those cops high-fiving and good-gaming each other during training contrasted against their gutlessness is something else.

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Originally Posted by Mazderati

The thought of those cops high-fiving and good-gaming each other during training contrasted against their gutlessness is something else.

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video game play acting ...

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Originally Posted by jackstraw

My wife has been a teacher her entire adult life.

Doors have always been locked. Again, it's a deterrent but will absolutely not stop anyone from getting in.

The resource officer at one school made it perfectly clear multiple times to many teachers that he was going home at the end of the day no matter what.

The issue is the guns. Americans and their guns.

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. . .

if a 'locked door' "will absolutely not stop anyone from getting in. " it is not a "deterrent" and does not sound like a locked door to me -

so let's prop the doors open, claim the Only issue is guns, drop a bunch of f* bombs and try to sound tough.

or

we could look for solutions to the problem(s) --


you'll get no argument from me that guns are part of the problem - but guns by themselves are not carrying out these massacres - this is a people problem ;

when a thread about school Safety becomes thirty pages of ' all things guns ' , we have further evidence this is a people problem.

when the ownership of assault weapons ( definition - those designed and intended for killing people. there are other definitions - we can get lost in the minutiae of arguing the definition, but let's start there > guns designed to, and intended to, kill people. )
... when the ownership of assault weapons is defended as a "valuable" investment, I would offer, one needs a better investment strategy.


so., school Safety -
I hate the term 'hardening' schools - it certainly fits the lexicon of the era, but let's try to make schools safer again.
up-thread, the idea of school Safety was dismissed as "insane." Thank you, dunfree - "stupid is, as stupid does. " (Gump)
it IS the teachers who are in the best position - and have the most to gain by taking protective measures. lock the door - Especially when the classroom is equipped with a Safety door.

these are different times, and we need to recognize society has changed -

Safety First. And always. Safety always --


I would be happy if citizens surrendered assault weapons. it ain't going to happen willingly; and it ain't going to happen anytime soon.

we can make schools safer - by September. but it requires buy-in., and it requires ,,, buy-in. parents, teachers, society, administrators, the public. students.
and one of the problems I see is schools are a current focal point for arguments about covid policy. it is sickening.
we aren't even going to be able to agree on basic, fundamental steps to enhance Safety.


lock the door. lock the door. a barrier door, Not a cylinder lock --
authorized entry Only. does one have an appointment to be there (?) authorized entry Only. lock the door

let's start there. tj


alternatively,
This is the cost of living in the gun culture -


now I see why americans live elsewhere -

I doubt I am going to do that. but If I was forty ( or twenty-five ), that might merit serious consideration.


. . . back to your Gun 'discussion' ...

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Originally Posted by ::: :::

Hillsboro dad goes viral for surrendering guns; here’s how to get rid of yours https://www.oregonlive.com/pacific-n...-of-yours.html

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Someone should make him a gofundy. I wanna buy him a beer.

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Originally Posted by jackstraw

My wife has been a teacher her entire adult life.

Doors have always been locked. Again, it's a deterrent but will absolutely not stop anyone from getting in.

The resource officer at one school made it perfectly clear multiple times to many teachers that he was going home at the end of the day no matter what.

The issue is the guns. Americans and their guns.

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The issue is parenting actually. Not guns, not mental issues, fuck the social pressure breeders. And they want to encourage that too. No you can't fuck with your body? Hits head on wall gives up. Locked and loaded. Merca.

any way you cut it people will find guns, so maybe the issue is asking why people want to kill other people and why do they think it would be a good thing ?