Talk to me about Insurance: Auto, Home, personal liability

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Originally Posted by californiagrown

State Farm just informed me that they will not be renewing homeowners on my condo, with coverage ending in about 10 days. they apparently mailed a letter back in October which i never received, and only know because my agent personally emailed me out of the blue today. the reasoning is that i filed too many claims. I have 2 water damage claims, each more than 2 years old, 1 of which was found to be the neighbors fault, and they combined total under $10k. There is no warning or notification on my online StateFarm dashboard account, and i never recieved an email until today, from my agent.

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That's similar to what happened to me with State Farm a few years ago, except mine were both theft claims on my renter's insurance (stolen bike and theft from vehicle, ~$3k each) about 18-months apart. When it came time to renew my policy State Farm declined, stating I was too great a risk. Turns out with two claims within the last five years a lot of companies will not insure you. And pretty much no companies will if you have three claims in that same time frame. That's a big problem if you've got homeowner's insurance that is required for your mortgage. I was able to get a replacement renter's policy but it cost about double what I'd been paying before. So it shouldn't be a problem to get a replacement policy in time, but you may not like the price sadly.

In light of my experience, these days I would be more hesitant to make a claim for things like bike theft / car breakins unless it's for a huge amount like multiple new bikes at once. Just not worth the risk of being dropped if you are misfortunate enough to have to make another claim. As someone else mentioned, self-insure by putting a bit of money away each month for theft type claims. Go with a higher deductible on renters/homeowners policy and add the savings to your insurance fund.

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Originally Posted by J. Barron DeJong

You gonna trust this dude!? Next thing you know you’ll be under federal investigation! :fm:

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IDK, he was quick and helpful with a quote. The only weird thing was he did ask me to upload pictures and provide the condition of my condo, car and wife?




*kidding about the last part*

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Originally Posted by evdog

That's similar to what happened to me with State Farm a few years ago, except mine were both theft claims on my renter's insurance (stolen bike and theft from vehicle, ~$3k each) about 18-months apart. When it came time to renew my policy State Farm declined, stating I was too great a risk. Turns out with two claims within the last five years a lot of companies will not insure you. And pretty much no companies will if you have three claims in that same time frame. That's a big problem if you've got homeowner's insurance that is required for your mortgage. I was able to get a replacement renter's policy but it cost about double what I'd been paying before. So it shouldn't be a problem to get a replacement policy in time, but you may not like the price sadly.

In light of my experience, these days I would be more hesitant to make a claim for things like bike theft / car breakins unless it's for a huge amount like multiple new bikes at once. Just not worth the risk of being dropped if you are misfortunate enough to have to make another claim. As someone else mentioned, self-insure by putting a bit of money away each month for theft type claims. Go with a higher deductible on renters/homeowners policy and add the savings to your insurance fund.

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Yep, live and learn. Sucks that an upstairs neighbor flooding their own and my condo reflects poorly on me. Oh well.

And FWIW, the insurance quote that Gordon.Lighty offered me upthread was very much in line with what i was paying previously, so maybe check in with him about a quote? Dont they say that the majority of people could save by shopping around for insurance every few years, but most people dont because its a PITA?

Insurance companies are fine with taking your money each month, for years and years, and encouraging you to increase your coverage - as long as you don’t make any claims.

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Originally Posted by billyk

Insurance companies are fine with taking your money each month, for years and years, and encouraging you to increase your coverage - as long as you don’t make any claims.

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This. I know many mags here are brokers or agents, but eff me... it seems so scammy.

I guess State Farm needs all that extra money to pay for endless ads and to pay Chris Paul's endorsement.

Insurance companies are not in business to lose money. I have had a few issues on the rentals over the years and never even considered calling USAA, as the damage was $2k-$3k to repair in each instance and I can deal with that.

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Originally Posted by liv2ski

Insurance companies are not in business to lose money. I have had a few issues on the rentals over the years and never even considered calling USAA, as the damage was $2k-$3k to repair in each instance and I can deal with that.

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Which again, is frustrating. You pay into it, sometimes a healthy amount, and then when you need it? Sorry, your coverage has been dropped. Fuckers.

I hear ya, but you need to use it only if the claim is $$$$

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Originally Posted by Bobcat Sig

This. I know many mags here are brokers or agents, but eff me... it seems so scammy.

I guess State Farm needs all that extra money to pay for endless ads and to pay Chris Paul's endorsement.

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Like anything, good and bad brokers. G Gordon is one of the good ones.

Insurance companies...if they were not scammy, those brokers wouldn't have jobs.

