espresso making mags?

2. Stick with the 2 cup filter and stick with the same bean until you’re good with #1. The 1cup filter is good for descaling with the rubber plug thing.
3. Come back in when you decide to up your game. The next (cheap) step will be the traditional unpressurized filter basket. That’s when you might start questioning your grinder. Honestly, the Breville grinds well and definitely fine enough. But not having a stepless adjustment can be a challenge if you start upping your game. And mine gets clumpy, so I used a fork to loosen up distribution.


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Looking to get back into the game. I need a new espresso machine! Looking for something on the prosumer side of things, but of course the cheaper the better. It needs to be able to be plumbed in, open to dual boiler or heat exchanger-- no lever machines, Ive been down that road before and couldn't get consistent good results. The smaller the footprint the better-- I've got plenty of counter space to be honest but the wife will be happier if it isn't gigantic.

Do I go all out for a dual boiler Profitec Pro 700? Are these high end machines really worth the upgrade over for instance, the dual boiler Rancilio Silvia Pro X? Or maybe there is a slightly smaller footprint heat exchange machine that can be plumbed in that'll do me just as good? The wife loves frothy drinks, I mainly just do double shots no milk for myself

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Originally Posted by jm2e

2. Stick with the 2 cup filter and stick with the same bean until you’re good with #1. The 1cup filter is good for descaling with the rubber plug thing.
3. Come back in when you decide to up your game. The next (cheap) step will be the traditional unpressurized filter basket. That’s when you might start questioning your grinder. Honestly, the Breville grinds well and definitely fine enough. But not having a stepless adjustment can be a challenge if you start upping your game. And mine gets clumpy, so I used a fork to loosen up distribution.


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Yeah, the breville is a good grinder, especially considering the price. I have no idea why I can't get a shot longer than 15 seconds with it in my machine.

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Originally Posted by couloirman

Looking to get back into the game. I need a new espresso machine! Looking for something on the prosumer side of things, but of course the cheaper the better. It needs to be able to be plumbed in, open to dual boiler or heat exchanger-- no lever machines, Ive been down that road before and couldn't get consistent good results. The smaller the footprint the better-- I've got plenty of counter space to be honest but the wife will be happier if it isn't gigantic.

Do I go all out for a dual boiler Profitec Pro 700? Are these high end machines really worth the upgrade over for instance, the dual boiler Rancilio Silvia Pro X? Or maybe there is a slightly smaller footprint heat exchange machine that can be plumbed in that'll do me just as good? The wife loves frothy drinks, I mainly just do double shots no milk for myself

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Give this thread a read through. There is tons of great info in here and it’s a quick read. Pay particular attention to tgapp posts - if you’re short on time then just read those posts.

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Originally Posted by jm2e

2. Stick with the 2 cup filter and stick with the same bean until you’re good with #1. The 1cup filter is good for descaling with the rubber plug thing.
3. Come back in when you decide to up your game. The next (cheap) step will be the traditional unpressurized filter basket. That’s when you might start questioning your grinder. Honestly, the Breville grinds well and definitely fine enough. But not having a stepless adjustment can be a challenge if you start upping your game. And mine gets clumpy, so I used a fork to loosen up distribution.

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Thanks for the tips! Almost everyone in the comments of the reviews has been saying how while the included pressurized filter's been good for consistent, fool-proof results, the unpressurized filter basket you can pick up from Breville helps get achieve the longer drip some are looking for and many are reporting superior results by making that switch. Think I'll order one since it seems that no matter how much or little I pack into the puck, the results seem pretty identical. GOOD by my standards, but now I'm wanting to play around a bit more and see what else I can do.

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Originally Posted by mattig

Yeah, the breville is a good grinder, especially considering the price. I have no idea why I can't get a shot longer than 15 seconds with it in my machine.

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Do you have the same espresso machine I do? (Bambino Plus) I can't get longer than either. From what I'm learning, I think it boils down to that included filter basket. Guess I'll buy a new one and see what happens. Really cheap straight from Breville (like $6), but apparently perpetually sold out according to lots of comments I've read. :( https://www.breville.com/us/en/parts...sp0001520.html

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Originally Posted by MontuckyFried

Do you have the same espresso machine I do? (Bambino Plus) I can't get longer than either. From what I'm learning, I think it boils down to that included filter basket. Guess I'll buy a new one and see what happens. Really cheap straight from Breville (like $6), but apparently perpetually sold out according to lots of comments I've read. :( https://www.breville.com/us/en/parts...sp0001520.html

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Interesting. No I have a different machine--one that should theoretically be able to get a longer shot time as it's a triple basket 53mm group head (more narrow than the benchmark 58mm). I can easily get 20g of coffee into the thing and still get underextracted shots with the Breville. I dialed down my factory pressure just slightly, so I'm at about 8.7 bars, building to 8.9 throughout the extraction. Preinfusion doesn't help. I moved on to a buy-once-cry-once grinder and now I am a very small turn of the dial away from completely blocking the flow. Wife endorsed the purchase as it doesn't wake her up in the morning. On the downside, my kid can't go to college without a scholarship, but... priorities...