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Originally Posted by liv2ski

Insurance companies are not in business to lose money.

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Yes but the standard industry line is "wE mAkE $$$ oN fLoAt noT bY deNyIng clAims."

Yeah fucking right. I have literally had insurance companies issue new company-wide exclusions when I have sued them to make them pay claims they are obligated to pay.

Timely thread - had a car broken into and laptop, backpack, outdoor gear, etc stolen. Figured auto insurance would cover it, nope. That's renters (not applicable) or homeowners (me). (USAA for what it's worth)
But man this thread and other googling REALLY has me discouraged from filing a homeowners claim on this. Sounds like best case my premiums could go up, for a sufficiently long period of time, by a sum that would be nearing the claim coverage. Worst case is I'm then dropped if I need to file a claim for a large scale event in the future. What a fucked industry.
So to cover these types of theft that are practically sizeable, but not worth jeopardizing my home - what can you do? Get renters insurance on top of homeowners? Get extra coverage (rider?) for all big ticket items you'd fear losing? Or as suggested above, self insure?

Any mags in insurance in CO? My auto is up and homeowners is up early next year. I should shop around. Current provider keeps going up.

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Originally Posted by TripleT

Timely thread - had a car broken into and laptop, backpack, outdoor gear, etc stolen. Figured auto insurance would cover it, nope. That's renters (not applicable) or homeowners (me). (USAA for what it's worth)
But man this thread and other googling REALLY has me discouraged from filing a homeowners claim on this. Sounds like best case my premiums could go up, for a sufficiently long period of time, by a sum that would be nearing the claim coverage. Worst case is I'm then dropped if I need to file a claim for a large scale event in the future. What a fucked industry.
So to cover these types of theft that are practically sizeable, but not worth jeopardizing my home - what can you do? Get renters insurance on top of homeowners? Get extra coverage (rider?) for all big ticket items you'd fear losing? Or as suggested above, self insure?

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Sorry to hear. You won't necessarily get a premium increase when you submit a single claim. I didn't....might depend on the company. So the best case is you file a claim and nothing at all happens.

But the second part is true. If you do submit a claim here you risk getting dropped if you have a second claim within 5 years. Not all companies do that, but some definitely will.

I'd be interested to know more about getting a separate policy for other assets too. Mainly, if you make a claim against a rider or other separate policy could this also lead your homeowner/renter's policy getting dropped? If so, there's not much point.

Then there is the question of what to cover. I assume it could only be specific valuable items like bikes, jewelry, etc and not an itemized list of all my outdoor gear that "adds up to a lot." That's basically what got taken when my truck was broken into.

Aside from bikes my most valuable asset likely to be stolen is a laptop. But it's 3 yrs old and will need to be replaced in a year or so regardless. So even though its replacement cost is high, it's not worth getting covered.

Any insurance experts want to talk to me about “efficient proximate cause”? I am 2.5 months into a major claim on a landlord policy. I have had 2 field inspections and 4 claims representatives. Now they (Safeco) want to send a third party geotechnical engineer to look at my property. Basically the uphill house got knocked off its foundation by a tree and is now sitting on my property. How long do I sit tight and when do I call a lawyer?


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Originally Posted by bigt

Any insurance experts want to talk to me about “efficient proximate cause”? I am 2.5 months into a major claim on a landlord policy. I have had 2 field inspections and 4 claims representatives. Now they (Safeco) want to send a third party geotechnical engineer to look at my property. Basically the uphill house got knocked off its foundation by a tree and is now sitting on my property. How long do I sit tight and when do I call a lawyer?


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Was the offending tree on your property?

No. Tree came for city property up hill of both properties. Uphill house is destroyed But also on my house. My place is the yellow house in pano in next post. Blue house is one in off foundation.


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Originally Posted by bigt

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Damn. That's a big tree, bigt.

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Originally Posted by bigt

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I would be talking to an insurance attorney. That’s going to be a big claim and some legal guidance will likely pay for itself.

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Originally Posted by bigt

Any insurance experts want to talk to me about “efficient proximate cause”? I am 2.5 months into a major claim on a landlord policy. I have had 2 field inspections and 4 claims representatives. Now they (Safeco) want to send a third party geotechnical engineer to look at my property. Basically the uphill house got knocked off its foundation by a tree and is now sitting on my property. How long do I sit tight and when do I call a lawyer?


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Tell me more about your claim. Are you making a liability claim against the municipality or is this your own carrier? We can go offline if you prefer.

Lawyer up for sure on something that big. I had a very simple $10k water damage claim with Safeco and it was total shit show, most incompetent people I have ever dealt with on a "professional level". All the internal adjusters I worked with were contractors working off a script and anything that wasn't on it was a dead end. Only bright spot was the field inspector (also a contractor) who was honest and said the hourly rates they used are not in line with my area and to press them for difference in payment.
It took 4 months to get paid on something that should have taken 2-3 days. I think I spent more time dealing with the Insurance company than dealing with the repairs.

Years ago we were sued by the doctor/self-taught contractor who bought the house next to us and attempted to remodel it with undocumented labor--lead paint and asbestos abatement done without any protection and tossed in the regular dumpster, a shop placed in a shipping container and powered by unshielded romex under the steel door. We reported to the city but nothing was done, eventually the FD inspector saw the "shop" and waited for the PUD to arrive and turn off the power to the lot. City then ordered the remains to be bulldozed. The asshole doctor sued us for tattling on him.

At the time the case was covered by our SF umbrella policy (not any more). SF referred us to to an auto liability lawyer who missed a deadline to get punitive damages removed. So we hired an insurance specialist lawyer who got SF to settle for less than the asshole's costs and legal fees, because of the risk of punitive damages. Well worth the few thousand we paid the lawyer. (We also hired a real estate attorney to deal with the fake survey the asshole had done which would have moved the property line to within 3 feet of our house. She got the survey unrecorded as part of the settlement, which turned out to be huge. More about this later.)

(We've had shitty luck with neighbors. Probably karma for owning a Super Reverb, a table saw, and a yappy dog who hates being alone.)



Or to make a long story short, get a lawyer. Maybe you and whoever owns the white house can share the cost. And maybe the owner of the blue house as well.

^ In reply to this and the preceding posts, lawyers have a completely different take on the pros and cons of insurance companies vs. us civilians.

The good/bad divide is kind of like this: ins. cos that treat lawyers good and claimants bad, and those that treat lawyers bad and claimants good. Also there's an across the board dislike in all ways for any ins. cos. that advertise on television and streaming channels, Liberty Mutual, Geico, The General, Big Lou, etc.

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Originally Posted by bigt

Any insurance experts want to talk to me about “efficient proximate cause”? I am 2.5 months into a major claim on a landlord policy. I have had 2 field inspections and 4 claims representatives. Now they (Safeco) want to send a third party geotechnical engineer to look at my property. Basically the uphill house got knocked off its foundation by a tree and is now sitting on my property. How long do I sit tight and when do I call a lawyer?


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By a tree!? Looks like a bunch of trees, and dirt and part of the hillside above you, almost like the earth moved and land slid down the hill…. Which could have been caused by a sudden rush of surface water, or flood…

I’m not an attorney nor licensed adjuster. My lay understanding is…. Efficient proximate cause means that whatever set off the chain reaction is the cause of loss. I.e. if a landslide caused that tree to fall the cause of loss is landslide, not “tree fell”. If an earthquake causes a heavy object to fall and crush part of your house the cause of loss is earthquake not “object fell”.

Most policies do not cover “earth movement” unless you have landslide insurance or other special insurance. From the pictures it looks like they are trying to determine if a landslide / earth movement caused the tree to fall. If so, you are probably not covered or have a very high deductible or very low limit.

My advice would be to immediately retain an attorney that specializes in insurance, they will delay the inspection and formulate a plan. I would not let the geotechnical inspector proceed until you retain counsel.

Do not hire a public adjuster, that will just increase the percentage you are paying to representation. You want an attorney for this one. If you hire a public adjuster they will want 10-20% of the claim value. The attorney may want 30-40%. The attorney can hire an adjuster or surveyor to do the scope and pricing of the damages and pay them hourly. I’ve seen insureds stack the two (hires a PA but then needed an attorney) and end up with 40% of their claim.

My guess is that you are probably screwed. I’m guessing you didn’t get insurance that covers land slides because that shit is expensive and this is a rental property. Your insurance carrier had 0 intention of insuring against landslide and that is likely made quite clear in your policy. And that shit looks like a landslide, but it’s only one crappy picture. However, there is a chance that your insurance company will screw up, or your attorney will be able to cause enough uncertainty to get them to settle. Lawsuits are really expensive for insurance companies.

Your attorney will know this but you may want to sue your agent / broker. If you can show it wasn’t offered or something you maybe able to sue them too. I’d go gather all documents you have about the insurance placement.

You’ll probably have a good idea of your chances when you meet with the attorney. If they want you to pay them hourly you know they think you’re fucked too.


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