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Originally Posted by mattig

I can easily get 20g of coffee into the thing and still get underextracted shots with the Breville. I dialed down my factory pressure just slightly, so I'm at about 8.7 bars, building to 8.9 throughout the extraction. Preinfusion doesn't help.

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Pre-infusion you say? I have not been doing that. I know you say that didn't help but tell me more! Maybe it'll help me get longer shots. [Dunning-Kruger effect intensifies]

The preinfusion is automatic with the Bambino. It's a period of lower pressure before full pressure. You should be able to hear the difference. The preinfusion lasts around 5-10 seconds I think.

As far as filter baskets go, there's no reason the double wall basket would keep you from getting a longer extraction time. What it does is allows more pressure to build even if your grind is too coarse, your dose is too small, and/or your tamp is too light. It sets a bottom limit on pressure and extraction time, not an upper limit.

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Originally Posted by MontuckyFried

Thanks for the tips! Almost everyone in the comments of the reviews has been saying how while the included pressurized filter's been good for consistent, fool-proof results, the unpressurized filter basket you can pick up from Breville helps get achieve the longer drip some are looking for and many are reporting superior results by making that switch. Think I'll order one since it seems that no matter how much or little I pack into the puck, the results seem pretty identical. GOOD by my standards, but now I'm wanting to play around a bit more and see what else I can do.

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Using a non pressurized basket will shorten your brew time not increase it unless you can grind fine enough. Which I don’t think the breville grinder can.

I've been in the game long enough to be right around mid-slope-of-enlightenment on the Dunning Kruger effect (great reference btw, and applies 100% to espresso making). My current setup is a Breville dual boiler and a OE Pharos hand grinder. Have been down more rabbit holes on technique and equipment than I care to admit, but at the end of the day I am pretty happy with the results I get with this setup.

The advice in the last couple pages has been bang-on - get the basics right (grinder, weigh scale, single-wall basket) focus on the results you are getting and the consistency you are getting them, and at the end of the day if you are happy with that, be happy. If you are not happy, it can be a long and winding (expensive) road to better equipment where the law of diminishing returns kicks in pretty hard... my only advice is to focus on the grinder first, and the rest will (should) follow!

I've had lots of fun with the journey, and would not consider myself an expert, but am happy with my results 95% of the time, which is good enough for me!

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Originally Posted by mattig

Interesting. No I have a different machine--one that should theoretically be able to get a longer shot time as it's a triple basket 53mm group head (more narrow than the benchmark 58mm). I can easily get 20g of coffee into the thing and still get underextracted shots with the Breville. I dialed down my factory pressure just slightly, so I'm at about 8.7 bars, building to 8.9 throughout the extraction. Preinfusion doesn't help. I moved on to a buy-once-cry-once grinder and now I am a very small turn of the dial away from completely blocking the flow. Wife endorsed the purchase as it doesn't wake her up in the morning. On the downside, my kid can't go to college without a scholarship, but... priorities...

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By purchasing that grinder you’ve taught your kid some very important lessons. So much so that they could consider asking for college credit.

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Originally Posted by old goat

The preinfusion is automatic with the Bambino. It's a period of lower pressure before full pressure. You should be able to hear the difference. The preinfusion lasts around 5-10 seconds I think.

As far as filter baskets go, there's no reason the double wall basket would keep you from getting a longer extraction time. What it does is allows more pressure to build even if your grind is too coarse, your dose is too small, and/or your tamp is too light. It sets a bottom limit on pressure and extraction time, not an upper limit.

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Got it. Glad you know my machine! Thanks, man.

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Originally Posted by neufox47

Using a non pressurized basket will shorten your brew time not increase it unless you can grind fine enough. Which I don’t think the breville grinder can.

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I see. So much to learn.

Preinfusion and pressure tweaking and temps are all for another generation in your espresso journey.
First you need to make consistent shots with a machine that does those things for you. Once the basic variables are mastered, you can make isolated changes to experiment for different results. You’ll be surprised by how a new bean, or the tail end of a pound that’s been sitting out for 10 days can throw off the results you thought you’d mastered.
Eventually you’ll know whether this new hobby is going to go the route of cameras and bikes. And only then will you understand and appreciate why you’re upgrading something. Don’t buy an $800 dollar grinder because someone told you it would help. Buy it when you understand why it will help you achieve something specific you’re unhappy with.


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Quote:

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Originally Posted by jm2e

Preinfusion and pressure tweaking and temps are all for another generation in your espresso journey.
First you need to make consistent shots with a machine that does those things for you. Once the basic variables are mastered, you can make isolated changes to experiment for different results. You’ll be surprised by how a new bean, or the tail end of a pound that’s been sitting out for 10 days can throw off the results you thought you’d mastered.
Eventually you’ll know whether this new hobby is going to go the route of cameras and bikes. And only then will you understand and appreciate why you’re upgrading something. Don’t buy an $800 dollar grinder because someone told you it would help. Buy it when you understand why it will help you achieve something specific you’re unhappy with.


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His machine does preinfusion automatically. Neither pressure nor temperature are adjustable. So he's safe.

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Originally Posted by old goat

His machine does preinfusion automatically. Neither pressure nor temperature are adjustable. So he's safe.

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Whew! Glad that's automatic. Don't think I could handle a fancier machine as a total novice. Gotta say, though. I adjusted my grind a bit finer to 10 this morning. Did a double shot, added some hot water and steamed a bit of half & half. Don't know what that would be called but it was daaaaaaaamn good. The espresso turned out really pretty darn good on its own with making that grind tweak and it still has quite a bit further on the fine side to go if I wanted and I haven't even messed with the step adjustments on the upper burr itself either. I think the grinder will be just fine for my purposes. Maybe I shouldn't overthink this stuff just yet. Haha

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Originally Posted by MontuckyFried

Whew! Glad that's automatic. Don't think I could handle a fancier machine as a total novice. Gotta say, though. I adjusted my grind a bit finer to 10 this morning. Did a double shot, added some hot water and steamed a bit of half & half. Don't know what that would be called but it was daaaaaaaamn good. The espresso turned out really pretty darn good on its own with making that grind tweak and it still has quite a bit further on the fine side to go if I wanted and I haven't even messed with the step adjustments on the upper burr itself either. I think the grinder will be just fine for my purposes. Maybe I shouldn't overthink this stuff just yet. Haha

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Before you get too happy with your machine, wait until the lights start flashing and you have to figure out how to do a cleaning or descaling cycle.

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Originally Posted by old goat

Before you get too happy with your machine, wait until the lights start flashing and you have to figure out how to do a cleaning or descaling cycle.

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I was reading about that in the manual. About how often do you end up having to do that?

Couple times a year.
It's not a big deal actually but good luck doing it without the manual. Or you could do it freestyle but then the lights would keep flashing.

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Originally Posted by old goat

Couple times a year. t's not a big deal actually but good luck doing it without the manual. Or you could do it freestyle but then the lights would keep flashing.

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Cool. So THAT'S what those little tablets and the cleaning disc are for. Will definitely not throw away the manual.

BTW, I may have just reached my own personal coffee nirvana this morning. I dialed down the grind just a smidge more, got what looked to me like the most picture perfect espresso and made what is basically an Americano with steamed milk. I think Starbucks™ calls it an Americano Misto but there's probably a more legit name to it, right? Anyway, I'm still sipping on it and it is goddam good. I don't care what anybody says. This little machine can actually brew a damn fine drink with a bit of learning! Yeah, I'm sure there's always room for improvement and better machines and methods out there, but I have yet to have a better coffee. Two thumbs up for the Bambino Plus from this espresso noob. FACK, this drink is good!!!

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Originally Posted by MontuckyFried

Cool. So THAT'S what those little tablets and the cleaning disc are for. Will definitely not throw away the manual.

BTW, I may have just reached my own personal coffee nirvana this morning. I dialed down the grind just a smidge more, got what looked to me like the most picture perfect espresso and made what is basically an Americano with steamed milk. I think Starbucks™ calls it an Americano Misto but there's probably a more legit name to it, right? Anyway, I'm still sipping on it and it is goddam good. I don't care what anybody says. This little machine can actually brew a damn fine drink with a bit of learning! Yeah, I'm sure there's always room for improvement and better machines and methods out there, but I have yet to have a better coffee. Two thumbs up for the Bambino Plus from this espresso noob. FACK, this drink is good!!!

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Nice to hear. I think similar many mornings, but think it could have something to do with that first fix of the day being satisfied! :)

I am very far from good at this, many posting here are, but I think what really matters in the end, you are happy with the final product!!!

Aww yeah MF.

A friend asked me a hypothetical last year - would I give up booze or coffee if I had to choose one. No question I’d give up booze - the satisfaction of the first coffee in the morning is sublime. I think he was stunned by my answer but the coffee he brews at his house is just there for the caffeine and taste is not considered.

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Originally Posted by bennymac

Aww yeah MF.

A friend asked me a hypothetical last year - would I give up booze or coffee if I had to choose one. No question I’d give up booze - the satisfaction of the first coffee in the morning is sublime. I think he was stunned by my answer but the coffee he brews at his house is just there for the caffeine and taste is not considered.

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Yeah. Tough call, but I think I'm there with ya. Growing up, my parents rocked the big cans of Folgers and have honestly never really given much of a crap about quality despite chugging pots of it per day. Now they've descended even further into even lower quality instant coffee. Funny thing is how they kind of get offended when I come over and I politely decline their offers to make me an instant coffee despite me coming in with a travel mug of my own brew. [Thanks for the gesture and all, but no thank you] I just can't stomach their stuff. They correctly think I'm a snob about this stuff. Haha.

There are some good instant coffees out there these days - but they are sold at prices that our parents would definitely deem snobbish :)

Yea, make the parents a real coffee and you may ruin them forever. I got my parents hooked on the coffee I roast and now they are always looking for more. When they come to the house there is always an afternoon cappuccino.


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